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[PlayALLtheGames]

I won't argue that not voting makes you less of a progressive. What it does make you is a selfish, apathetic, fucking asshole progressive, and at that point you may as well not be a progressive at all.

The notion that you might be so bitter with the democratic nomination, that you might contribute to America reversing course in years or even decades, just out of some personal, fucking pride, is disgusting.

I guess everyone who says this bullshit must be made; someone who won't really be affected whether the president is someone like Trump or someone like Hillary? Right? That's the only explanation.

Otherwise, stop being a prick. You can either commit to making change, over time, with a person who is at least somewhat reasonable, or you could cross your arms and pout like a fucking child.

 

[HUELEN10]

I can only speak for myself, but who get riled up about the choices of others like yourself is what makes some us want to get closer to voting Trump. You can be progressive and not like Clinton. not liking Clinton doesn't make you anything, it just means you don't like her, that's all.

I don't fully like any candidate really, the one I voted might not make it, and labels just make things worse.

 

[Team Alucard]

Hillary is not entitled to anyone's vote.

Right now I'm leaning towards not voting at all. Won't vote for Hillary, I refuse to vote for Loebsack after he sided with the GOP to block the refugees, and the Iowa Senate race is essentially irrelevant as Grassley is an immortal invincible vampire.

 

[monchi-kun]

People who get riled up about the choices of others like yourself is what makes some us want to get closer to voting Trump.

I ran this through a cool translation software. It reads:

"I have no problem stabbing myself with a spoon repeatedly"

 

[airmangataosenai]

People eventually come around. It's mainly sore feelings because it's fresh. Once Sanders concedes and endorses her things will return to normal.

 

[HUELEN10]

Hillary is not entitled to anyone's vote.

This too; no politician is.

 

[PlayALLtheGames]

Hillary is not entitled to anyone's vote.

Nobody is entitled to anyone's vote.

The only thing that matters is what you care about.

What do you care about?

 

[Rival]

I guess I'm glad I don't consider myself progressive.

 

[AxeMan]

Would you prefer someone to not vote or vote for Trump?

I don't get Americans and their political fervour

 

[Koodo]

I can only speak for myself, but who get riled up about the choices of others like yourself is what makes some us want to get closer to voting Trump.

Only makes you an over-priviledged white male with little sympathy for minorities, but okay.

 

[DragonSworne]

There is merit in punishing the Democratic Party. Republicans do it all the time. When they don't get their way, they put through an even MORE conservative candidate while Democrats compromise and put through a right of the center candidate...

People should be anger there is no liberal party in America.

 

[RootCause]

Well I'm sure this will help bring all the Bernie supporters in line. Thankfully this won't be the approach that sweeps the nation.

 

[zoozilla]

People who don't vote are FUCKS.

Seriously, FUCK YOU NON-VOTERS. I HATE YOU.




Complaining about the government is a privilege reserved for those who take the minimum amount of effort it takes to vote in the general and mid-term elections. If you don't vote, YOU DON'T GET TO SAY SHIT. YOUR OPINION DOESN'T MATTER! That's the message you send when you don't vote.



Ugh. This is the one thing that ticks me off more than any other.

 

[PantherLotus]

Hillary is not entitled to anyone's vote.

Right now I'm leaning towards not voting at all. Won't vote for Hillary, I refuse to vote for Loebsack after he sided with the GOP to block the refugees, and the Iowa Senate race is essentially irrelevant as Grassley is an immortal invincible vampire.

Congrats on your vote for Trump.

 

[Pamplemousse]

I've never heard anyone say this.

 

[HUELEN10]

Nobody is entitled to anyone's vote.

The only thing that matters is what you care about.

What do you care about?

Flat taxes and Biden, but Carson and Biden aren't running, so anti-TPP it is for me.

What do YOU care about?

Not that it matters, not what I care for matters; we all have different cares and needs, and at the end of the day, you gotta look out for numero uno, and if possible, do it with fucking over others the least, regardless of who you vote for.

