Aceofspades
Banned
Who is that? A random Reee poster?
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Who is that? A random Reee poster?
FranXico
Member
The numbers were encoded ASCII text, not actual specs. Of course they don't make sense LOL.
The only thing OB claimed so far is TF>10 for next gen consoles and tiny differences in power.
TLZ
Banned
What's this wank? Let's all buy a Pro and X and stick to them for another 7 years then. What's the point of next gen consoles?
Von Hugh
Member
KlickKlack
Banned
ups..... that new for me.
no one has FINALE DEVKITS but you and your insiders know finale spects of the end product ps5 and Scarlett?
that's magic.... I'm impressed..
Aceofspades
Banned
Apparently only guy that has Scarlett devkit is Uncle Phil. He will start developing games with his mighty precious devkit and come E3 next year, he will grace humanity with a small 3 seconds peek into this legendary devkit before hiding it again from people and developers until November 2020 when he will "Surprise" Sony and release a sole console to himself with the ultimate game he developed himself .
That would be huge megaton that will shatter Sony headquarters, and cause Mario to shave his mustache!
Mark these words !
That would be huge megaton that will shatter Sony headquarters, and cause Mario to shave his mustache!
Mark these words !
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KlickKlack
Banned
he claimed nothing... only really.. really stupid morons don't get it.
no one can disprove him.. it's simply impossible.
when on the end one console is 10TF vs 12TF another console, he can easily claim : i was speaking about devkits,
or sony/ms has changes the cpu/gpu/ram frequencies up/down...
pick what you need
to bet on ca. 10 TF is saves thing because navi you can buy today is ca. 10TF... it has nothing to do with inside knowledge... and from 10TF you can get with 1000 stupid explanations without problems to 8 or 12TF....
[only 8TF no problem : they lowered the frequency because of thermal probs... etc. 12TF no problem : the latest stepping is going great and you can get with lower APU voltage, they raise the frequency for cpu/gpu +20%]
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Last time I heard 5700xt is 7nm.
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Ar¢tos
Member
Wouldn't a 10tf to 12tf gap be much less relevant than the 1.3tf to 1.8tf we had this gen?
The extra expenses in thermals seem not worth such a gap.
I'm sure both Sony and MS have ears inside the other company (and inside AMD) and know exactly what each other is targeting. MS only needs 0.1-0.5tf more to brag about being the most powerful, no need to go overboard with costs and lower yields just for that. With every Xbox game being playable on pc (and even lockhart, X1), there is even less incentive to break the bank for a full 2tf difference.
The extra expenses in thermals seem not worth such a gap.
I'm sure both Sony and MS have ears inside the other company (and inside AMD) and know exactly what each other is targeting. MS only needs 0.1-0.5tf more to brag about being the most powerful, no need to go overboard with costs and lower yields just for that. With every Xbox game being playable on pc (and even lockhart, X1), there is even less incentive to break the bank for a full 2tf difference.
TeamGhobad
Banned
once it is revealed that this troll is fake, i want neogaf to permaban him.
it_wasn't_me
Banned
My insiders, haha, LOL. So, my insiders are Jason Schreier, Colin Moriarty, Andrew Reiner, Kleegamefan which all of them have a lot of contacts in this industry and devs who told them that PS5 is more powerful.
Target specs. That's why. All devs which have received Scarlet and PS5 devkits surely got product manual with target spec info.
But devkits are really NEAR to be final. If Phil Spencer has a Scarlet home console at home and it's usable, that means specs are done IMO.
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Fake
Member
What you expect from resetera?
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Mass Shift
Member
I always wondered what exactly compelled Klee to jump on Reset and start serving tea? Because after everything he posted it feels like we're right back to square one again.
At the very least I think we can be assured that we're not getting sub 10TF consoles. If any other late surprises develop, I hope and pray they're positive ones.
pawel86ck
Banned
So it was only a jokeAccording to the other forum (REEEEEEEEEEE)
FF2400 = Scarlett
3x3.19
5x3.21.20
10-1.14
5x4.8.5
4x6-1.9.12.4
3x3.19 i s
5x3.21.20 o u t
10-1.14 i n
5x4.8.5 t h e
4x6-1.9.12.4 w i l d
as in.... IT'S FUCKING NOTHING
. OsirisBlack only say what people here expect to hear.
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FranXico
Member
You should only trust information from MS shills. Didn't you get the memo?
No, thats the point, we are getting sub 10TF machines and he and Tom/Jason have been fed with BS.
