Bernd Lauert
Banned
This makes his claims even more funny, tbh.These geniuses were CEOs and CFOs, what do you do?
This makes his claims even more funny, tbh.These geniuses were CEOs and CFOs, what do you do?
So you seriously believe a streaming service needs to make $5 billion a month to be viable.
I believe they have access to information that can correlate his claims with development costs for current AAA being sustainable on a monthly release basis.This makes his claims even more funny, tbh.
And Jimbo said they will pivot if necessary. It's not like he's categorically saying no to it. It's just much riskier for Sony compared to Microsoft (money wise).High budget games on sub plan isnt so much a yes or no.
It's more of a when.
Sony's own first party games come to PS Now. And they even said their new sub plans in June (I think the premium tier but not sure) will even have Returnal and some other PS5 games.
Probably an investor question. Everyone's reporting quarterly results now. Pretty common question for almost all entertainment companies now.One thing that fascinated me is that is not the first time Sony higher-ups have said this. Is there a pressure from PS gamers to copy gamepass? Some other reason?
So you defended Layton for claiming a steaming service needs $5 billion a month to be viable and then couldn’t back up that defense. Got it.I believe they have access to information that can correlate his claims with development costs for current AAA being sustainable on a monthly release basis.
i agree with him , dude is honest
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You don't have to trust CEOs and CFOs, you can do the math yourself, since math doesn't lie.I believe they have access to information that can correlate his claims with development costs for current AAA being sustainable on a monthly release basis.
I don't think the quality will necessarily deteriorate because I think MS will have already planned out staged price increases once their internal studios starting putting out AAA games regularly.
At the moment they're still in the loss leader phase.
So you defended Layton for claiming a steaming service needs $5 billion a month to be viable and then couldn’t back up that defense. Got it.
And you can't back up your claim as why it can't with their current AAA model, infrastructure (Sony doesn't own massive data centers), etc.. Context and nuance matters, I know that falls short on you often.So you defended Layton for claiming a steaming service needs $5 billion a month to be viable and then couldn’t back up that defense. Got it.
Present the math.You don't have to trust CEOs and CFOs, you can do the math yourself, since math doesn't lie.
Sony isn't against putting 1st party games on a subscription, they have been making this since before MS started to do it. Sony is against putting them day one in the subscription because unlike MS they want to continue having a profitable business with their AAA games.High budget games on sub plan isnt so much a yes or no.
It's more of a when.
Sony's own first party games come to PS Now. And they even said their new sub plans in June (I think the premium tier but not sure) will even have Returnal and some other PS5 games.
That 'infrastructure' thing is total bullshit. Sony has their own PSN, PS+ and PS Now servers and infrastructure, plus many related patents and they can put them in any data centers they desire. Like any other huge company has their own some data centers but most of the ones they operate are from external companies because it's cheaper than to build, own and mantain them specially when you have a huge scale of online multiplayer and cloud gaming, which requires to have servers if not in the same country/region of the player, almost.And you can't back up your claim as why it can't with their current AAA model, infrastructure (Sony doesn't own massive data centers), etc.. Context and nuance matters, I know that falls short on you often.
It isn't an excuse, it's common sense. Sony is the market leader in console and AAA game subs. Sony's game subscription strategy is way more successful and unlike the Game Pass one allows to have a profitable business.I think that's just an excuse for them to justify why they won't do a Game Pass like service. But at the same time, I think it's alright... not every company needs a subscription service like that; and maybe that's not feasible for them. I don't buy this argument though, and it feels to me they took the opportunity to poke on MS.
Also, if I'm gonna be honest, although Sony biggest 1st party games being undeniably awesome in terms of production value, I really think it's time for them shake things up a bit. Their games have been becoming too formulaic too.
So you defended Layton for claiming a steaming service needs $5 billion a month to be viable and then couldn’t back up that defense. Got it.
AAA games cost $100m-$150m on average. Which means you can make 30+ AAA games for 5 billion dollars. And he claims you need to make 5 billion a month to sustain something like Gamepass. Doesn't add up at all, unless you expect Microsoft to release 30 AAA games a month.
They already have a subscription service that has close to 50m subscribers on their platform, like it or not. I really don't understand where people are coming from thinking that somehow Gamepass is a massive money maker at $15 (at most, since that's the price of Ultimate) but somehow what Sony has can't compete.That largely ignores the price elasticity of subscription services, which is already impacting services like Netflix. It's a super delicate balance and for a company like SIE it really doesn't make sense when you can have your cake and eat it too.
They don't need their subscription service to have as much return as Microsoft's when their first party revenue and 3rd party royalties add up to significantly higher revenue and more importantly higher profit margins.
A subscription model that directly eats into Sony's primary profit stream makes no sense. Microsoft on the other hand never really had this profit driver. Their hardware sold less than Sony, their 3rd party revenue was less than sony, and their first party revenue was significantly less than Sony.
