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How big of a leap will next gen be?
- Thread starter FStubbs
- Start date
Stuart360
Member
30fps will always be the standard on consoles, regradless of how powerful they are. The only way we will ever get 60fps as standard (nevermind 120fps lol) is if Microsoft and Sony mandated that all games had to be 60fps, and they are never going to do that.
MightySquirrel
Banned
The standard for next gen might as well be the usual 30 fps and then 60 fps for a few games [on regular tv] and 45-60 refresh mode for VRR capable tv's. Even at locked 45 fps freesync feels about the same as 60 fps locked with v-sync. [below 45 hz vrr doesn't work well or look good]
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
What does BC have to do with Sony releasing a console at the same time as MS and it being more powerful when people always assume it will be weaker?
despite the fact PlayStation has always been more powerful at time of release compared to competitors.
Fbh
Member
Don't know about teraflops and numbers but I think that because of the the Ps4 Pro and specially the X1X it won't seem as big.
At least graphically I'm not expecting major upgrades compared to the best looking current games, but I do expect them to hit 4K more consistently and still have some noticeable but not mindblowing upgrades.
My real hope is that they don't cheap out with the CPU's and that a lot of the changes aren't just limited to the visuals
You probably haven't played any last gen games on last gen hardware recently if you think the difference with this gen is Tiny and shitty.
I'll admit it wasn't a major shift like going from 2D to 3D or from SD to HD but it was still very noticeable
At least graphically I'm not expecting major upgrades compared to the best looking current games, but I do expect them to hit 4K more consistently and still have some noticeable but not mindblowing upgrades.
My real hope is that they don't cheap out with the CPU's and that a lot of the changes aren't just limited to the visuals
You probably haven't played any last gen games on last gen hardware recently if you think the difference with this gen is Tiny and shitty.
I'll admit it wasn't a major shift like going from 2D to 3D or from SD to HD but it was still very noticeable
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Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Banned
xbox one is 1.3Teraflops. IT is said 7nm tech allows xbox one performance for under 10W. The new consoles will likely have 150+W power budget. Energy wise they have alot of room. Question is how much silicon can they realistically buy at 7nm? A MCM approach would definitely help reduce costs over monolithic, but it is said that may not be in the cards.
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Darius87
Member
Nvidia Tflops can't be better then AMD Tflops it's all the same, it's architecture which Nvidia has better also drivers, but that logic doesn't work comapring PC gpu to Consoles gpu.
That's about right 2X more or less of OneX performance, and far superior Cpu for 399$ most likely. but don't look at OneX as example, because you'll never see true potential of that console.
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recma12
Member
I'm not talking RDR1 on a 2010 xbox 360 vs RDR2 on a One X. Yeah that difference is huge.
I'm specifically talking about games like Titanfall, Assassins Creed Black Flag and CoD Ghosts in 2013. There were only minor differences between the 360 and One version.
Example
The difference between PSPro and One X compared to whatever launches in 2020 will be just as small.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I would think if they have the power why not push games past 60 fps for next gen?
Even this gen there are some games that have uncapped frames. Rainbow Six Siege terrorist hunt comes to mind where at one time you could play this at 120 fps on the Xbox One X.
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Stuart360
Member
Every game on the PS1 could of been 60fps, its not just down to power. Devs will always push eye candy over framerate on consoles, except for a few games every year.
David Ricardo
Member
So cross gen titles look worse than proper current gen games. Who would have thought...
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Fbh
Member
Well yeah those are early cross gen titles which were probably built to run well on last gen consoles and then just given a basic upgrade for current gen consoles. They basically just went into the graphics setting and moved some sliders.
Once we actually started getting games built from the ground up for the next gen: Infamous Second Son, Driveclub, AC Unity, The Witcher 3, Arkham Knight, etc, you could easily see a very clear and obvious graphical difference. And now that we are at the stage of stuff like Horizon, AC Odyssey, RDR2, Spiderman, Uncharted 4, etc the gap has only gotten bigger and yes, even on base hardware.
Titanfall, Black Flag and Ghosts were also the worst examples. Battlefield 4 not only looked much nicer but also doubled the size of teams for multiplayer and more graphically impressive games like Dragon Age just looked miles better:
So yeah. Assuming the upgrade form this to next gen is comparable to the one from last gen to current gen then yeah, I expect some early crossgen games to have slight upgrades. Probably stuff like native 4K and some slightly enhanced graphics.
But it would also mean that once we start seeing more games made for next gen the upgrade should become very obvious
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HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
I didnt really think this needed its own thread but Jason Schreier who is a News editor at Kotaku said he is 90% sure PS5 wont come out until 2020 and possibly even later.
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-and-next-xbox-launch-speculation-post-e3-2018.49214/page-247
https://www.resetera.com/threads/ps5-and-next-xbox-launch-speculation-post-e3-2018.49214/page-247
NO7
Neo Member
Is it just me or does anyone think that the new consoles should be capable of more than just 60fps?
