Support NeoGAF

[Punished Miku]

Lmao the uniqueness! Because going out there and buying historic IP, multiplatform IP, and taking it away makes Xbox so unique!

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

 

[gothmog]

I don't think there's enough information in that single sentence to say one way or the other.

Either way, it doesn't matter as they aren't willing to divest either of the properties.

It's okay to admit Phil was probably lying. Microsoft won't disown you.

 

[Thirty7ven]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

Does Sony own Final Fantasy? Does Sony own MGS?

So you remove all context and draw a fake parallel?

You are always arguing in bad faith.

Nobody is upset KOTOR was Xbox exclusive. Or Jade Empire. Or Jet Set Radio Future. These comparisons some of you make are so ignorant.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I don't think there's enough information in that single sentence to say one way or the other.

Either way, it doesn't matter as they aren't willing to divest either of the properties.

I mean, it is ...

Interview: "People think about it as Call of Duty or whatever, but you’re buying Candy Crush."

Phil: "Absolutely."

It doesn't get any more definitive than this.

 

[GHG]

This interview, by the way, has some conflicting statements by Phil Spencer.

Quote 1: “This is an important acquisition for us. It’s not some linchpin to the long term — Xbox will exist if this deal doesn’t go through,” he said.

Quote 2: “I’d hate to see consoles go to where phones are where there are only two manufacturers. And, right now, we have three good competitors.”

If Xbox will continue to exist, why would there only be competitors? Unless Phil is (subtly) saying that Xbox will exist but there won't be a "console" per se.

He's being very selective with his words here. Xbox can still "exist" even if there are only 2 console manufacturers.

 

[Heisenberg007]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

But what if the 3rd company is damaging the competition in the industry with anti-competitive acquisitions and taking multiplatform games off of other platforms permanently?

If that 3rd console wasn't there, games would release on all platforms. Because of that 3rd company, games do not release on those 2 consoles.

 

[DeepEnigma]

We can wrap it up now....

 

[gothmog]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

I absolutely have to hear what you mean by "that's how PS started".

 

[analog_future]

I mean, it is ...

Interview: "People think about it as Call of Duty or whatever, but you’re buying Candy Crush."

Phil: "Absolutely."

It doesn't get any more definitive than this.

You can very easily read that as "People think Activision Blizzard is just Call of Duty, but it's also Candy Crush".

It doesn't read at all whatsoever to me that Phil (or the interviewer) is saying that if you buy Activision Blizzard what you're really buying is Candy Crush.


Regardless, it's one sentence. It means nothing one way or the other and a bunch of weirdos clinging onto it as some gotcha is asinine.

 

[analog_future]

It's okay to admit Phil was probably lying. Microsoft won't disown you.

I'm happy to criticise Microsoft and Phil, and I do on the regular. Check my post history. But I'm also not going to try to make up things that aren't there.

 

[GHG]

And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

This I agree with. Which is why Xbox being how they've been for the last decade is good for nobody.

However they can be strong without needing to buy arguably the most important 3rd party publisher in the industry. Both Nintendo and Sony have proven this.

 

[Topher]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

We have three strong consoles already.

 

[DJ12]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

Wait a minute, Sony brought Konami and Square?

They kept that quiet for 25+ years.

 

[Heisenberg007]

He's being very selective with his words here. Xbox can still "exist" even if there are only 2 console manufacturers.

How are you interpreting his statements?

 

[FoxMcChief]

It's okay to admit Phil was probably lying. Microsoft won't disown you.

 

[Astray]

Phil even bringing up whether Xbox will still exist is something in itself. That's the kind of shit we consumers speculate about, but VP level employees never ever acknowledge without a very good reason to do so (like if a newspaper story comes out that Microsoft is planning to sunset the division or something, then he'd have a very good reason to come out and deny/confirm).

Simply does not bode well for the Microsoft future console business.

 

[ToadMan]

That's how PS started, and to this day people still argue that FFVII - XVI, MGS all inherently belong on PS.

Obviously you guys hate MS. But what he's arguing isn't strange at all. And having 3 strong consoles is the best outcome for consumers.

 

[sainraja]

I'm mildly shocked at the number of armchair lawyers/CEOs/business strategists in this thread..

Whichever way this thing goes - the fallout by those dissenting of the final/end decision will be glorious...

It's really weird, yet interesting and oddly entertaining, watching the opinions here sway back and forth whenever any minor update/news drops...

I mean, do you expect people to know how this thing will end?

Is it so wrong for people to share their reactions to something they have been tracking? Whichever way this goes, that is only natural. If it is approved, some will naturally be happy about it while others will naturally have some questions on the "how" and "why." I get where you are coming from, but I don't understand this pre-emptive need to dismiss or shut down things others might say based on something that by that time would have taken place. We all forget that we are on a discussion forum.

Like, what do you guys want? Do you want all discussion on this to end simply because it might be "uncomfortable" or "who cares" or "haha it's funny why do you care so much about these businesses"?
Yeah, I am also expecting childlike reactions from those wanting to see this go through and the reverse from those not wanting it to go through. But not everyone here is doing that anyway.

