Shmunter
Member
At these levels, the diminishing returns are brutal
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mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Kleegamefan has been around awhile here he in the late 90s working at Electronic Gaming Monthly. (Lower left)
Hold on....Klee is a black man?!
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
He must be kicking their ass as it seems one of them was trying to strangle him with the controller cord.
Ar¢tos
Member
The lower the numbers, the more each flop is worth.Thats what I am having a hard time understanding. Both Xbox One (only in TFLOP terms) and PS4 have base of 1.0. Then numbers after the base is only a difference of 0.5. But now you guys are saying that if Xsex was 12 TFLOPS and PS5 was 13-14 TFLOPs with the difference in base range of 1-2 is only 10% difference in power. Yes I know there is a lot more that goes into graphics-performance than TFLOPS, but I am a noob.
In a 1080p gen we saw how 700-900p compared to 1080p.
In a 4k gen if we have 13tf native 4k on one, the 12tf will do like 80-90% of 4k with CB or temporal reconstruction to achieve 4k. During gameplay this will be barely noticeable. It's not like this gen where ps4pro had to do CB from much less than 4k and it was noticeable.
Shmunter
Member
No, that’s his wife
Thats what I am having a hard time understanding. Both Xbox One (only in TFLOP terms) and PS4 have base of 1.0. Then numbers after the base is only a difference of 0.5. But now you guys are saying that if Xsex was 12 TFLOPS and PS5 was 13-14 TFLOPs with the difference in base range of 1-2 is only 10% difference in power. Yes I know there is a lot more that goes into graphics-performance than TFLOPS, but I am a noob.
Think of it this way
if you was a kid and grandma gave you 1 cookie but she gave your brother/sister a cookie & a half you would easily notice that she gave your sibling more than you but now that you're bigger/older you really wouldn't notice much of a difference if grandma gave you 12 cookies & gave your brother/sister 13 cookies.
The black avatar didn't give that away? lol
megreotsugua
Banned
David Ricardo
Member
Somebody passed this tweets to me. Is it possible that those are Radeon VII devkit specs?
chemical boy
Member
I think ReRAM is virtually ruled out.
megreotsugua
Banned
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Resistive RAM; it's a PCM-based non-volatile technology aimed at bridging the gap between DRAM and NAND. Specifically, bringing the non-volatile storage of NAND (meaning data remains when power is off) combined with the flexible alterability of DRAM (bit and byte-addressable write, true random access, DRAM-like speed).
Basically look at stuff like Intel's Optane memory and you have a decent idea of what ReRAM's capabilities could be. Optane is offered in both SSD and DRAM-style variants, the latter called DC Persistent Memory. The former works over an NVMe-compliant memory controller over PCIe 3.0 (and PCIe 4.0) lane connections, and acts like higher-tier NAND memory. The latter slots into a DRAM memory module and is treated like DRAM for performance and NAND for storage, simultaneously.
3D Xpoint/Optane and ReRAM are just two of the emerging memory technologies either on the market or poised to release on the market; there are others like FRAM, NRAM, MRAM etc. but those are finding their places in different niche aspects of the market not aimed at the type of roles 3D Xpoint/Optane is fulfilling (and that ReRAM could potentially compete with if some breakthroughs occur on the R&D side).
Kazekage1981
Member
That helps a lot, but you still have to persuade the noobs who are going to decide which console to pick this upcoming holiday 2020. If Xsex is 12TFLOPS and PS5 is 13-14TFLOPS, how will Microsoft persuade people that its a better console? Microsoft in my opinion has many hurdles:
1) They have to make their console more powerful than PS5 even if its for bragging rights and also marketing purposes (most powerful console built in the entire milky way galaxy)
2) Show strong software lineup at launch with exclusives.