Only makes you an over-priviledged white male with little sympathy for minorities, but okay.

Except no.

 

[Kaiterra]

If you don't get out and support the candidate who is closest to your values, even if he or she isn't perfect, then you might as well be voting for the one that opposes them.

 

[Tesseract]

People who don't vote are FUCKS.

Seriously, FUCK YOU NON-VOTERS. I HATE YOU.




Complaining about the government is a privilege reserved for those who take the minimum amount of effort it takes to vote in the general and mid-term elections. If you don't vote, YOU DON'T GET TO SAY SHIT. YOUR OPINION DOESN'T MATTER! That's the message you send when you don't vote.



Ugh. This is the one thing that ticks me off more than any other.

Nope, you can not vote and still successfully say shit

 

[richiek]

People eventually come around. It's mainly sore feelings because it's fresh. Once Sanders concedes and endorses her things will return to normal.

This.

Same shit happened in 2008 when hardcore Hillary supporters vowed not to vote for Obama.

 

[McDougles]

It's weird to see the number of threads circling this logic and bemoaning it way outnumber the threads sharing this point of view.

Canadian, for disclosure, but this "I'm a Democrat but I can't be bothered to vote in the mid-term elections" shit is wayyyyyy more stale. Unless you're in the sub-36%, most of which are older people.

 

[Barajas_201]

People who vote for Hillary are not progressives, at best centrists.

 

[bachikarn]

Why do some 'liberals' seem to dislike Hilary?

 

[danm999]

There is merit in punishing the Democratic Party. Republicans do it all the time. When they don't get their way, they put through an even MORE conservative candidate while Democrats compromise and put through a right of the center candidate...

Why would the Democrats ever want to emulate the dysfunction occuring on the right?

 

[Hellsing321]

There is merit in punishing the Democratic Party. Republicans do it all the time. When they don't get their way, they put through an even MORE conservative candidate while Democrats compromise and put through a right of the center candidate...

The way the conservatives put through even even more conservative canidates is from the bottom up in local off year elections which is the best way to do it.

 

[monchi-kun]

People eventually come around. It's mainly sore feelings because it's fresh. Once Sanders concedes and endorses her things will return to normal.

How did the Hillary supporters do when she conceded to Obama?

 

[ugaboga232]

I won't argue that not voting makes you less of a progressive. What it does make you is a selfish, apathetic, fucking asshole progressive, and at that point you may as well not be a progressive at all.

The notion that you might be so bitter with the democratic nomination, that you might contribute to America reversing course in years or even decades, just out of some personal, fucking pride, is disgusting.

I guess everyone who says this bullshit must be made; someone who won't really be affected whether the president is someone like Trump or someone like Hillary? Right? That's the only explanation.

Otherwise, stop being a prick. You can either commit to making change, over time, with a person who is at least somewhat reasonable, or you could cross your arms and pout like a fucking child.

Not that I'm going to not vote for hillary, but you should try to understand and empathize why people would not want to vote for hillary or even vote for trump (ASSUMING THEY AREN"T JUST SEXIST AND RACIST AND SHITTY which is a significant portion of those voters but still).

Why I surmise is that Hillary, while a great and experienced candidate, will not change the status quo heavily. We won't regress, but significant change will not happen. She may set up the stage for further sanders with good SC picks but chances are they may also not be amenable to changes in the political/electoral systems which could foment "real change" (whatever that is). A vote for trump would be like jacking the heat on the boiling pot with a frog in it, enough that people realize how crappy the inherent system is and vote for change away from FPTP and crappy campaign finance.

Tl;dr some people think politics as usual or trusting in the system to fix/destroy it self won't ever work and we need a drastic shock to everyone's system to reboot things. And some people are asses but that isn't really news.

I would also wager that many of these people are more worried about class based problems which are more entrenched into the system itself (FPTP favors 2 wealthy powerful parties) whereas more identity politics/intersectionally motivated voters will happily embrace hillary. Its probably safer to vote for hillary because of the supreme court but I can empathize that think that hillary will stabilize a system that is pretty shitty and will run into some existential issues once automation really takes off and things get ~weird~ soon.