Also, do people on a discussion forum need to become lawyers in order for them to discuss this? Like, before playing a game, do you train to become a game developer?

 

[demigod]

Leave our boy Phil alone...he's going through a lot.....knowing this deal will get him axed.

Fixed for you.

 

[ToadMan]

Phil even bringing up whether Xbox will still exist is something in itself. That's the kind of shit we consumers speculate about, but VP level employees never ever acknowledge without a very good reason to do so (like if a newspaper story comes out that Microsoft is planning to sunset the division or something, then he'd have a very good reason to come out and deny/confirm).

Simply does not bode well for the Microsoft future console business.

Surprising they’re even saying “if the deal is blocked”.

Usually execs are ballsy and confident until a decision is confirmed and then they attend to the PR battle after.

 

[GHG]

How are you interpreting his statements?

If I'm to interpret it based on "Phil speak" he's basically saying the "Xbox brand" is certain to continue to be around, so Microsoft won't give up on it entirely, however there is the possibility that only 2 console manufacturers could exist in the future.

However what doesn't make sense is the following:

go to where phones are where there are only two manufacturers

That statement is factually not true, there are far more than 2 mobile phone manufacturers. There are only 2 commonly used mobile phone OS's. Maybe it is he who in fact needs educating.

 

[Punished Miku]

You are always arguing in bad faith.

No I'm not. It is pretty unhealthy to assume everyone is lying as much as some of you guys do. I don't know if that's a defense mechanism or what causes it.

PS buys IP as well, and studios, and a ton of exclusives. They literally do the same things. The only difference we're arguing is scale. So unless you're commenting specifically on scale, then you're not really commenting on anything that both sides don't actively do, which was my point. The PS identity is deeply associated with things they paid to keep away from other systems. That was almost the entire identity for PS1 and PS2.

 

[gothmog]

This I agree with. Which is why Xbox being how they've been for the last decade is good for nobody.

However they can be strong without needing to buy arguably the most important 3rd party publisher in the industry. Both Nintendo and Sony have proven this.

Having three strong consoles is good for consumers. Microsoft, though, does not like being in third place in any market they participate in. They first tried to fix that with the Kinect/TV and then the power crown with the X1X and Series X. GamePass is probably their most successful attempt, but that is a longer term bet than they seem to be able to stomach. Now they're just buying publishers with abandon because buying a few strategic developers would just not be Microsoft enough.

 

[demigod]

Thanks, saving this for a certain demograph.

 

[JLB]

Insomniac is same as Activision or zenimax? I would love to see you explain this one without looking silly.

oh little dirty boy… so size matters right?

 

[Astray]

Surprising they’re even saying “if the deal is blocked”.

Usually execs are ballsy and confident until a decision is confirmed and then they attend to the PR battle after.

I read Ida's big CMA post on ResetEra, and even without knowing what got redacted, you can tell that the CMA really picked apart Microsoft's arguments. It's seriously detailed work and I'm honestly impressed at how thorough they were.

 

[JLB]

Fortunately for us, your personal economics are irrelevant to the acquisition discussion we're having in this particular Thread.

define “us”

 

[Astray]

Interesting timing for this news to drop lol

 

[Thirty7ven]

oh little dirty boy… so size matters right?

MS doesn’t care about Acti developers, they care about the IP.

Insomniac had no IP.

I’m just going to start blocking people who don’t know two shits about the industry but insist on shit posting.

 

[Boglin]

"I don’t have great rationale for … how better competition in consoles is somehow hurtful for consumers."

I agree with Phil's logic here and I'd argue that 4 competitors would be even better.

That's why Apple or Google should enter the console space and buy Square Enix, Capcom, EA, Ubisoft, Konami, Fromsoft, Epic, etc then remove their future software releases from Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo. We'd all benefit from it.

 

[mansoor1980]

Interesting timing for this news to drop lol

an updated version of a 2019 game , new games like starfield and ES6 wont be multiplatform

 

[GHG]

"I don’t have great rationale for … how better competition in consoles is somehow hurtful for consumers."

I agree with Phil's logic here and I'd argue that 4 competitors would be even better.

That's why Apple or Google should enter the console space and buy Square Enix, Capcom, EA, Ubisoft, Konami, Fromsoft, Epic, etc then remove their future software releases from Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo. We'd all benefit from it.

Oh boy I'd love to see how the "exclusives bad" crowd would cope if Apple made a serious entry into the space with a 4k gaming console.

 

[Astray]

an updated version of a 2019 game , new games like starfield and ES6 wont be multiplatform

I'd wager it's because Private Division published the 1st game. Future games will likely be blocked off unless you contribute to Spencer's bonus.

 

[quest]

an updated version of a 2019 game , new games like starfield and ES6 wont be multiplatform

Seems like Microsoft is releasing new games for the playstation. Starfield was never in the cards after the money hats of other games the base xbox would of destroyed Microsoft for putting that game on playstation after what sony did taking games from them.