If they cant do both then I am not sure how they will succeed. For me, it is better to have option 1 then number 2. You can argue all you want that its games that sell consoles (Nintendo switch, PS4 blah blah) but I am looking forward to all the DF videos on how Xsex is *slightly* better on unnoticeable background details that no one pays attention to
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
Ah ok. I thought it was some sort of repurposed RAM which made no sense lol.
megreotsugua
Banned
Guys can you crush my theory in this post. What am I missing?
(The quoted parts does not appear, you have to read the original post.)
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Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
Is mister X media still around?
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Yeah makes zero sense for him to give out detailed GPU specs but not anything about RAM/SSD if there is a strong NDA in place. Even then why would it apply to him? He's completely anonymous!
megreotsugua
Banned
I'm not sure. I've just recently signed up in this forum but I was a long time lurker. But I hear MisterXMedia's name being thrown around a lot.
Ar¢tos
Member
And a selective NDA too, can reveal some specs but not others.
I'm under NDA but can't tell a single thing about anything to anyone, not even allowed to discuss it with other people under the same NDA (nothing related to hardware!)
I guess Sony has different NDAs...
prinz_valium
Member
No he's right. Those numbers make no sense.
The same L2 cache as RX5700 with way more CU, ROPS and TMUS?
How is the Shader array designed with redundancy in mind?
3 Shader Engines does not match, because it would not be uniform.
DJ12
Member
I'm loving the level of butthurt from a few numbers lol.
RDNA does indeed have level 1 cache. (1 that covers dual CUs, pretty sure on a custom part this could be per cu as mentioned, also this could just be RDNA 2 in physical form, as no one knows a damn thing about it yet)
As shown on the RDNA white paper, page 17.
In actual fact it's GCN that doesn't have any l1 cache.
So your twitter "friend" shoots and misses. Must've got his information from TimDog or MisterXmedia.
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Aceofspades
Banned
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
Apparently his/her twitter is still going.
That helps a lot, but you still have to persuade the noobs who are going to decide which console to pick this upcoming holiday 2020. If Xsex is 12TFLOPS and PS5 is 13-14TFLOPS, how will Microsoft persuade people that its a better console? Microsoft in my opinion has many hurdles:
1) They have to make their console more powerful than PS5 even if its for bragging rights and also marketing purposes (most powerful console built in the entire milky way galaxy)
2) Show strong software lineup at launch with exclusives.
If they cant do both then I am not sure how they will succeed. For me, it is better to have option 1 then number 2. You can argue all you want that its games that sell consoles (Nintendo switch, PS4 blah blah) but I am looking forward to all the DF videos on how Xsex is *slightly* better on unnoticeable background details that no one pays attention to
Most of the people buying console don't have a clue what TFLOPS even is. don't be fooled into thinking that PS4 outsold Xbox One because of a half of a TFLOPS difference. it just was the console that most people wanted this generation.
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David Ricardo
Member
The guy in twitter isn't saying there is no L1 cache in RDNA. He is saying that the L1 cache in RDNA is per shader array, not per CU.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
No, it definitely mattered to hardcore and early adopters, who were the majority bulk of purchasers in the first year or so. And traditionally, where the hardcore and core go, the mainstream will follow.
The Wii was the only mainstream console in history to subvert that trend, but even that is debatable. More likely the mainstream were just much quicker to adopt it than similar "hot" systems prior to it (even the PS2).
megreotsugua
Banned
I think you have a point.
The first early adopters are the types of console buyers who will buy their preferred console regardless of specs and games.
The second early adopters are the ones who may research first and be swayed by specs and potential games.
The intermediate buyers are those who may be influenced by their peers and trend on what system to get but also by the games they wanna play.
The late buyers will consider the price more than anything but will also consider the games they want to play.
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DJ12
Member
But that's RDNA1, no one knows the technicalities of RDNA2 yet or Sony and MS's customisation....
