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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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sonomamashine

sonomamashine

Member
TheThreadsThatBindUs said:
I disagree with this, actually.

I don’t think Lockhart will sell well at all. And while I agree that people don’t care about resolution, because the average consumer doesn’t have a clue, they will care about having the best console experience.

I do think the concept of Lockhart is fundamentally flawed. A next-gen console is by definition an upgrade. So the idea of a weaker upgrade just seems like a solution that’s undermining its own existence.

I think it’ll sell as well as the 20GB PS3s did; that is to say poorly. And will only become less desirable as the XSX comes down in price.

There’s also the factor to considers that Sony having a single console SKU will potentially have more flexibility in their ability to price their console as it moves towards EoL, because they won’t have to concern themselves with trying to keep a value differential between the premium and value console SKUs.
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according to you Lockhart wont sell because the consumer cares about having the best gaming experience, the same people you called clueless & don't care about resolution :messenger_clapping::messenger_clapping::messenger_clapping::messenger_clapping:
Lockhart is an upgrade since it will play the same games as XsX with the same details at 1080p since most of devs wont put the extra work, keep in mind that those consumers don't care about resolution because they are clueless right ?
Lockhart is made for the consumers who don't want to pay extra for 4K, the concept is not flawed at all.
All car companies should shut down because the ultimate driving machine is a Ferrari or a Lamborghini ... and consumers should only care about the ultimate driving experience :messenger_tears_of_joy:, it's about MONEY - PRICE.
According to you Lockhart wont sell well because XsX is better, why does cheaper cars outsells expensive cars ... ?
You can be sure that if the PS5 is not priced accordingly, Xbox (Lockhart) gonna outsell them for sure & create hype which will push it even further.
Lockhart will be priced very low since it will use cheaper parts & sell digital copies which will make them more money than CD's.
 
SportsFan581

SportsFan581

Member
Tenka Musou said:
Really?
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In what ways do you figure a 1080ti is limited by the existence of a 1050, just curious. The devs might not be happy, not saying that they are.

Really, look at some of the current gen ports on the Switch, they'll just scale down, and down, and down again if they have to.
 
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Tenka Musou

Tenka Musou

Banned
DaGamez said:
In what ways do you figure a 1080ti is limited by the existence of a 1050, just curious. The devs might not be happy, not saying that they are.
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PC games are always held back to accommodate lower-end hardware (and in the case of multiplats: consoles)... Pretty much every multiplatform game is made to run on the current gen outdated hardware, and then scaled up from there on superior PCs. Not the other way around.
 
Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Tenka Musou said:
PC games are always held back to accommodate lower-end hardware (and in the case of multiplats: consoles)... Pretty much every multiplatform game is made to run on the current gen outdated hardware, and then scaled up from there on superior PCs. Not the other way around.
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According to DF some of the latest games (Fallen Order, COD MW, RE2 Remake, etc.) have been made with midgen consoles in mind and therefore really struggle on base platforms. I think as the gen progresses and games become more demanding they will start focusing less and less on Lockhart.
 
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Tenka Musou

Tenka Musou

Banned
Reindeer said:
According to DF some of the latest games (Fallen Order, COD MW, RE2 Remake, etc.) have been made with midgen consoles in mind and therefore really struggle on base platforms. I think as the gen progresses and games become more demanding they will start focusing less and less on Lockhart.
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But they will have to accommodate 4TF for 7+ more years. They have to design their games in order to run in an acceptable way on Lockhart.
Probably more PS5/XBseX games targeting native 4k instead of increasing visual density at 1440p.
 
DJ12

DJ12

Member
Nickolaidas said:
My interpretation of Osiris' 'prophecy':

1) The PS5 is going to be more expensive than the Series X, but it won't cost 1.000$ like Pachter suggested it could. So it will be 550$-700$.

2) The PS5 dev kit got really hot AND really loud as the developers programmed games for it, but it will probably be a beast in terms of specs.

3) Developers are busting their asses trying to make games worthy of the 11-13 TFs the PS5 and Series X will possess to work with Lockheart which will prove to be a low-spec almost-last-gen console which will undoubtedly either drag next-gen multiplat games or will have lousy and crappy ports that no one will ever bother with.

4) First-Party games on the Series X won't be nearly as impressive as first-party PS5 games because they have to condone with that lousy thing, Lockheart.

and finally,

5) Fuck Lockheart.
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Why we all assuming the ps5 is the loud one afawk only one looks like it wouldn't be out of place in a kitchen.
 
Gamernyc78

Gamernyc78

Banned
TheThreadsThatBindUs said:
I disagree with this, actually.

