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[near]

It's still not available to rent here yet. I have a feeling it'll show up by the end of January, at which point I'm better off seeing this in the cinema.

 

[Oberstein]

I re-read the Appendices last night, that's directly from Tolkien's writings.

It's in the line of kings: 2759 Helm, Haleth, Hama die; Frealaf becomes king following the invasion and Long Winter.

It follows that portion of the appendices pretty closely.

No, not in relation to the book's appendices, but to the way Hera is handled in this story.

Spoiler

For reasons of her own, she refuses the throne and just walks away. There's no particular motivation other than “modern reason” for wanting to be free. It doesn't make sense and she couldn't just walk away. She's the direct descendant. Tolkien didn't write anything similar.

 

[DirtInUrEye]

Damn, it took it on the chin this weekend, less than $5 mill in the US, just a little more internationally. Though it supposedly only had a 30 mill budget, so I expect it will turn a profit eventually on streaming, VOD, and disc sales. I think they were really caught off guard with how low this went, I can see a limited theatrical run for the prestige but this was dropped into 2500 theaters which seems waaaaaay optimistic. I'm expecting it to hit streaming just after New Years.

Was it because it was animated? The focus on Hera? Lack of enthusiasm after Rings of Power? I gotta think if this film was dropped in 2005 right after ROTK it would have done half a billion at least.

Maybe it will have some legs through the holiday.

Art style is shit and holds minimal cult appeal at best in Western territories.

 

[ADiTAR]

Watched it.

There's no movie here. Almost no story. It feels like rehash of things we saw, no real character development, and everything that was supposed to happen happened.

I get why it didn't find an audience.

 

[Richard Packer]

Withdrawing my "I'm in."

Did you ever end up watching this?

 

[AJUMP23]

Watched it.

There's no movie here. Almost no story. It feels like rehash of things we saw, no real character development, and everything that was supposed to happen happened.

I get why it didn't find an audience.

It was fine. It is a story out of the appendices.

one character developed from a guy who wanted to Mary a redhead to a guy who wanted to kill everyone.

 

[DeafTourette]

Just watched it. Set 200 years before the events of LOTR (not counting The Hobbit)... I appreciated the dialogue callbacks to the previous movies and the lore explanations to some of why things are called what they are in Rohan... I really enjoyed it!

 

[EviLore]

Did you ever end up watching this?

Nope, did you?

 

[Richard Packer]

Nope, did you?

I did. Thought it was decent. The dad was a great character. Besides that I have no other strong feelings for it. It's been just a month and I don't remember much from it. Totally forgettable but not a bad way to waste time. At least I finished it, which is more then I can say about Rings of Power.

 

[jason10mm]

Fired this up. Wow that is some low frame rate animation. But it looks good otherwise.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Budget $30M. Oly made $20M at box office.

 

[DeafTourette]

Fired this up. Wow that is some low frame rate animation. But it looks good otherwise.

The story is what kept me.

 

[jason10mm]

The story is what kept me.

I'm going to have to rewatch it. Was popping in and out of the room too much to follow why this lass seemed to be doing all the work.

She looks good though, so at least she is a pretty girlboss. Not sure why her life's ambition is to be a childless spinster sleeping in the woods but maybe I missed something

 

[DeafTourette]

I'm going to have to rewatch it. Was popping in and out of the room too much to follow why this lass seemed to be doing all the work.

She looks good though, so at least she is a pretty girlboss. Not sure why her life's ambition is to be a childless spinster sleeping in the woods but maybe I missed something

She seems like the type of person who longs for adventure. Not everyone's goal in life is to get married and/or have children. She seems to want to DO things... Not be renowned but be known to be an adventurer and one to be called upon should the call arise, as was intimated at the end.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

I made it halfway. Bored me.

 

[jason10mm]

She seems like the type of person who longs for adventure. Not everyone's goal in life is to get married and/or have children. She seems to want to DO things... Not be renowned but be known to be an adventurer and one to be called upon should the call arise, as was intimated at the end.

Oh, I'm sure, it's just that Middle Earth isn't a DnD campaign. I suppose they are trying to have her echo Aragorn as Stridor and his years of wandering much like his forefathers. It's just an odd mindset for a princess, denying her femininity and all the access to power her hand in marriage could bring.

In "the real world" her cousin would probably have her killed or at least packed off to a secure nunnery to keep her or any future children from being threats. So maybe she is kinda choosing exile to avoid a war of succession.

