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[Linkstrikesback]

Hey guys uhm quick question.

What the fuck is going on in this thread.

Someone's gotta keep Dampé in business.

 

[GeoGonzo]

Honestly its all up to interpretation. Mario games in particular (And Nintendo games in general) like to keep a lot of their ideas vague because they want people to project themselves on them. Is the reason Link still doesn't talk.

Do you feel the Inklings are black and represent you in the game? Sure, that sounds great and I am glad they make you feel included. Allowed.

Do you feel they are not "human" and not black but "tanned". Well, if you want to be adamant about it and see it as more a biological and fictional character, or feel that a canon distinctioin has to be made, sure, have it your way. You can do that. Just be assured that just because you think you are right doesn't mean you are, unless you are a developer at Nintendo, in which case where the fuck is Mother 3 you jerk.

Just don't be assholes and impose your opinions on others as facts. Also, as a rule of thumb, don't make fun or less of the ideas of others just because you have different values and education. People tend to make less of the real problems of minorities when they haven't see them for themselves, and sure, things nowadays ARE better, but there is still inherent racism and a clear solution doesn't exist, so it makes sense people get hurt when you make light of said issues. You never make dead baby jokes to a woman who had a miscarriage, even if said incident happened 50 years ago. It may be a weird comparison, but it has clear weight.

And full disclosure, I am mexican with a caucasian mexican father and a afromexican mother. We don't have the same racial issues in mexico as they exist in USA or other places in the world, but assuming they are not worth discussing or analizing just because you don't care or they don't affect you is, well, shortsighted.

In regards to Mario and Nintendo in general, they are a traditional company that is getting better about including more representation in their games. They also make weird decisions when it comes to them, based mostly in what feels right for the tone of the game. This is the same company that forgot Mario Sunshine existed when making Splatoon, and the same company that apologized for not including gay couples in Tomodachi Life (And promising in delivering them for a possible sequel). The same company who decided to include minish people on BoTW because they felt they wouldn't survive.

And, more importantly, they had no obligation to include different color skins for the Inklings on Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. They could have just added orange girl and blue boy and be done. But they went above and beyond and added the option. That has to make it clear they wanted to make it an option, and one that made sense within the universe.

I hate quoting a long and recent post without adding much to the discussion, but SalvaPot nails every issue here. These darker skins are a good thing that shouldn't upset anyone.

 

[The Ummah]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

You missed the point completely. This fucking thread...

 

[foxuzamaki]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

The fuck

 

[azyless]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

I mean outside of the ridiculous leap in terms of genre, number of playable characters, etc., maybe ask yourself why you find it so morally wrong for minorities to want to be represented, and why you seem to think that "superb games" and "representation" are mutually exclusive terms.

 

[Messofanego]

Lol

Ok, man, go on with your race wars. Whatever makes you happy.

I'd rather have a meaningful discussion, so I'm out.

 

[Bulbasaur]

Pretty big deal, actually.

Why do people always have to step in to these threads to tell people that they don't care? We get it you're probably white.

This is a good post.

 

[Lovely Salsa]

Its a shame that as soon as I saw the thread title I knew there would be bans. We still have long ways to go

 

[MysteryM]

I'm Indian and I've never cared what protagonist represents me in a game, may it be a green yoshi, a female character (aloy) etc. I don't understand the need to even highlight it if I'm really being honest. They are video games.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Hey guys uhm quick question.

What the fuck is going on in this thread.

Idiots being upset that a group of gamers are identifying and enjoying darker toned inklings and hoping to see more diversity from nintendo, while at the same time explaining why 99% of anime characters are white. Then every once in a while "one of the good ones" person of color hops in and announces that they too are a person of color but they don't care what color their character is because they "don't see race" or whatever on their kumbiya shit as if they represent the collective group.

 

[Messofanego]

I'm Indian and I've never cared what protagonist represents me in a game, may it be a green yoshi, a female character (aloy) etc. I don't understand the need to even highlight it if I'm really being honest. They are video games.