I don’t think Lockhart will sell well at all. And while I agree that people don’t care about resolution, because the average consumer doesn’t have a clue, they will care about having the best console experience.

I do think the concept of Lockhart is fundamentally flawed. A next-gen console is by definition an upgrade. So the idea of a weaker upgrade just seems like a solution that’s undermining its own existence.

I think it’ll sell as well as the 20GB PS3s did; that is to say poorly. And will only become less desirable as the XSX comes down in price.

There’s also the factor to considers that Sony having a single console SKU will potentially have more flexibility in their ability to price their console as it moves towards EoL, because they won’t have to concern themselves with trying to keep a value differential between the premium and value console SKUs.
Click to expand...

I think having two skus instead of a middle ground console really doesn't make a difference. One sku will eat into the sales of another and in the end it'll be the same amount of sales tht a console in between the two would have garnered. Don't get me wrong though options are great.
 
Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Tenka Musou said:
But they will have to accommodate 4TF for 7+ more years. They have to design their games in order to run in an acceptable way on Lockhart.
Probably more PS5/XBseX games targeting native 4k instead of increasing visual density at 1440p.
Click to expand...
They'll run on Lockhart, but as the time goes on the games will seriously be scaled down and probably not hit targeted fps if Xbox One S is anything to go by.
 
Agnostic2020

Agnostic2020

Member
ethomaz said:
Because Sony having to change big to catch MS is good reason for them? lol
ERA never changes.
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This is not a reactionary thing. Sony has been dwveloping ps5 for longer than ms so its naturzl they have more revision.oberon b0 that was leaked might have been last year revision and oberonF0 is the production version
 
Lampiao

Lampiao

Member
Nickolaidas said:
This creates an interesting dilemma for the publishers.

The publishers must decide whether to make multiplat games which will look like high-quality PS4 games (because they will be dragged down by Lockheart who must be able to run said games) or release their games as PS5 exclusives in order to make games with jaw-dropping visuals and superior AI scripts.

If the PS5 sells more consoles than the Series X & Lockheart, they will undoubtedly take this route to both ensure max performance as well as sales. The MS consoles will suffer for it.

However, if the high price of the PS5 backfires and makes people flock to the Lockheart, they will have to make low-spec games in order to sell them. Also, if the first-party line-up of the PS5 is weak for the first two-three years, we could be looking at a PS3 'early years fiasco' and only have the console pick up the pace once its true first-party heavy hitters appear (as well as its price drops).

Interesting times, indeed. At least, as long as these things come to pass.
Click to expand...

Maybe this is what a user said SE Sony = Nintendo. Remember Square left Nintendo 64 cartridges and went to Sony with the CD on the Playstation?
Maybe microsoft's decision to put lockhart as a base makes some devs decide to go ps5 only.
 
Nickolaidas

Nickolaidas

Member
Lampiao said:
Maybe this is what a user said SE Sony = Nintendo. Remember Square left Nintendo 64 cartridges and went to Sony with the CD on the Playstation?
Maybe microsoft's decision to put lockhart as a base makes some devs decide to go ps5 only.
Click to expand...
Probably. But if the PS5 begins slow due to being very expensive, what will the publishers do then?

Like I said, interesting times.
 
xool

xool

Member
TeamGhobad said:
wtf is going on in here, iran news has kept me busy, did we get a new leak?
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Someone new been making fake cyberstalking posts about Geoff Keighley :


-Jay-Rod- said:
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DForce said:
You can create fake Instagram messages lol.
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i kNoW BoUt tHe xBoX ScArLeT ExClUsIvE TrAiLeR
Click to expand...

Also people getting their hopes up for a big disappointment at CES in about 24 hours when Sony shows a lot of new TVs and no fucking consoles..

And someone uploaded a new picture of the PS5 devkit, same as the old pictures

;tldr nothing
 
Felessan

Felessan

Member
Tenka Musou said:
But they will have to accommodate 4TF for 7+ more years. They have to design their games in order to run in an acceptable way on Lockhart.
Probably more PS5/XBseX games targeting native 4k instead of increasing visual density at 1440p.
Click to expand...
It strongly will depend on success of Lockhart and New Xbox series overall.
If Lockhart will perform poor, it will be either dropped from equation altogether or receives sub-par quick ports. And if situation remains the same as with PS4/X1, MS will have a hard time to persuade others to make weak and underperforming console as a baseline for games.
I doubt that third-party want to see a massive difference in perceived game quality between their own games and Sony first-party games, much bigger than usual, due to Lockhart restrictions. Because it will push sales away from them.
 