Navi for PS5 should be somewhere around 12-15 TFlops i guess, the Ryzen Cpu clocked at around 3-3,2 Ghz and GDDR6 should be doin over 100fps or even 144fps right?!
I know its always about the preferences of the devs whether they are focusing on resolution and details or other stuff but I personally think that some devs should target the highest framerate possible at 1080p of course! I'm not talking about anything above Full HD and also not singleplayers because thats just not possible which is okay but even though consoles will always be weaker compared to PCs, they should "skip" 60fps in 2018 and focus on really high fps/performance modes but thats just me
Navi for PS5 should be somewhere around 12-15 TFlops i guess, the Ryzen Cpu clocked at around 3-3,2 Ghz and GDDR6 should be doin over 100fps or even 144fps right?!
I know its always about the preferences of the devs whether they are focusing on resolution and details or other stuff but I personally think that some devs should target the highest framerate possible at 1080p of course! I'm not talking about anything above Full HD and also not singleplayers because thats just not possible which is okay but even though consoles will always be weaker compared to PCs, they should "skip" 60fps in 2018 and focus on really high fps/performance modes but thats just me
Stuart360
Member
How many people have tv's that run at higher than 60hz though?, i'd guess not many.Is it just me or does anyone think that the new consoles should be capable of more than just 60fps?
Navi for PS5 should be somewhere around 12-15 TFlops i guess, the Ryzen Cpu clocked at around 3-3,2 Ghz and GDDR6 should be doin over 100fps or even 144fps right?!
I know its always about the preferences of the devs whether they are focusing on resolution and details or other stuff but I personally think that some devs should target the highest framerate possible at 1080p of course! I'm not talking about anything above Full HD and also not singleplayers because thats just not possible which is okay but even though consoles will always be weaker compared to PCs, they should "skip" 60fps in 2018 and focus on really high fps/performance modes but thats just me
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Xbox One/PS4 = 1.3 - 1.8 TF (~1.5)
X/Pro = 4.2 - 6.0 TF (~5, about 3x last consoles)
So X2 and Pro 2 = 15TF??? (about 3x last consoles)
Sounds too good to be true.
X/Pro = 4.2 - 6.0 TF (~5, about 3x last consoles)
So X2 and Pro 2 = 15TF??? (about 3x last consoles)
Sounds too good to be true.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
Did you even read the post you initially quoted?
I said I'm not sure they can maintain BC AND make a noticeably more powerful console.
You said "They said that about the PS4"
and they were right, the PS4 DIDN'T have BC, which was partially why it was noticeable more powerful. They coulnd't do both.
anthraticus
Banned
Knowing AAA, the games will be just as braindead if not more and a little shinier.
mango drank
Member
This ... is upsetting. There's only a small handful of games I'm looking forward to on PS4 in the next year or so. And there's little chance any new major games will be announced and released for PS4 within the next two years, before the PS5's release.
On the other hand, it gives the FFVII remake a whole extra year to actually release this gener--ppffffbbbhahahaaa I couldn't even finish that sentence.
On the other other hand, this increases the chances that Sony will have a PSVR2 ready at PS5's launch, oh boy!
Omega Supreme Holopsicon
Banned
Would they be able to get a 4+K display along with wireless headset at a reasonable price so soon?
mango drank
Member
2 years from now? I dunno, maybe? That's a hell of a long time in the tech world, especially for VR, which has so much low-hanging fruit in terms of upgrades. I only brought it up because, if the PS5 were to launch in 2019, I don't think Sony would bother releasing a meaningful update to the PSVR right at launch (the most recent PSVR hardware iteration came out just recently, in late 2017). But if the PS5 launches in 2020, Sony will probably launch right when the next Xbox does, and the PSVR2 would be a major differentiator / selling point for the PS5, assuming VR in general hasn't completely bombed by late 2020. So Sony might want to have PSVR2 ready for a 2020 launch, in some shape or form, largely for marketing reasons.
Tech-wise, I could see cheap 1800p screens ready by 2020. 1600p at a bare minimum. Wireless is a toss-up, but it might be doable.
recma12
Member
I guess there was a little misunderstanding. I assumed ya'll were talking about initial next gen improvements.
Totally agree, that after a year into a console's lifecycle it gets a lot better.
Maybe I'm biased because those were the first couple of games I got for my launch day XOne lol
Granted, NBA 2K14, Ryse and Forza looked much much nicer than any 360 games.
That said, I still remember how some of my non-gamer friends were pretty unimpressed by the Xbox One, because there really wasn't a "wow" factor.
I'm not setting myself up for disappointment heading into the next gen (likely 2020) so I expect very little.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
So you believe the PS4 was more powerful due to the sacrifice of BC?
So the lack of BC with PSX/PS2 and PS3 was simply because they had an more optimal system vs Xbox One that ran the same architecture yet has managed to support Xbox/Xbox 360 title with enhancements with the X.
bhunachicken
Member
Aiming a bit high there. 320x240 (256 in PAL regions) should be the new standard. And 512 on screen colours.
bhunachicken
Member
I think the leap will actually be quite significant, but we'll not actually see such a thing until the 3rd generation of games. So, 2-3 years after launch.