See, your first statement is alright. That's your opinion. The second statement that's directed towards others is problematic because you're then using your personal opinion/belief to transfer onto others, not allowing them the freedom to take what they want from this. Not everyone else has to live or think like you. You might not care if your kind gets represented in videogames. Others do. End of story.

I care for south asian representation. I always go for brown skin tone of characters if I can. What's the harm in wanting diversity? Diversity still allows you the choice of not caring about representation.

This whole thing of "it's just videogames/movies/comic books/whatever other fiction thing" comes across as very immature. We wanted videogames to be taken seriously, and now that they are, we want to go back to thinking they're just toys with nothing to talk about? Media has an effect on our lives and it's good to comment on that cultural connection, otherwise, you might as well not talk about videogames because they're just braindead objects with no value or importance whatsoever.

 

[Izuna]

I mean if we are being honest with ourselves, we could say things like hair or noses but even then there is still a HUGE variety.

There's as much variety in dark skinned Africans as there are elsewhere.

So, I'm wondering what this Inkling needs to be recognizable as black when the other Inklings can be out of proportion and be a different race.

 

[BGBW]

anyways I wouldn't be at all opposed to when they torch the racist fucking stereotype accent out of mario games and make his voice generic just letting you play as black tan hispanic darker tone whatever mario. its not like the character is at all iconic because of his skin tone or even explicitly red and blue. My favourite marios wear a huge yellow cape or wear purple when theyre made of paper. a multitude of skintones wouldnt hurt the shell of a character or the gameplay

Would be interesting to hear what Italians think of Mario's accent, because, IMO, it's so over the top it kind of stops being a stereotype and just becomes the silly voice of Mario. Obviously, I'm not Italian so I can't really judge, but I could compare to the Swedish Chef, who's got a joke voice based on my background, and honestly, it's so silly that I don't take offence.

Also breaking down Mario into component parts to argue what parts of him are iconic is weird (especially as you dismiss the red which most would associate with him). Characters are a whole. Also to say he isn't iconic because of his skin tone kind of implies there's someone else who is, which is a really weird statement to make.

Moving away from Mario Kart, the reason the Inkling are good is they are a new character, that is also a customisable avatar, that does a good job of representation, when Nintendo has had a iffy history in that regard. While we could take Nintendo to task for the decisions they made in the 80s, that feels like a fool's errand, especially someone as iconic as Mario whose look is pretty set in stone. Energy should surely be focused on the now where change can happen (see Tomodachi Life's lack of representation for homosexual relationship which Nintendo did respond to and said they would fix in future instalments).

Finally, I must ask. What is a generic voice?

 

[Principate]

See, your first statement is alright. That's your opinion. The second statement that's directed towards others is problematic because you're then using your personal opinion/belief to transfer onto others, not allowing them the freedom to take what they want from this. Not everyone else has to live or think like you. You might not care if your kind gets represented in videogames. Others do. End of story.

I care for south asian representation. I always go for brown skin tone of characters if I can. What's the harm in wanting diversity? Diversity still allows you the choice of not caring about representation.

This whole thing of "it's just videogames/movies/comic books/whatever other fiction thing" comes across as very immature. We wanted videogames to be taken seriously, and now that they are, we want to go back to thinking they're just toys with nothing to talk about? Media has an effect on our lives and it's good to comment on that cultural connection, otherwise, you might as well not talk about videogames because they're just braindead objects with no value or importance whatsoever.

Even then it's like toys have no influence whatsoever on a child's perspective especially when combined with well everything else.

 

[PrimeX]

Finally, I must ask. What is a generic voice?

Stephen Hawking (sorry Stephen, you know we love you)

 

[Ran rp]

14 pages.

Subscribed, reading later.

edit: 666. Yeah, it's going to be bad lol.

 

[Izuna]

That squid has ambiguously brown skin and could be anything.

Until you define what black is, to you, you sound ridiculous and no one is going to take your side.