We had this topic with Lockhart before with all insiders saying "THERE IS NO LOCKHART GUYS" only for there to be Lockhart few days after the fact.
I assume its very hard for devs to leak something to non tech people, so if they said 9TF you would have people saying its less then Navi XT, while in reality Navi 2 with RT and VRS would easily, easily beat Navi XT (and 2070 Super).
it_wasn't_me
Banned
Because incident on this forum here and exodus on new site 2 years ago. That's why. Really, a rarely few dev or insiders came back here after that.
Yep, i know. Only trust MS insiders from now on.
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THE:MILKMAN
Member
So it was only a joke
I said it was a Zodiac cipher and wondered if OB was playing us. Looks like I was right.....
No, its because he hasnt leaked a thing. Like Osiris, he is vague. No specifics except "There is NO Lockhart guys" (which was wrong BTW). I am also waiting for Jason and Tom to be wrong about TF like alot of good jurnos where in gens before. Jason NEVER got right TF amount btw, only that MS and Sony are "aiming above Stadia". It is true even with 9TF Navi without VRS and RT, let alone with it.
Also, Tom and Thurrot at least leaked dual SKU strat from MS. They also work in industry and do not post vague BS like Matt and Klee do all the time.
Only real, solid leaks, have been Kotaku Prospero, Verge/Turrot MS dual SKU and Apisak/Komachi.
These where confirmed by several insiders. Everything else is just noise.
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sonomamashine
Member
What makes you think that ?
For me it's still between 9TF - 11TF MAX, let's make it even and say 10.2TF NAVI/12.8TF GCN, it's a fair assuming 40CU & beats STADIA by a margin.
expect something really close to this and drop those crazy numbers, i'm telling you this is IT.
McHuj
Member
So it was only a joke
he could be saying that simply because it’s true.
I have a feeling if the consoles do not have full reveals before GDC next March, everything will leak By then. Too many devs and people everywhere in the production chain are getting involved now.
last time around everything was leaked by end of January 2013 (Except the 8GB DDR surprise)
Aceofspades
Banned
Some are playing silly buggers here IMO.....
Others are emotionally hurt
Mind you 10.2TF Navi with VRS, RT and some other sweetness will DEMOLISH 12.8TF GCN. Kill it. Murder it. That Navi would outperform 2080 100%.
People didnt get the memo what VRS is (that current AMD cards dont have, but consoles will have). Increase of peformance goes up to 57%, that is GIGANTIC.
I think that hypotetical 10TF card would beat 13.7TF Radeon 7 by ~30% at least.
FranXico
Member
Can you share links concerning VRS and explain why you think consoles will be getting that?
it_wasn't_me
Banned
You need to consider that Schreier said that EARLIER this year, WHEN NOBODY HAD a dev kits. So, he was right on that.
So, you said that Tom do not post a vague BS like Klee, but you said that Tom got a BS info about Lockhart from MS, so, Tom doesn't post vague BS like Klee even then when TOM got a BS info from MS when he claimed that Lockhart is soooo dead.
Like this : So i'm gonna believe Tom when he says one thing, but then discard the other things he says that doesn't fit a particular narrative?
Yep, post above just proves it what you said. Tom never, really never ever said a vague BS even when he was wrong
Yeah, he is an MS insider and he do not post a vague bullshit like Klee..... UNBELIEVABLE how one MS insider can post a pastebin crap
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Mass Shift
Member
sonomamashine
, no I agree with you and pretty sure we're getting no less than 10. I just hope if there actually are late surprises they're good ones. Like memory, SSD configs, and a few killer AAAs .
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3DMark has put VRS benchmark. Alot of people reporting some serious gains (40-60% increase in FPS).
UL Benchmarks Outs 3DMark Feature Test for Variable-Rate Shading Tier-2
UL Benchmarks today announced an update to 3DMark, with the expansion of the Variable-Rate Shading (VRS) feature-test with support for VRS Tier-2. A component of DirectX 12, VRS Tier 1 is supported by NVIDIA "Turing" and Intel Gen11 graphics architectures (Ice Lake's iGPU). VRS Tier-2 is...
Because its confirmed for Navi 2 in drivers and Sparkman APU (Lockhart) has it.
And why is Sparkman Xbox related? From our own Proelite.
Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post E3 2019, pre GDC 2020] [XBSX, PS5]
Hence the war between Google and Oracle and why a lot of people were pretty pissed off when that Appeals Court shat on a smart and informed ruling (Alsup actually learned how to code in Java to better understand the case). Since you're one of few who knows about this, I have to ask and hope you...
forum.beyond3d.com
No, what I am saying is Tom Warren gets info from MS. They can BS him, but we know his sources are directly from MS.You need to consider that Schreier said that EARLIER this year, WHEN NOBODY HAD a dev kits. So, he was right on that.
So, you said that Tom do not post a vague BS like Klee, but you said that Tom got a BS info about Lockhart from MS, so, Tom doesn't post vague BS like Klee even then when TOM got a BS info from MS when he claimed that Lockhart is soooo dead.
Like this : So i'm gonna believe Tom when he says one thing, but then discard the other things he says that doesn't fit a particular narrative?
Yep, post above just proves it what you said. Tom never, really never ever said a vague BS even when he was wrong
Yeah, he is an MS insider and he do not post a vague bullshit like Klee..... UNBELIEVABLE how one MS insider can post a pastebin crap
We know he was one of first to report on dual SKU. We know he writes for Verge and stands behind his articles.
What we dont know about Klee is literally everything. He was wrong about Lockhart, he doubled down on it being dead and was wrong. I dont see why we should take his posts on forum as a gospel. He didnt leak codenames (Komachi/Apisak and Kotaku did), he didnt leak dual SKU (Tom and Brad did) and all he said was vague things like "You will be surprised by how good games look considering the TFs" "Difference is small" etc.
Alot of fluff.
sonomamashine
Member
They will be surprises for sure, Sony didn't miss E3 for nothing, games gonna look ridiculously good add to that some new stuff that were not possible with jaguar CPU (expect something new, never experienced before) AMD RYZEN is the best thing that happened for CPU, now there are some concerns around that Halo trailer (keep in mind that it was in 4k and early kit) games gonna look extremely good, rich & alive on 1080p/1440p , i don't think people will play 4k that much (cause of some downgrades)
I just hope if there actually are late surprises they're good ones. Like memory, SSD configs, and a few killer AAAs .
it_wasn't_me
Banned
Tom Warren didn't leak that both of Scarlet and PS5 will be above 10 TF. Tom Warren said that Lockhart WAS DEAD! An MS insider didn't know target specs for Scarlet, really? So, if you saying the same for Klee, the same can goes for Tom Warren. I dont see why we should take Tom's posts on forum as a gospel. What Komachi has to do with Tom Warren leak about dual SKU? Why you involving Komachi? So what if Komachi leaked codenames. So i will say the same thing like you did just to discard Tom Warren. Tom Warren didn't leak a codename for next Xbox and PS5, Komachi did.
Like i said : So i'm gonna believe Tom when he says one thing, but then discard the other things he says that doesn't fit a particular narrative?
Don't have a double standards, bro!
About Klee
Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT6| - Mostly Fan Noise and Hot Air OT
I'm not joking. I still remember the lengthy debates. With one person especially... I think the name was I-Low or something like that. Dude legit thought Sony was going to launch the PS4 that was just a few Gigaflops more powerful and maybe 1-2GB or RAM. I'd have to search through the old place...
www.resetera.com
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You are overhyping VRS a bit. It's a quality of picture downgrade. Let's call a spade a spade. People are freaking out about DLSS making picture blurry and you think VRS will be this game changing feature. In limited usage it can be worth to gain few fps. 60% gain in fps also means that the picture quality is murdered. It makes more sense for VR with eye tracking where you need most details where your eyes are focusing.
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I am not taking Toms words as gospel at all. In fact, if you are reading my posts you will note I think him and Jason are WRONG on TF count. Why? Because they are not technical and you cannot be sure what their sources, if they are even right, where thinking and what Tom and Jason got from it.Tom Warren didn't leak that both of Scarlet and PS5 will be above 10 TF. Tom Warren said that Lockhart WAS DEAD! An MS insider didn't know target specs for Scarlet, really? So, if you saying the same for Klee, the same can goes for Tom Warren. I dont see why we should take Tom's posts on forum as a gospel.
Like i said : So i'm gonna believe Tom when he says one thing, but then discard the other things he says that doesn't fit a particular narrative?
Don't have a double standards, bro!
About Klee
Next-gen PS5 and next Xbox speculation launch thread |OT6| - Mostly Fan Noise and Hot Air OT
I'm not joking. I still remember the lengthy debates. With one person especially... I think the name was I-Low or something like that. Dude legit thought Sony was going to launch the PS4 that was just a few Gigaflops more powerful and maybe 1-2GB or RAM. I'd have to search through the old place...