Cyberpunk 2077 and Elder Scrolls 6 will be the ones to watch. And Horizon Zero Dawn 2.
Cyberpunk 2077 and Elder Scrolls 6 will be the ones to watch. And Horizon Zero Dawn 2.
Only for the games with ray tracing. With the bonus of a solid 15 FPS. (But only on the switch 2 with the RTX Tegra 3 chip)
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Freedom Gate Co.
Banned
Objectively it will be huge by default. Good design decisions will only make it better. All other opinions don't consider where we were in 2013.
In 2013 we had the promise of substantial increases, which did not happen, 60FPS being common, which did not happen, and graphic/performance balance, which did not happen.
If Anything the Xbox One and PS4 were Super 360/ps3's at best but where not an actual leap forward just that certain areas were increased due to the hardware but almost all the same issues were present from the generation before.
By default the CPU and GPU, as well as graphical performance balance will be much better. The engines running and drawing the graphics will be more efficient, particle effects and other attention to detail features will be easier to implement. The amount of things going on at once on screen will by default be much bigger.
We will see a great improvement just based on making hardware with not nearly as outdated technology as the consoles of 2013.
So it will already be by default a leap, even with some cross-platform games. Anything else added to the hardware will just make the gap bigger. It'll likely be the first gen with 60FPS being near standard. Perhaps some mid size later games years in trying for inconsistent 120fps.
In 2013 we had the promise of substantial increases, which did not happen, 60FPS being common, which did not happen, and graphic/performance balance, which did not happen.
If Anything the Xbox One and PS4 were Super 360/ps3's at best but where not an actual leap forward just that certain areas were increased due to the hardware but almost all the same issues were present from the generation before.
By default the CPU and GPU, as well as graphical performance balance will be much better. The engines running and drawing the graphics will be more efficient, particle effects and other attention to detail features will be easier to implement. The amount of things going on at once on screen will by default be much bigger.
We will see a great improvement just based on making hardware with not nearly as outdated technology as the consoles of 2013.
So it will already be by default a leap, even with some cross-platform games. Anything else added to the hardware will just make the gap bigger. It'll likely be the first gen with 60FPS being near standard. Perhaps some mid size later games years in trying for inconsistent 120fps.
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NO7
Neo Member
absolutely not but what about monitors? a lot of people play on an high refresh monitor or would be willing to upgrade to a 144hz monitor if the games could deliver 100+ fps so they should be focusing that or at least put a performance mode in your game which supports higher frames at the cost of resolution or details.
MisterBrimstone
Member
It's gonna be such a shitty leap that everybody will be disappointed and big tech names will be thrown as if they were the new coming of Christ but obviously it won't be.
I just hope for incredible games that grip me like Dark Souls in a period in time where I thought no innovative games would ever come again.
I just hope for incredible games that grip me like Dark Souls in a period in time where I thought no innovative games would ever come again.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
Taken from the other thread the supposed PS5 leak
DreamsiclesPlz
Member
Current PCs will still be more powerful than the consoles. The consoles might throw a flashy new feature in, but unless Sony/MS think they can get away with selling Consoles for ~$1000, I don't think the leap will be incredible.
Darius87
Member
Fake!!! some amateur made on power point, design looks worse then ps4, it couldn't have 3640 streamproccesors, and doesn't need vapor cooling, guy who made this doesn't have creativity at all.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Looks like your thoughts are in line with the new PS5 leak, since it's 11.2 TF with a better CPU with 3x the RAM.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
If it does use GDDR6 or GDDR5X (which I expect it to use one of the two), then we can possibly see upwards of 800+GB/s memory bandwidth depending on the clock speeds.
As for these "slides", I think this is a mock-up someone threw together. Now wether it was done with known inside info or not, that remains to be seen.
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Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
I never said the PS4 is more powerful BECAUSE it’s not BC. I said it would be a part of it. Might only be a small part.
The PS3 BC more an issue with the PS3 architecture than anything else.
All I’m saying, is that I’m not convinced Sony can pull off both. A noticeable more powerful console AND keep BC. That’s all. My only reasoning for it is the Pro. I base my speculation on nothing else.
mariosbrother
Member
That is quite a prediction, and inherently false.
Codes 208
Member
I expect the specs of next gen is realistically going to be around 11tf (assuming it starts next year or the year after)
Not much of a leap from the mid-gens, but its more than 6x stronger than the base ps4. And without the ps4 anchoring it unlike the pro, we could still get some crazy next gen performances.
Same goes for the X, running xbox one games at 4k is cool, but I'd much rather see games that arent hindered by a potato and designed exclusively around the higher gpu.
Not much of a leap from the mid-gens, but its more than 6x stronger than the base ps4. And without the ps4 anchoring it unlike the pro, we could still get some crazy next gen performances.
Same goes for the X, running xbox one games at 4k is cool, but I'd much rather see games that arent hindered by a potato and designed exclusively around the higher gpu.