Minecraft Legends

Unite the Overworld

store.playstation.com

 

[mansoor1980]

I'd wager it's because Private Division published the 1st game. Future games will likely be blocked off unless you contribute to Spencer's bonus.

interesting but i doubt that will happen

 

[JLB]

MS doesn’t care about Acti developers, they care about the IP.

Insomniac had no IP.

I’m just going to start blocking people who don’t know two shits about the industry but insist on shit posting.

oh please, you should just click on my avatar, then ignore button and voilá. Dont want to stress you ma'am.

 

[GHG]

oh please, you should just click on my avatar, then ignore button and voilá. Dont want to stress you ma'am.

The only person who seems stressed here is you my friend. All you're doing is attempting to antagonise people because you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Oh boy I'd love to see how the "exclusives bad" crowd would cope if Apple made a serious entry into the space with a 4k gaming console.

Exclusives are bad unless MS is buying up the largest 3rd party publishers and making their own exclusive deals.

 

[ToadMan]

I read Ida's big CMA post on ResetEra, and even without knowing what got redacted, you can tell that the CMA really picked apart Microsoft's arguments. It's seriously detailed work and I'm honestly impressed at how thorough they were.

Me too with the CMA analysis that is.

I read the CMA document and they had, imo, really gotten a good grasp of how the industry ticks right now. The current market, what may come next, the big plays including recent ones like the Zeni deal.

I think some execs (was it Kotick? I’ve forgotten already) saying they needed to be “educated on how the industry works” aren’t helping their case.

I think the CMA get it and get what’s at stake. Let’s see what they decide.

 

[Sanepar]

What everyone thinks? The deal will happen or not?

I still think they will find a solution CMA accept but won't be the 10 years deal.

 

[Thirty7ven]

No I'm not. It is pretty unhealthy to assume everyone is lying as much as some of you guys do. I don't know if that's a defense mechanism or what causes it.

PS buys IP as well, and studios, and a ton of exclusives. They literally do the same things. The only difference we're arguing is scale. So unless you're commenting specifically on scale, then you're not really commenting on anything that both sides don't actively do, which was my point. The PS identity is deeply associated with things they paid to keep away from other systems. That was almost the entire identity for PS1 and PS2.

More flawed and out of context parallels, more bad faith arguments devoid of any substance conductive to any sort of reasonable analysis of how MS buying Acti is very similar or otherwise to previous Sony deals.

“Trust me bro, Sony does the same thing.”

You remind me of my brother in law, he’s a PC boy. Just the other way we talked about this and he arguing it was unfair that Sony could block the deal, and that they also bought publishers. He also believed paid online was something Sony had come up with.

I guess we’re just done talking here, because you can’t convince me with empty arguments that Ms paying for Mass Effect exclusivity is the same as buying EA.

 

[kaizenkko]

What everyone thinks? The deal will happen or not?

I still think they will find a solution CMA accept but won't be the 10 years deal.

I don't know what will happen, but I don't think Microsoft has evolved anything to help their case, ten year agreements are a joke.

 

[Astray]

The agitation in this thread is a small taste of things to come..

 

[Punished Miku]

I guess we’re just done talking here.

Spoiler

you can’t convince me with empty arguments that Ms paying for Mass Effect exclusivity is the same as buying EA.

The only difference is scale.

 

[analog_future]

What everyone thinks? The deal will happen or not?

I still think they will find a solution CMA accept but won't be the 10 years deal.

Seems to me that it's not going to happen.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Spoiler

The only difference is scale.

No my love, the difference is ownership. Permanent.

 

[Punished Miku]

No my love, the difference is ownership. Permanent.

Sony owns things.

What we're discussing is MS owning something bigger.

 

[phil_t98]

But what if the 3rd company is damaging the competition in the industry with anti-competitive acquisitions and taking multiplatform games off of other platforms permanently?

If that 3rd console wasn't there, games would release on all platforms. Because of that 3rd company, games do not release on those 2 consoles.

all company's do it, lets not pretend its just Microsoft

 

[Heisenberg007]

If I'm to interpret it based on "Phil speak" he's basically saying the "Xbox brand" is certain to continue to be around, so Microsoft won't give up on it entirely, however there is the possibility that only 2 console manufacturers could exist in the future.

However what doesn't make sense is the following:



That statement is factually not true, there are far more than 2 mobile phone manufacturers. There are only 2 commonly used mobile phone OS's. Maybe it is he who in fact needs educating.

Yeah. I mainly think this is just "Phil talk" and it's just stupid and likely doesn't have any substantial underlining message.

However, if I assume there is a message in here and these are carefully chosen words, then I'm interpreting is that the Xbox brand remains but it's not a console anymore -- so software sales, Game Pass, etc.

Or like:

 

[JLB]

The only person who seems stressed here is you my friend. All you're doing is attempting to antagonise people because you have nothing worthwhile to contribute.

Keep ignoring me genius!