"Both are shooting above Stadia" is very vague.
"Anaconda is higher then 10TF" but few months earlier he posted 12+TF dev kits and Arcturus specs which where bogus and wrong. So which is right? 2+ TF of difference from same source.
Watch it being 9TF and them saying "Duo to VRS and RT its much stronger then Stadia"(ofc it is).
it_wasn't_me
Banned
Jason wasn't wrong on TF count. Uh : You need to consider that Schreier said that EARLIER this year, WHEN NOBODY HAD a dev kits. Really a nobody! So, he was right on TF count! All that was said later about TF count - maybe 11 TF, maybe 12 TF..... was all just guessing....on pastebin. And Tom Warren, an MS insider, posted that crap on Twitter.
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Negotiator
Member
VRS has been implemented in Turing since 2018:
Variable Rate Shading (VRS)
VRS allows developers to control shading rate dynamically, shading as little as once per sixteen pixels or as often as eight times per pixel. The application specifies shading rate using a combination of a shading-rate surface and a per-primitive (triangle) value. VRS is a very powerful tool that allows developers to shade more efficiently, reducing work in regions of the screen where full resolution shading would not give any visible image quality benefit, and therefore improving frame rate. Several classes of VRS-based algorithms have already been identified, which can vary shading work based on content level of detail (Content Adaptive Shading), rate of content motion (Motion Adaptive Shading), and for VR applications, lens resolution and eye position (Foveated Rendering).
NVIDIA Turing Architecture In-Depth | NVIDIA Technical Blog
Fueled by the ongoing growth of the gaming market and its insatiable demand for better 3D graphics, NVIDIA® has evolved the GPU into the world’s leading parallel processing engine for many…
devblogs.nvidia.com
Don't buy the BS that it's going to surpass 2070/2080 cards, despite only being 8-9TF. That's uninformed at best.
Besides, what most people don't understand is that compute needs are not the same as rasterization needs.
Compute (GPGPU) needs = physics, AI (pathfinding), neural networks/deep learning, lighting, post-processing -> a flop is a flop (1:1), there is not silly GCN vs RDNA distinction here.
Rasterization = plain old 3D graphics and nothing else -> smart rendering tricks such as tiled rendering, memory compression algorithms etc.
Too bad uninformed people will keep perpetuating the same myth ad infinitum...
Thats not true at all and VRS has nothing to do with DLSS which literally makes image blurry mess. Most important thing about VRS is limiting parts of renderer where shading is done depending on its priority. It automatically brings efficiency up, especially when engines are designed that way to take advantage of it (unlike tried and testet PC way od doing things - just crank it up to 11 and let people buy new GPUs).
No, Jason didnt even mention TFs. He said they are shooting HIGHER In perf vs Stadia. No where did he say TF will be higher, its console warrior brain wanting 12TF and then feeding it with quote that doesnt actually say it.
it_wasn't_me
Banned
If he said that both Sony and MS are aiming above Stadia TF count and working hard to achieve that, so, yes, both are above 10 TF and Navi architecture which IS CLEARLY above Stadia's 10.7 VEGA. Cheers! Jason was right on TF count. Later was just confirmed by Klee, Jason and Reiner that both are above 10 TF.
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Yea 9TF Navi 2 with VRS wont beat 2070, but somehow current Navi XT without it beats it (while running at avg ~8.8-9TF duo to clocks not being in 1800MHZ as advertised).VRS has been implemented in Turing since 2018:
Variable Rate Shading (VRS)
VRS allows developers to control shading rate dynamically, shading as little as once per sixteen pixels or as often as eight times per pixel. The application specifies shading rate using a combination of a shading-rate surface and a per-primitive (triangle) value. VRS is a very powerful tool that allows developers to shade more efficiently, reducing work in regions of the screen where full resolution shading would not give any visible image quality benefit, and therefore improving frame rate. Several classes of VRS-based algorithms have already been identified, which can vary shading work based on content level of detail (Content Adaptive Shading), rate of content motion (Motion Adaptive Shading), and for VR applications, lens resolution and eye position (Foveated Rendering).
NVIDIA Turing Architecture In-Depth | NVIDIA Technical Blog
Fueled by the ongoing growth of the gaming market and its insatiable demand for better 3D graphics, NVIDIA® has evolved the GPU into the world’s leading parallel processing engine for many…
Don't buy the BS that it's going to surpass 2070/2080 cards, despite only being 8-9TF. That's uninformed at best.
Besides, what most people don't understand is that compute needs are not the same as rasterization needs.