 

[PantherLotus]

Why do some 'liberals' seem to dislike Hilary?

The two types I know:

1. Old misogynists

2. Young Bernie-ites who seriously don't understand what 8 years of Bush did to this country.

 

[Tesseract]

This.

Same shit happened in 2008 when hardcore Hillary supporters vowed not to vote for Obama.

The lines are different, Hillary and Sanders are completely different animals. Healthcare and education are human rights, neoliberalism is doomed.

N b4 93%

 

[gutter_trash]

 

[Thatonemoor]

I forsee constructive and meaningful arguments coming from this thread.

On a serious note I'm a sanders supporter but I'll vote for Hillary in the general if she wins the nomination. Still want Bernie to win though.

 

[zoozilla]

Nope, you can not vote and still successfully say shit

Yeah, but I'll hate you. Don't make me hate you, Tesseract.

I don't even care if people don't vote for Hillary out of spite. Write in "Karl Marx's ghost" for all I care. I just hate it when people go on and on about how terrible the government is or whatever when they never use the established means through which you can influence how government is run!

 

[timetokill]

Congrats on your vote for Trump.

Utter nonsense.

 

[FriedConsole]

I've never heard anyone say this.

Yep. People might have said that in another election if the opposition wasn't Trump.

It is probably much more on the other side. I have life long Republicans friends and relatives that aren't going to vote for Trump and just abstain unless there is a sudden third party. You are living in a echo chamber if you don't see Trump is massively unliked by a good portion of conservatives.

 

[HUELEN10]

How did the Hillary supporters do when she conceded to Obama?

Most around me didn't vote as I've recently learned.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Numbers are telling us they weren't voting anyway.

We'll see what's really good in November

 

[HylianTom]

You will never get anyone here to successfully explain how turning-over SCOTUS to the GOP for a generation would help further progressive goals.

If you're willing to stick a judicial ice pick into Bernie's vision for a generation, you weren't all that serious about his issues to begin with. You're more about the man than his stated ideals. It'd be the honorable and honest thing to just come out and admit that you're voting personality over policy.

And now that I've said this, let's wait for the crickets, shall we?

 

[chaosblade]

I don't get why people personalize political races.

I mean, I don't really like Hillary, but I'll gladly vote for her over the alternative since her views are closer to my own and that's ultimately what matters.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

I can only speak for myself, but who get riled up about the choices of others like yourself is what makes some us want to get closer to voting Trump.

People are making me mad, I'll show em by voting for Trump. Great logic there.

Flat taxes and Biden, but Carson and Biden aren't running, so anti-TPP it is for me.

You support flat taxes; i.e. regressive taxation? Damn.

 

[richiek]

Why I surmise is that Hillary, while a great and experienced candidate, will not change the status quo heavily. We won't regress, but significant change will not happen. She may set up the stage for further sanders with good SC picks but chances are they may also not be amenable to changes in the political/electoral systems which could foment "real change" (whatever that is). A vote for trump would be like jacking the heat on the boiling pot with a frog in it, enough that people realize how crappy the inherent system is and vote for change away from FPTP and crappy campaign finance.

Seriously, people who have this "I'm voting for Trump so the whole system burns down" mentality just pisses me off.

 

[Primethius]

I can only speak for myself, but who get riled up about the choices of others like yourself is what makes some us want to get closer to voting Trump. You can be progressive and not like Clinton. not liking Clinton doesn't make you anything, it just means you don't like her, that's all.

I don't fully like any candidate really, the one I voted might not make it, and labels just make things worse.

I'm sorry. My mind can't seem to understand how voting for Trump remotely makes you a progressive.

All that shit says is the opposite, that you didn't care for Bernie's message to begin with.

Edit: And people who are anti-establishment (aka jumping from Bernie to Trump) can go screw themselves).