Are you debating your opinion or want to continuously state it?

 

[tsundoku]

Would be interesting to hear what Italians think of Mario's accent, because, IMO, it's so over the top it kind of stops being a stereotype and just becomes the silly voice of Mario. Obviously, I'm not Italian so I can't really judge, but I could compare to the Swedish Chef, who's got a joke voice based on my background, and honestly, it's so silly that I don't take offence.

Also breaking down Mario into component parts to argue what parts of him are iconic is weird (especially as you dismiss the red which most would associate with him). Characters are a whole. Also to say he isn't iconic because of his skin tone kind of implies there's someone else who is, which is a really weird statement to make.

Moving away from Mario Kart, the reason the Inkling are good is they are a new character, that is also a customisable avatar, that does a good job of representation, when Nintendo has had a iffy history in that regard. While we could take Nintendo to task for the decisions they made in the 80s, that feels like a fool's errand, especially someone as iconic as Mario whose look is pretty set in stone. Energy should surely be focused on the now where change can happen (see Tomodachi Life's lack of representation for homosexual relationship which Nintendo did respond to and said they would fix in future instalments).

Finally, I must ask. What is a generic voice?

six options including nolan north and laura bailey obviously.

id honestly rather nintendo characters didnt speak at all but fair shot on it being the 80s and them just carrying forward

for tomodachi life they said they promised they would consider possibilities like that when carrying forward but not that they would be actually inclusive

i definitely feel though that nintendo games and gameplay evolving have reached the point of monomyth. Especially in zelda to comedic effect where they had to lampshade it in their newest game by having link be his own forebear. I expected there to be a simplistic character creator in BotW and I wouldn't be opposed to a "jumpman/jumpperson" creator with at minimum a splatoon like set of customizations where you save luigi and or mario and or the (princes)s(es) for new 3d and 2d mario titles.

I just dont see what the main characters contribute to Nintendo games any more when things that dont change like zelda/ganon/mastersword/stars/sprites/animalsuits/mushrooms/fireflowers and all the real gameplay glue are the real things that dont change

even sonic as a brand recently survived a pretty heavy redesign and inclusion of a brand new character as a "main four". What if the next sonic boom has you make-your-own-5$-deviantart-fursona hedgehog or fox?

 

[azyless]

Until you define what black is, to you, you sound ridiculous and no one is going to take your side.

Are you debating your opinion or want to continuously state it?

I haven't followed the discussion but how is this specific message wrong ? Plenty of people in Mediterranean countries have the same skin tone has the inkling boy for example, and I've never heard anyone refer to them as "black".
Acting as if skin tone alone is enough to determine whether you're black or not is a little reductive imo.

 

[Platy]

1. What makes you sure?

2. Have you BEEN to Japan or watched TV? Mainstream Japanese media is increasingly inclusive and informative about diversity.

3. While I agree that Japan is a very, very racist country, Nintendo aren't Johnny's

Yes. Japan has a way to link dark skin with rural areas because they get tanned

Your argument for japan not being racist is "I saw black people on the tv". Let that sink in for a while.

You even agree in the third point =P

For nintendo being japan centric ... just ... look at everything they ever made. I mean we had a thread recently about how much idols nintendo has recently. Also the already mentioned Animal Crossing black skin fiasco.

But like I said before... it is AMAZING that we have this black skin inklings in Mario kart because this kind of stuff will not be known by the kids who will feel represented in the ocident =D

 

[Izuna]

I haven't followed the discussion but how is this specific message wrong ? Plenty of people in Mediterranean countries have the same skin tone has the inkling boy for example, and I've never heard anyone refer to them as "black".
Acting as if skin tone alone is enough to determine whether you're black or not is a little reductive imo.

No, but what does this inkling need to be black?

He came in acting all confused as to why people considered her black.

Race is far more complicated but black as a general term is used that way.

Also we are for sure talking about the girl.