Compute (GPGPU) needs = physics, AI (pathfinding), neural networks/deep learning, lighting, post-processing -> a flop is a flop (1:1), there is not silly GCN vs RDNA distinction here.
Rasterization = plain old 3D graphics and nothing else -> smart rendering tricks such as tiled rendering, memory compression algorithms etc.
Too bad uninformed people will keep perpetuating the same myth ad infinitum...
You are quite literally the uninformed one here.
But he DID NOT mention TFs. He said they target higher performance (which even current 5700 non XT would provide), not TF.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
How is it console warring to want both consoles to be 12 tflops?
Jason specifically said that both console makers are aiming to beat stadia tflops numbers. He never said anything about performance. His quote has been posted here many times.
Most recently he said on his podcast that consoles are going to be more powerful than the rtx 2080. He didn't believe it himself and refused to be quoted on it because its such a ridiculous proposition to him but that's what was told to him by several of his sources.
VRS basically makes areas of image less detailed by grouping pixels in larger blocks and shading it according to one pixel instead of shading each pixel individually. It's literally making bigger pixels leading to the parts of image less detailed - lower res. There's no magic free fps at no cost. It's the reduction of detail, period.
I'm not saying it's shit. It can be used in certain places and can be especially great for VR with eye tracking. But you are way overselling it as some magic.
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it_wasn't_me
Banned
WTF is happening here with Xbone fans and their logical conslusions?
Jason literally said that both companies are aiming to beat Stadia TF count numbers. I've said that numerous times here.
If he said that both Sony and MS are aiming above Stadia TF count and working hard to achieve that, so, yes, both are above 10 TF and Navi architecture which IS CLEARLY above Stadia's 10.7 VEGA. Jason was right on TF count. Later was just confirmed by Klee, Jason and Reiner that both are above 10 TF.
Next gen PS5 and next Xbox launch speculation - Secret sauces spicing 2019
(Figuring out how it works) Next Generation Console Preview Generation Nine in Three Quarters Black Boxes Wrapping it up ___ References I References II
www.resetera.com
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sonomamashine
Member
9TF NAVI beats STADIA...........
Next gen PS5 and next Xbox launch speculation - Secret sauces spicing 2019
(Figuring out how it works) Next Generation Console Preview Generation Nine in Three Quarters Black Boxes Wrapping it up ___ References I References II
www.resetera.com
Here you go.
How much better then 2080? In which way? I already said, Navi 2 with 9TF could beat 2080 in consoles. There will be improvements, there will be VRS and RT and lately 5700XT is extremely closely to 2070 Super cards (being faster in RDR2 vs 2080 actually).
So, bar codenames, FS score and TDP/7nm limits, everything said up until this point by insiders as well as ree role playing insiders has been incredibly vague.
Watch 6700XT beat 2080 with 9-10TF and usual suspects coming in saying "Yea yea 10+TF was for dev kits since Navi 2 is 20-30% faster per TF so they went with sub 10TF".
I posted Jasons update in my last post and you can see there he even said he hates these thread because his words are took as gospel. And people who take them are people like you.WTF is happening here with Xbone fans and their logical conslusions?
Jason literally said that both companies are aiming to beat Stadia TF count numbers. I've said that numerous times here.
If he said that both Sony and MS are aiming above Stadia TF count and working hard to achieve that, so, yes, both are above 10 TF and Navi architecture which IS CLEARLY above Stadia's 10.7 VEGA. Jason was right on TF count. Later was just confirmed by Klee, Jason and Reiner that both are above 10 TF.
Next gen PS5 and next Xbox launch speculation - Secret sauces spicing 2019
(Figuring out how it works) Next Generation Console Preview Generation Nine in Three Quarters Black Boxes Wrapping it up ___ References I References II
He LITERALLY said big studios have very few informations regarding next gen consoles, and that he DOESNT know TF number.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I think that quote from Jason is very cleverly ambiguous. If that wasn't meant then he also always says tech specs aren't his area of expertise.
it_wasn't_me
Banned
Oh, fuuuuuuu................................................................k
I'm saying again, you need to consider that Schreier said that EARLIER this year, WHEN NOBODY HAD a dev kits. He was right about TF count number. Literally TF count number, not performance number, TF COUNT number!!! Your lovely "not talking vague bullshit" Tom, an "official" MS insider didn't knew shit, but Jason somehow knew target TF count.
So, you're taking Tom Warren words as gospel. So, people who takes Tom Warren words as gospel are people like you. Cheers!
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