 

[Mushroomer25]

People who vote for Hillary are not progressives, at best centrists.

A vote for Hillary is a vote for multiple Supreme Court nominations that are at least liberal-leaning. If Sanders has a successor run in 2024, that's who they need to ensure anything they suggest sticks around.

Especially considering the alternative, not voting for her is a direct vote against the interests a progressive would support. That's just the reality of the choice.

 

[Varna]

I prefer Bernie too, but it just isn't going to happen and I'm sure as hell not going to contribute in any way to the possibility of a Republican president. She has good qualities and I'm going to focus on those because there quiet literally isn't another alternative.

 

[HUELEN10]

People are making me mad, I'll show em by voting for Trump. Great logic there.

That's not the case. It's more of if Clinton gets it, I believe my now former party made a mistake, and if I don't vote I don't care, but I DO care, so I might have to fix that mistake myself come Election Day.

People like OP make me care, they don't make me mad.

and why count Bernie out already? Let's wait a bit.

 

[Hazmat]

How did the Hillary supporters do when she conceded to Obama?

Well, about half the party voted for her in a hotly contested primary and then Obama went on to win by a large margin (for US presidential elections) in the fall. What do you think they did?

Also, stop giving these people attention. It's exactly what they want.

 

[Sami+]

Only makes you an over-priviledged white male with little sympathy for minorities, but okay.

^

Bet all the people deciding not to vote at all because Sanders didn't win wouldn't be all that affected by a Republican. Maybe I should've considered being born white, this whole being Arab thing makes half the presidential candidates fucking terrifying.

 

[Malfunky]

People who don't vote are FUCKS.

Seriously, FUCK YOU NON-VOTERS. I HATE YOU.




Complaining about the government is a privilege reserved for those who take the minimum amount of effort it takes to vote in the general and mid-term elections. If you don't vote, YOU DON'T GET TO SAY SHIT. YOUR OPINION DOESN'T MATTER! That's the message you send when you don't vote.



Ugh. This is the one thing that ticks me off more than any other.

Okay.

So what are you doing when there isn't an election around the corner? Are you involved in activism at all? Are you involved in union organizing? Political education of any kind? Helping exploited workers in any capacity? Aiding in a direct way any underprivileged communities? Are you out there fighting for anyone's rights, let alone your own? Are you taking any agency over your political and social existence or do you just get a self-righteous bug up your ass every few years when you can perform in the lowest-common-denominator of political participation in merely voting?

I'm not going to vote unless a Republican is in any position to take my state, California. Which isn't going to happen.

My political autonomy is more to me than a vote in a rigged system.

So, fuck you too.

 

[ugaboga232]

Seriously, people who have this whole "I'm voting for Trump so the whole system burns down" mentality just pisses me off.

Oh I'm not agreeing with the logic, im just mentioning it. For some people, it sounds super stupid because a lot of people will get screwed for a while. For other people, who may be getting screwed and won't be getting unscrewed by a hillary presidency, burning down the system to move toward more of a european society with better safety nets may be preferable.

 

[GnawtyDog]

Why give them so much attention. They want to be convinced to vote for Hillary while at the same time staying firm. Best bait if I've seen one in ages........

They get shamed to death rinse and repeat....all about that purity and self-importance. Fact is they are a minority and won't matter this coming election. Vote Jill Stein or withhold.....your right. They do not however, have a realistic rationale to stand on, and I've yet to see one make the argument and not come out looking like an idiot - no offense intended.

 

[FriedConsole]

I'm sorry. My mind can't seem to understand how voting for Trump remotely makes you a progressive.

All that shit says is the opposite, that you didn't care for Bernie's message to begin with.

That is the dream of the ultra left for capitalism to fall so they can build the dream utopian communial society. Trump might get America to collapse which they have been hoping for decades.

 

[Pryce]

I won't vote for Hillary, but I live in a deep red state that has no chance of turning blue. If the polls come November are close I'd vote for her over Trump.

Is that fair or am I an asshole still?