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Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
DJ12 said:
Someone put r600 on suicide watch he put all his eggs in Komachi's basket.

Even though one of his other twitter sources said and were still to deliver a big Navi for Sony...

Guess that's what happens when you only use what suits you story.
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Can't blame him when so many well respected publications were running with those leaks. For now we still don't know the specs so let's just wait and see.
 
Gamernyc78

Gamernyc78

Banned
Never paid most of these dudes mind. They were holding on to anything tht puts PS5 as less powerful because you know their honor was at stake🤔

Sony doesn't give a fuck about someone else's honor, they just care about coming out with the best console money can buy and what will keep tht market share momentum.

In Cerny I trust definitely over biased posters.
 
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Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Gamernyc78 said:
Never paid most of these dudes mind. They were holding on to anythinhvtht puts PS5 as less powerful because you know theur honor was at stake🤔

Sony doesn't give a fuck about someone else's honor, they just care about coming out with the best console money can buy and what will keep tht market share momentum.

In Cerny I trust definitely over biased posters.
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You guys are celebrating like the specs been announced lol. You overreacting over one tweet just like they were overreacting with the leaks.
 
Gamernyc78

Gamernyc78

Banned
Reindeer said:
You guys are celebrating like the specs been announced lol. You overreacting over one tweet just like they were overreacting with the leaks.
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Celebrating? Read my post history I'm saying what I've been saying based off the majority of the leaks. One tweet? You mean a tweet and several sources for months? Bro get off tht high horse you've been here reading all the leaks, like we all have. Tht github shit did not make me all of a sudden forget about the several industry ppl tht pointed at PS5 being stronger only idiots would weigh one source of info over so many others pointing in another direction. My belief has been constant due to the overwhelming sources saying ps5 is stronger or at very minimum up there in tflops

I don't celebrate shit like this, my life is more meaningful than tht lol
 
Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Agnostic2020 said:
I don’t think anyone should celebrate but it’s becoming apparent that the github stuff despite being true could indeed be old info
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I think some folks here are. The Github stuff was questionable and we all knew that, but I don't blame people going with it when so many credible sites and publications were making articles about it.
 
Agnostic2020

Agnostic2020

Member
Reindeer said:
I think some folks here are. The Github stuff was questionable and we all knew that, but I don't blame people going with it when so many credible sites and publications were making articles about it.
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True many sites like even DF took it as fact and published article about ps5 being 9.2TF

again we don’t know anything yet but at least now it can be challenged that ps5 doesn’t have to be necessarily be 9.2 TF
 
thicc_girls_are_teh_best

thicc_girls_are_teh_best

Member
Agnostic2020 said:
This is not a reactionary thing. Sony has been dwveloping ps5 for longer than ms so its naturzl they have more revision.oberon b0 that was leaked might have been last year revision and oberonF0 is the production version
Click to expand...

Realistically what do you expect a revision could bring at this point so close to launch? We know that these systems are 7nm, not 7nm+, so they will not be full-blown RDNA2. AMD only has wafer allocations budget targeted towards 7nm, they can't just magically get 7nm+ wafers if the fabs won't or can't allocate them.

And that latest Oberon spec was listed as July 2019...only a few months old. I know a few months in the tech world is an eternity (or it used to be), but for console development that's relatively stable (which I'd imagine PS5 is), that's somewhat recent.

We still don't know how accurate that leak's info was but it seems mostly accurate. Customizations to the silicon and PCB, SSD, RAM amount (if it's 256-bit bus it could be 8GB (highly unlikely), 16GB (very likely), 12GB (likely) or 32GB (not very likely; would require 16x 2GB chips in clamshell mode) etc. are unknown.
 
Gamernyc78

Gamernyc78

Banned
Reindeer said:
I think some folks here are. The Github stuff was questionable and we all knew that, but I don't blame people going with it when so many credible sites and publications were making articles about it.
Click to expand...

I blame them after so many (some reputable ppl) said the opposite. Not even tht, Matt said if ppl relied on tht info they'd be disappointed. Fanboys were the only ones holding on to tht info like the holy grail. And I have a long list lol best believe I'll point it out to them when the megabomb drops.

We already know how DF gets down and other sites for them clicks 😏
 
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Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Gamernyc78 said:
Celebrating? Read my post history I'm saying what I've been saying based off the majority of the leaks. One tweet? You mean a tweet and several sources for months? Bro get off tht high horse you've been here reading all the leaks, like we all have. Tht github shit did not make me all of a sudden forget about the several industry ppl tht pointed at PS5 being stronger only idiots would weigh one source of info over so many others pointing in another direction. My belief has been constant due to the overwhelming sources saying ps5 is stronger or at very minimum up there in tflops

I don't celebrate shit like this, my life is more meaningful than tht lol
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Your belief was based on putting faith in Sony and some of the insiders, the people who disagreed with you had actual data. I agree that data was questionable and inconclusive, but the way you make it sound is like you had cold facts at hand and other people were just making up fantasies.
 