 

[Izuna]

Yes. Japan has a way to link dark skin with rural areas because they get tanned

Your argument for japan not being racist is "I saw black people on the tv". Let that sink in for a while.

You even agree in the third point =P

For nintendo being japan centric ... just ... look at everything they ever made. I mean we had a thread recently about how much idols nintendo has recently. Also the already mentioned Animal Crossing black skin fiasco.

But like I said before... it is AMAZING that we have this black skin inklings in Mario kart because this kind of stuff will not be known by the kids who will feel represented in the ocident =D

No, not tanned, there are darker skinned Japanese people period. They don't need to be in the sun to unlock their darkness.

You're trying to say that Nintendo are racist af so they wouldn't want a black character in their game, and making that as a point that this inkling can't be.

As for Japan being a racist country, I am more referring to Asian racism which is far more of a problem than the treatment of black people within Japan.

~~

But yes, it's cool.

 

[azyless]

No, but what does this inkling need to be black?

He came in acting all confused as to why people considered her black.

Race is far more complicated but black as a general term is used that way.

Also we are for sure talking about the girl.

Well as I said I didn't follow the entire conversation, and if they were talking about inkling girl the case is probably harder to make.
Without any further context, boy inkling could be a variety of things that would never be called black, specially outside of north America.

 

[Izuna]

Well as I said I didn't follow the entire conversation, and if they were talking about inkling girl the case is probably harder to make.
Without any further context, boy inkling could be a variety of things that would never be called black, specially outside of north America.

I agree. He has my skin color and I'm a mixed kebab.

 

[Weltall Zero]

Becasue then there would be a lot of pointless thread about when every race/skin etc represented in a video game.

That... doesn't sound all that pointless to me. *shrug*

 

[Lightning_Roller]

The fuck happened to this thread? Can't have a normal thread about race or diversity without morons ruining it.

 

[RRockman]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

No one said or implied anything about changing the race of pre-established characters. The inklings were already established to come in black skintones in their own game. Who are you talking too?

 

[Garrett Hawke]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

You should change your avatar because your post is exactly the kind of nonsense Star Trek went up against when they decided to have an interracial kiss on screen, you're shitting on that legacy.

 

[gogojira]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

This is a stupid fucking post.

 

[Kebiinu]

Absolutely no one in this topic said, "These Inklings are BLACK, straight from the motherland! Every other race can suck it!" it's been clear from jump that it's about representation of PoC, which includes afrocentric minorities, minorities of Latino background, dark skinned humans...

The people in this topic arguing, "Well...you guys said they're black, and my skin tone is the same, and I'm just a dark skinned Italian!" are completely missing the point.

Not only that, but Black people are misrepresented, oppressed, and ridiculed on a daily. Outside and within the US. It honestly seems like y'all just have a problem with black people identifying themselves within the Inklings.

If YOU feel like they're not black in culture,
(which is lol just based on how urban the series is) and you'd rather they be a dark skinned Asian, that's on you. Nobody is knocking on your race or your representation. So don't knock ours. Don't come into a topic celebrating people of color, knocking on PoC because we're ALL minorities. Believe it or not.

Also, the word 'black' is unanimous for meaning "Not white". Because honestly in this world, there's white people, and then there's everyone else.

Black is beautiful too. Fucking love my race.

 

[What did he mean by this?]

Black isnt a race, black isnt an ethnicity
On this Planet Earth, having black skin implies a certain racial heritage. But in this Nintendoland, we have no idea what it means.
I think OP was just glad to see a dark-skinned playable character.
So to say "well can we get a Latino inkling" "why do black people get everything" "how do we know those inklings are black and not Mediterranean" "looks Indian to me" doesnt really make any sense.
And trying to argue the little creature is tanned is just trying to spit in the face of someone's happiness which is rude tbh!

 

[Nepenthe]

If the Inkling Girl is a medium weight character, I know exactly who I'm using just to piss you busters off. Getting mad at black people for identifying with dark skinned characters; fucking ridiculous.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

They're Cephalopods.