 

[DeafTourette]

Oh, I'm sure, it's just that Middle Earth isn't a DnD campaign. I suppose they are trying to have her echo Aragorn as Stridor and his years of wandering much like his forefathers. It's just an odd mindset for a princess, denying her femininity and all the access to power her hand in marriage could bring.

In "the real world" her cousin would probably have her killed or at least packed off to a secure nunnery to keep her or any future children from being threats. So maybe she is kinda choosing exile to avoid a war of succession.

Her family is very close and her father was kind but tough. His sons weren't brutes but they also longed for Battle (see if their names aren't a bit familiar from Two Towers). She's wild and free, her father gave her a lot of leeway. She was very feminine but that doesn't mean she wasn't also a shieldmaiden of Rohan (was Eowyn any less feminine because SHE was a shieldmaiden?). Helm is very much like his GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT nephew, Théoden.

Seriously, just watch the movie all the way through and don't get distracted. Treat it as if you're WATCHING a book and the words on the pages are given voice and form. Don't treat it as a movie.

 

[jason10mm]

Her family is very close and her father was kind but tough. His sons weren't brutes but they also longed for Battle (see if their names aren't a bit familiar from Two Towers). She's wild and free, her father gave her a lot of leeway. She was very feminine but that doesn't mean she wasn't also a shieldmaiden of Rohan (was Eowyn any less feminine because SHE was a shieldmaiden?). Helm is very much like his GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT nephew, Théoden.

I think you are forgetting the fate of Eowyn. She falls in love with Faramir and gives up her wild abandon in order to settle down and help him rule.

Its lengthy, but why not go straight to the book....
***********************************************
‘Then if you will have it so, lady,’ he said: ‘you do not go, because only your brother called for you, and to look on the Lord Aragorn, Elendil’s heir, in his triumph would now bring you no joy. Or because I do not go, and you desire still to be near me. And maybe for both these reasons, and you yourself cannot choose between them. Éowyn, do you not love me, or will you not?’

‘I wished to be loved by another,’ she answered. ‘But I desire no man’s pity.’

‘That I know,’ he said. ‘You desired to have the love of the Lord Aragorn. Because he was high and puissant, and you wished to have renown and glory and to be lifted far above the mean things that crawl on the earth. And as a great captain may to a young soldier he seemed to you admirable. For so he is, a lord among men, the greatest that now is. But when he gave you only understanding and pity, then you desired to have nothing, unless a brave death in battle. Look at me, Éowyn!’

And Éowyn looked at Faramir long and steadily; and Faramir said: ‘Do not scorn pity that is the gift of a gentle heart, Éowyn! But I do not offer you my pity. For you are a lady high and valiant and have yourself won renown that shall not be forgotten; and you are a lady beautiful, I deem, beyond even the words of the elven-tongue to tell. And I love you. Once I pitied your sorrow. But now, were you sorrowless, without fear or any lack, were you the blissful Queen of Gondor, still I would love you. Éowyn, do you not love me?’

Then the heart of Éowyn changed, or else at last she understood it. And suddenly her winter passed, and the sun shone on her. ‘I stand in Minas Anor, the Tower of the Sun,’ she said; ‘and behold! the Shadow has departed! I will be a shieldmaiden no longer, nor vie with the great Riders, nor take joy only in the songs of slaying. I will be a healer, and love all things that grow and are not barren.’ And again she looked at Faramir. ‘No longer do I desire to be a queen,’ she said.
*********************************
So if Eowyn was the inspiration for Hera, they lost that last bit where she matures (and, in a sense, has to have a reasonable appraisal of herself and her likely options in life).

 

[Fbh]

The only redeemable feature of this movie is that it has a few nice looking stills.

Other than that the story is boring, the characters are boring and it's horribly animated.

 

[Neolombax]

Watched it on HBO, it was okay. I found the plot quite bland, but powered through to the end regardless. They could've done better animation wise too I felt.

 

[DeafTourette]

I think you are forgetting the fate of Eowyn. She falls in love with Faramir and gives up her wild abandon in order to settle down and help him rule.

Its lengthy, but why not go straight to the book....
***********************************************
‘Then if you will have it so, lady,’ he said: ‘you do not go, because only your brother called for you, and to look on the Lord Aragorn, Elendil’s heir, in his triumph would now bring you no joy. Or because I do not go, and you desire still to be near me. And maybe for both these reasons, and you yourself cannot choose between them. Éowyn, do you not love me, or will you not?’

‘I wished to be loved by another,’ she answered. ‘But I desire no man’s pity.’