Reindeer

Reindeer

Member
Gamernyc78 said:
I blame them after so many (some reputable ppl) said the opposite. Not even tht, Matt said if ppl relied on tht info they'd be disappointed. Fanboys were the only ones holding on to tht info like the holy grail. And I have a long list lol best believe I'll point it out to them when the megabomb drops.
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So you are saying DF and every other site that posted that data are fanboys? I think you guys need some perspective and have way too much emotion invested in this.
 
Agnostic2020

Agnostic2020

Member
thicc_girls_are_teh_best said:
Realistically what do you expect a revision could bring at this point so close to launch? We know that these systems are 7nm, not 7nm+, so they will not be full-blown RDNA2. AMD only has wafer allocations budget targeted towards 7nm, they can't just magically get 7nm+ wafers if the fabs won't or can't allocate them.

And that latest Oberon spec was listed as July 2019...only a few months old. I know a few months in the tech world is an eternity (or it used to be), but for console development that's relatively stable (which I'd imagine PS5 is), that's somewhat recent.

We still don't know how accurate that leak's info was but it seems mostly accurate. Customizations to the silicon and PCB, SSD, RAM amount (if it's 256-bit bus it could be 8GB (highly unlikely), 16GB (very likely), 12GB (likely) or 32GB (not very likely; would require 16x 2GB chips in clamshell mode) etc. are unknown.
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I definitely see the clock lowered and CU increased and RT added to gpu.

Let’s not forget Navi was created for Sony . Arial code (2017 ps5 gpu) is 1000 in amd book which means the mother of all Navi GPUs according to amd coding. So I m sure Sony has access to latest Navi cards if so they choose.
 
Bogroll

Bogroll

Likes moldy games
TheThreadsThatBindUs said:
You only need to Google “loud X1X console” to see just how prevalent the occurrence of loud Xbox console is too. And that’s expected, because the Hovis method MS uses creates an additional degree of variability in the console acoustics and power consumption.

The fact that people meme something in a closed community doesn’t really mean anything in the grand scheme of things, and given just how many PS4 have been sold versus Xboxes, it stands to reason that statistically there’s will be a higher absolute number of users with abnormally loud consoles, even if the percentage of loud consoles overall was lower than for xbox. So you need to look at things in perspective.

The core point, however, is that memes on Internet forums and anecdotal evidence of defective consoles, doesn't prove that Sony is shit at designing console cooling solutions (which is your original point I was arguing against). It just means that some unfortunate folks were unlucky in their console purchase, which is inescapable regardless of the cooling system and console accoustic performance design.

It’s an issue of manufacturing variability, not poor design.
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You don't need to google it, I've 3 Ps4's all loud, I've go2 Xbx's both quiet. Friends and work colleges all experienced the same.

I moved my XbX the other day, i was like woah forgot how heavy it was but it felt like a quality well built item. I moved my Pro it creaked like Spanish Armada. If they were cars it's like jumping out of a luxury German saloon car into a Dacia Sandero.
 
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pawel86ck

pawel86ck

Banned
Nickolaidas said:
I'm checking on some pastebins and lol at the guy who says he's a developer and that PS5 is sometimes as strong as the Lockheart.

pastebin.com

START ///!*NEXT GEN LEAK*!I'm a developer for a AAA studio and I figured peo - Pastebin.com

Pastebin.com is the number one paste tool since 2002. Pastebin is a website where you can store text online for a set period of time.
pastebin.com pastebin.com
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6.5 TF lockhart would be much more interesting to 4TF because it would even run xbox x enhanced games as well and not to mention developers can do a lot on 6.5TF navi at 1080p.


But.... but PS5 7.5TF? Not even R600 would be happy 😂😅
 
DJ12

DJ12

Member
Agnostic2020 said:
I don’t think anyone should celebrate but it’s becoming apparent that the github stuff despite being true could indeed be old info
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Like no context hearn.

Probably an early devkit revision running high clocks to get as close to the retail unit as possible.

I imagine, unlike ms who mandate direct x, Sony need equivelant hardware in the devkits for their latest version of gnm.

Runs as fast as possible to get closer to the tflops target as possible while the actual Apu was still being worked on.
 
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