AAA games cost $100m-$150m on average. Which means you can make 30+ AAA games for 5 billion dollars. And he claims you need to make 5 billion a month to sustain something like Gamepass. Doesn't add up at all, unless you expect Microsoft to release 30 AAA games a month.And you can't back up your claim as why it can't with their current AAA model. Context and nuance matters, I know that falls short on you often.
Present the math.
AAA games cost $100m-$150m on average. Which means you can make 30+ AAA games for 5 billion dollars. And he claims you need to make 5 billion a month to sustain something like Gamepass. Doesn't add up at all, unless you expect Microsoft to release 30 AAA games a month.
I don't think the pressure is from Sony fans lolOne thing that fascinated me is that is not the first time Sony higher-ups have said this. Is there a pressure from PS gamers to copy gamepass? Some other reason?
It's so funny that you pretend to know what you are talking about but you seem think Gamepass cost is limited to the cost of developing AAA games.AAA games cost $100m-$150m on average. Which means you can make 30+ AAA games for 5 billion dollars. And he claims you need to make 5 billion a month to sustain something like Gamepass. Doesn't add up at all, unless you expect Microsoft to release 30 AAA games a month.
I googled and I can't find anywhere where he said you need 5bil. Do you have any links?
If that is the case, then they need to shove their game sales on the face of those investors and media. And just tell them, our games sell that much copies. We don't need subscription service to sell our games.I think the issue is they are getting hounded by media, and investors. Gamepass is a growth market sector. Just like Netflix, Prime, HBOMAX. And I think you get investor pushback when these financials come out.
It's still no where close to what he claims, easily an order of magnitude less money is required.. MS goal is 1 AAA game a quarter btw.Now do the cost for infrastructure (Sony doesn't own an Azure), 1 AAA game a month (this is what MS tried to claim as a goal or was it fan hopes?), third party deals, revenue sharing with all developers/publishers, etc, etc, etc vs a sub cost at low number of subscribers at the moment.
You leave out a lot of details with basic bitch napkin math.
Well, they keep talking about it seemingly every month. Somebody seems to pressure them. Otherwise why bring it up. Investors?I don't think the pressure is from Sony fans lol
Gamepass isn't extra service.How about the cost of xCloud investments, the cost of licensing games, the big chunk of the money that they would be making anyway just because of Gold (someone that moved from Gold to Ultima started paying only an additional $5 to them), the impact the service has on sale, etc.
Source has been posted, it's a gameindustry.biz interview.
So you seriously believe a streaming service needs to make $5 billion a month to be viable.
Lol.I believe they have access to information that can correlate his claims with development costs for current AAA being sustainable on a monthly release basis.
you're making up numbers, you're clearly a doofus.AAA games cost $100m-$150m on average. Which means you can make 30+ AAA games for 5 billion dollars. And he claims you need to make 5 billion a month to sustain something like Gamepass. Doesn't add up at all, unless you expect Microsoft to release 30 AAA games a month.
I posted it above. Since you ignored it, here it is again.
And this post said it best.
Lol.
It is clear to anybody with brain cells that Layden's "you need 500 million subs to have a profit" is just bullshit.
500 million subs at 10€ per month is 60 billion in revenue per year. And that's ignoring all other revenue streams that games can have.
I do not have to be a CEO to say you this.
So how much revenue is required to fund and profit from all of Microsoft's studios as well as continue adding third party content to the subscription?
I actually don't know if they can't do it well since they never did one in recent memory. But if Bloodborne and Demons Souls count, they actualy canOne things Sony can't do very well is the RPG games. While horizon and God of War have some element RPG, it's not really a true RPG games.
So how much revenue is required to fund and profit from all of Microsoft's studios as well as continue adding third party content to the subscription?
One things Sony can't do very well is the RPG games. While horizon and God of War have some element RPG, it's not really a true RPG games.
So does MSI believe they have access to information that can correlate his claims with development costs for current AAA being sustainable on a monthly release basis.
Not to say these forums mirror life outside, but I've only seen Xbox fans waiting Sony to make a gamepass competitor. No one with business sense would ask a company to throw away profits.Well, they keep talking about it seemingly every month. Somebody seems to pressure them. Otherwise why bring it up. Investors?
Yeah, no shit.So does MS![]()
The latest estimate of Gamepass revenue is $2.2B a year, if I remember correctly. And Uncle Phil said Gamepass is not burning any money, so apparently that's the bare minimum you gotta make.So how much revenue is required to fund and profit from all of Microsoft's studios as well as continue adding third party content to the subscription?
What makes a game "Quality" is the real question? Is it this...
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Seems the loud majority have decided that 3rd person single player adventure games are the bar for which "quality" is judged. Beyond this one genre of games I don't see where Sony's "quality" is any better than any other developer.
If Gamepass is making all that money at $15 at most and 25m subscribers and all the effort put into Gamepass then we must assume that Sony is making bank with close to 50m subscribers paying $10 and close to zero effort from Sony's part.The latest estimate of Gamepass revenue is $2.2B a year, if I remember correctly. And Uncle Phil said Gamepass is not burning any money, so apparently that's the bare minimum you gotta make.