Heptapods are cooler

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Anime Characters are mostly what Japenese think they would want to look like with their immense big eyes, there are only a few Anime that opt for a more realistic approach. So Anime Characters are some kind of a very specific half breed between Caucasian(eyes) and Asian(faces).

What kind of ignorant nonsense is this?

 

[jrDev]

What? I never said they aren't a PoC.

Just why they're black when they're literally the most ambiguous dark skinned things possible.

It's like as soon as a character with a tiny bit of melanin shows up people forget about every other non white in the world and jump straight to black.



It's not you or your OP's fault for anything.

So, why exactly are you arguing about this, I really don't understand? Even if you don't think they are black why do you think you need to say this when all the thread was about is black representation and people being happy?

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

It's probably up there.

The inklings are honestly among my favourite Nintendo designs ever, they just ooze personality, and the diversity is awesome.

I'd like them more if the proportions were closer to that of characters in ARMS, and much less "chibi."

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Some of you guys smh, try putting yourselves in someone elses shoes before you go and shit on their parade. Hopefully this is the first step of many to introduce a more diverse cast to nintendo, it would be great to see a black mario princess or character, or the option to play as a black, asian, or latino link in the next zelda if they give us more creation Options.

Absolutely not. They should be creating new characters who are black/latino/asian and more by default.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

And yet Nintendo isn't making games exclusively for Japan.

Actually, for the most part, everything they do is done with the Japanese market in mind, often to their detriment.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

doesn't America buy more games than Japan?

Yes, and that fact makes NCL's often extreme level of Japan-centricity look all the more nonsensical. Things do seem to be changing a bit in recent times, so that's promising.

 

[SolidSnakesMyStepDad]

This thread shoulda been closed 10 pages ago. Holy crap. Can't wait to play this game tho. I'm a Rosalina main tho

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

This thread shoulda been closed 10 pages ago. Holy crap. Can't wait to play this game tho. I'm a Rosalina main tho

Thread dont need to be closed. They can delete some posts or ban people but dont close it

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Could we expect a PoC lead character from nintendo in the future?

As long as NCL's running things, you're not likely to ever see that.

 

[Jaded Alyx]

As long as NCL's running things, you're not likely to ever see that.

Ever Oasis
Also Xenoblade Chronicles X.. Elma is basically the main character.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Every kid deserves to look at a game like Mario Kart and say "hey, that person is like me!" I don't understand what is so radical about wanting people to feel included i popular franchises.

It just reminds me how much of a shame I think it is that Arms is halfassing it so hard. They so very clearly want to hit that Overwatch-esque cast of quirky characters but it just falls so flat in comparison when its a cavalcade of white-slash-Japanese characters like every other Japanese franchise under the sun.

This. I hope the eventual full roster has much more diversity, but since this is NCL we're talking about here, I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Malyse]

Privilege, Supremacy, and Racism. We got all the flavors in this thread.

 

[ScriptedReality]

Guess who I'm playing as.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

I didn't assign a race to any of the characters inherently because you can have dark skin and not identify as black and vice versa. But the whole point of having skin tone options is so someone can actually pick one that represnts them. Why the fuck does how people identfy with a character bug some of yall so much?

 

[Platy]

OMG now I realise I want a black Mario and white Ganondorf!
Oh wait, no I don't... What is wrong with you ppl, this is a Japanese company creating superb fantasy games.

Actually Mario does look way too white for a an italian dude ... and the evil character being the only main black character in a series does raises some questions.

 

[Izuna]

I didn't assign a race to any of the characters inherently because you can have dark skin and not identify as black and vice versa. But the whole point of having skin tone options is so someone can actually pick one that represnts them. Why the fuck does how people identfy with a character bug some of yall so much?

Assign a race?

...

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Ever Oasis
Also Xenoblade Chronicles X.. Elma is basically the main character.

Nintendo didn't create the Ever Oasis character, or Elma for that matter.