But that doesn't change the reaction being pretty funny (obvious fan boy twitter account - if it was VEGA64 then everything else would also be wrong, but yeah lets focus on a tiny detail and ignore all the other stuff lol)
(Anyway, I read the papers wrong so that's my bad)
PS4 was actually the 1st time that the most powerful console on the market sold the best.
megreotsugua
Banned
I think chris 1515 of resetera is our Tommy Fisher. They're basically saying the same things.
And I think he's been using that ssd patent to create misdirection. He's been trumpeting that patent for a long time.
We're in the speculation thread right.
And I think he's been using that ssd patent to create misdirection. He's been trumpeting that patent for a long time.
We're in the speculation thread right.
Fake
Member
Resetera Ram.
David Ricardo
Member
After the mods pm'd TF and didn't ban him, I thought he could be somewhat reliable. But this doesn't look good. It could be just GCN based devkit specs, it could be that RDNA 2 is more like GCN in certain ways than RDNA1... but the most simple explanation is he just made it all up.
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Darius87
Member
where L0 cache? if you know L1 and L2 caches you should know L0 also exist don't you? seems to me like you're:
Nope he's right you and you pal? are busted big time L1 is not per CU, is per array L0 is per dual CU's(which tommy isn't aware of) this is new thing in RDNA arch which reduces latency and improves performance with these L0 cache's.
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SmokSmog
Member
Lone Wolf
Member
Will the PS5 have a built in safe space?
Ar¢tos
Member
A certification that none of the components were handled by straight white men.
It was a 40% difference on top of the whole always online DRM then the 100 dollar price difference. It was a complete disaster you could not try to tank your console worse if you were trying. If they are with in 10% power will play zero into who wins. It will be exclusives, services. Pricing, form factor, noise ect. That 10% won't show up in 3rd party games or digital foundry. They will be basically the same game unlike last generation.
David Ricardo
Member
I don't care about their reputation, but is what they are saying in the tweet about L1 cache right? If it's right, Tommy Fisher has some explaining to do.
Imtjnotu
Member
not saying or believing Tommy but when listing the Gpu does he need to offer L0? Isn't navis L0 fixed at 16kb 2 way?where L0 cache? if you know L1 and L2 caches you should know L0 also exist don't you? seems to me like you're:
Nope he's right you and you pal? are busted big time L1 is not per CU, is per array L0 is per dual CU's(which tommy isn't aware of) this is new thing in RDNA arch which reduces latency and improves performance with these L0 cache's.
It's true that you wouldn't be able to see a difference with the GPU difference but I have a feeling that the difference in games will be bigger this generation than they was last generation.
PS4 Pro GPU had less L1 cache than Xbox One X while using features from a GPU that was a generation above the GPU in Xbox One X.
You people are looking for loopholes in Tom's story but using PC parts to back up your claims when Sony & Microsoft are using custom parts.
vpance
Member
I think chris 1515 of resetera is our Tommy Fisher. They're basically saying the same things.
And I think he's been using that ssd patent to create misdirection. He's been trumpeting that patent for a long time.
We're in the speculation thread right.
He's saying the memory architecture is different than SX, according to a source (dev?)
GDDR6 only just doesn't seem like a very forward thinking decision this time around.
DJ12
Member
Again. You are speaking of rDNA 1 vanilla, not rDNA 2 custom.where L0 cache? if you know L1 and L2 caches you should know L0 also exist don't you? seems to me like you're:
Nope he's right you and you pal? are busted big time L1 is not per CU, is per array L0 is per dual CU's(which tommy isn't aware of) this is new thing in RDNA arch which reduces latency and improves performance with these L0 cache's.
No one has any idea what is in rDNA 2, let alone the bespoke customisations added by ms and sony.
So yeah he got it wrong on l1 cache (if that remains the same for rDNA 2) but the narrative they must use gcn as a result of this faux pa is also wrong as none of the other informations tallies with gcn.
ANIMAL1975
Member
Handy Fake
Member
Next stop Carnegie Hall.HeyHandy Fake you on Twitter!
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