‘That I know,’ he said. ‘You desired to have the love of the Lord Aragorn. Because he was high and puissant, and you wished to have renown and glory and to be lifted far above the mean things that crawl on the earth. And as a great captain may to a young soldier he seemed to you admirable. For so he is, a lord among men, the greatest that now is. But when he gave you only understanding and pity, then you desired to have nothing, unless a brave death in battle. Look at me, Éowyn!’

And Éowyn looked at Faramir long and steadily; and Faramir said: ‘Do not scorn pity that is the gift of a gentle heart, Éowyn! But I do not offer you my pity. For you are a lady high and valiant and have yourself won renown that shall not be forgotten; and you are a lady beautiful, I deem, beyond even the words of the elven-tongue to tell. And I love you. Once I pitied your sorrow. But now, were you sorrowless, without fear or any lack, were you the blissful Queen of Gondor, still I would love you. Éowyn, do you not love me?’

Then the heart of Éowyn changed, or else at last she understood it. And suddenly her winter passed, and the sun shone on her. ‘I stand in Minas Anor, the Tower of the Sun,’ she said; ‘and behold! the Shadow has departed! I will be a shieldmaiden no longer, nor vie with the great Riders, nor take joy only in the songs of slaying. I will be a healer, and love all things that grow and are not barren.’ And again she looked at Faramir. ‘No longer do I desire to be a queen,’ she said.
*********************************
So if Eowyn was the inspiration for Hera, they lost that last bit where she matures (and, in a sense, has to have a reasonable appraisal of herself and her likely options in life).

Why does she have to get married and have kids to mature?

Just watch the movie. Treat it as a book come to life... Not as a "movie".

 

[IDKFA]

Just watch the movie. Treat it as a book come to life... Not as a "movie".

What does this mean? Isn't that what a movie is anyway? A book (or original screenplay) adapted to screen so it "comes to life".

It's also hard to separate this POS with Tolkien's work, especially when it further disrespects the man's legacy.

 

[Saber]

In "the real world" her cousin would probably have her killed or at least packed off to a secure nunnery to keep her or any future children from being threats. So maybe she is kinda choosing exile to avoid a war of succession.

Even thinking that way would give that stupid director way too much credit. Because we all know she chooses travel away with the older woman(gods know why) because shes a "free spirit". Choosing a character name over a box office bomb movie just because her name "sounds cool" is the epytome of incopetence.

 

[Leopold]

It wasn’t bad. Not enough action though, unfortunately. Some baffling decisions hampered it.

 

[jason10mm]

Why does she have to get married and have kids to mature?

'Cause that's what "maturing" is. She isn't some random woman of no consequence, she is ROYALTY, or close enough to it. Her position comes with duty, obligation, responsibilities. This is what maturing means, you realize that there are things bigger than yourself, that your own selfish whims and desires sometimes have to play second fiddle to the people in your care. Her land is devastated. She is the only daughter of Helm, his sons are dead, so she is the only link back to him and even if she isn't in line to rule, she can still forge powerful alliances through marriage and YES, those alliances are bound by children. Children are EVERYTHING, especially to a medieval world, as without children the entire population withers and dies. Children represent labor, resources, culture, lineage, an investment. So to think that the last direct bloodline of Helm would honor his memory and serve his (now her) people by just fucking off into the wilds is, YES, a very immature act.

Clearly in the book this unnamed daughter is either killed in the war or does, in fact, get married off to some lord in order to secure a border, cement a trade deal, or bind a wayward tribe closer. Thats the fate of almost ALL women of noble blood because that is their obligation to their people. That is the POWER of womanhood, their ability to something no man can do, which is bear children. But all those fancy gowns, the leisure time to ride horses and hunt, and a big bedroom at night comes with a price. She has a responsibility to her people because there is NO OTHER woman there that could secure a marriage even remotely as good as Hera could. If Hera understood this, if she GREW UP, she would realize that she could serve her people far better by a marriage that provided them food and shelter than by wandering the woods.

Of course a "modern" story can't show this character development, even though I've shown they could have EASILY grafted Eowyns realization into Hera so they could have A. been true to the source, B. shown an actual development arc to the character, and C. shown that she has to make sacrifices as well, the refusal to do this is the main issue I have with girlboss characters.

I bet they could have left 95% of the film as is and just altered the very end to incorporate this stuff and been better off. They even had the Eowyn actress narrate the damn thing, so they could have had her make the reference more obvious.

But I'll give it a more serious rewatch this weekend. I did miss parts of it for sure doing laundry and cooking food.