Support NeoGAF

[Desodeset]

In ideal conditions can be +20GB/s.

Do you have info about memory usage for games? Sony didn't mention dedicated memory for games and OS.

 

[Darius87]

I said I doubted the DATA of the memory being a bit odd, NOT the source, which would be the person. I had no reason to doubt the flops, Cu count and speed, they seemed to reflect what others were saying too. (And again, the original data they gave me was pretty much spot on, and they have me the 5th date hint, which was true as well) The person is as legit as they come as an industry professional, and a person I call a friend.

Though clearly you’re having trouble understanding basic things that have already been explained.

Seriously take your vendetta to the ban thread if you really feel like you’ve been treated poorly. This is just childish now.

so why don't you get vetted before posting your info if you so sure about your source? because memory doesn't look right? c'mon don't get angry because of me just put me on ignore.
or act so resentful for criticism that you'll pretend to leave this thread for good and come back next day

 

[wolffy71]

At the end of the day people are gonna believe what they want to

 

[-kb-]

They have disabled CUs for yield.

But they haven't at all tested for the higher clock speed. Yields are not just a monolithic thing that you do more thing to improve everything and increase the clock speed later because they are high enough.

 

[sinnergy]

But they haven't at all tested for the higher clock speed.

Says you ? Github was incomplete fake amirite .

 

[Gavin Stevens]

so why don't you get vetted before posting your info if you so sure about your source? because memory doesn't look right? c'mon don't get angry because of me just put me on ignore.
or act so resentful for criticism that you'll pretend to leave this thread for good and come back next day

I sent all my info to Mod of War to be looked at BEFORE posting.

Now you're just trolling, for the sake of trolling, and its stinking up the discussion. As I've said already, take it to the ban thread if you want to talk about it there, or PM me. But right now, you're acting the idiot.

 

[xool]

When’s the next big “event” that we know of now? E3 timeframe?

I would imagine that come next showing, you will see a completely different Sony, a total 180 to this... whatever you want to call this way of showing off your product is.

I dunno everything is cancelled. Looking forward to seeing the cooling for PS5 though. We still need Watts figures too.

History teaches us that once a VG company starts to f up, they keep doing it for a long time. We saw the warning signs - a logo reveal, silence, more silence, now this talk ..

Yeah, indeed E3. Wondering if Microsoft might drop info on Lockhart before that. To keep the hype going, would be weird to stop this marketing campaign for 3 months, right? Maybe they'll already show some games or demos.

MS is on a roll .. I'd actually be exited for a Lockhart reveal right now, even though it's something I always said I didn't even want to exist ..

 

[ethomaz]

See I think that's where the SSD speed will come into it.

There's a lot of stuff going on here and I don't think we know the half of it yet.

SSD is a unknown variable yet because it open to devs a series of options that they couldn’t implement neither on PC.

So it where this generation gaming will go to a path never done before and innovate.

 

[Fulcizombie]

Each console has it own set of problems.

What about games that use more than 10GB RAM? Devs will need to deal with slow memory access on Xbox.

On PS5 devs will need to deal with their workload to get the max of the system.

I doubt that utilizing the extra 3.5 GBs of quite fast memory anyway will be a similar issue to trying to balance the clock speeds between the cpu and the gpu to get a reasonably good result on the underpowered ps5 and that is assuming Sony has an amazing cooling solution to even allow these theoretical clock speeds to be used.

 

[Shmunter]

Can't wait to see what Naughty Dog will do. Mark my words. SSD magic and ingenuity will beat raw flOPs.

I wonder if moneyhatting wars will be more prominent this gen. E.g Sony throwing money at 3rd party devs to exploit their system as priority etc.

If a game is designed around streaming in assets at 8gig/sec, Then XsX would need to make do with half the quality of said assets, or half framerate, etc.

DF must be licking their chops at the prospects, I wouldn’t blame them.

 

[-kb-]

Says you ? Github was incomplete fake amirite .

You dont ditch chips that are good, for something that is huge and on a expensive node for giggles.

 

[LokusAbriss]

Each console has it own set of problems.

What about games that use more than 10GB RAM? Devs will need to deal with slow memory access on Xbox.

On PS5 devs will need to deal with their workload to get the max of the system.

Did Sony say how much the OS will use of their 16GB Ram?

 

[xool]

I think I worked the PS5 talk out .. everyone was supposed to be asleep by the time the TF figure was revealed.

 

[Agnostic2020]

Did Sony say how much the OS will use of their 16GB Ram?

No nothing about os ram .weird

 

[ethomaz]

I doubt that utilizing the extra 3.5 GBs of quite fast memory anyway will be a similar issue to trying to balance the clock speeds between the cpu and the gpu to get a reasonably good result on the underpowered ps5 and that is assuming Sony has an amazing cooling solution to even allow these theoretical clock speeds to be used.

Cerny already said the cooling solution was something they looked at PS4 Pro and did better.
So you probably won’t have that situation again:

Said that we will need to see... deal with slow RAM is more complicated than a CPU and/or GPU clocked at less than 5% of the peak.

 

[Handy Fake]

I doubt that utilizing the extra 3.5 GBs of quite fast memory anyway will be a similar issue to trying to balance the clock speeds between the cpu and the gpu to get a reasonably good result on the underpowered ps5 and that is assuming Sony has an amazing cooling solution to even allow these theoretical clock speeds to be used.

Thing is, I can't see Cerny making that decision unless he has the architecture in place to make it work. He's a clever onion that one.

 

[ethomaz]

Did Sony say how much the OS will use of their 16GB Ram?

I didn’t see anything about yet.

 

[Thedtrain]

If the performance difference was so minimal then why wouldn’t they just fix the clocks?

There’s got to be a benefit to this layout

I’d guess it allows them to eke out the most performance possible

 

[xool]

Yea 10 to 10.3 tf at all times . And even he said the 2% drop barely happens when we reach the critical heavy load

I think they'll down/upclock to meet frame times eg 16.6ms etc .. no point running at 2.2GHz if you can hit 30/60fps at 2.05 .. that's what I think will happen .. will be dynamic (plus other tricks like dynamic resolution etc)

 

[ZywyPL]

Makes sense, but the longer you wait the less need there is for a 1080p console.

Not really, many people sit on 32/40/42" TV just because they don't need bigger ones, or they simply don't have enough space for a bigger set, and they will keep those TV for the next decade or two even no matter the ongoing trends.

 

[Fulcizombie]

I wonder if moneyhatting wars will be more prominent this gen. E.g Sony throwing money at 3rd party devs to exploit their system as priority etc.

If a game is designed around streaming in assets at 8gig/sec, Then XsX would need to make do with half the quality of said assets, or half framerate, etc.

DF must be licking their chops at the prospects, I wouldn’t blame them.

And what exactly would draw these amazing assets , that the XSX would have to reduce to half of their quality or frame rate, the hidden ultra powerful PS5 gpu ? Some of the takes are simply wow !!! We are at a stage where computers, because that is what consoles are, are working differently that what we had known until.....yesterday. But have fun waiting for all these, at double the frame or double the asset quality , ps5 games to appear.

 

[Darius87]

I sent all my info to Mod of War to be looked at BEFORE posting.

Now you're just trolling, for the sake of trolling, and its stinking up the discussion. As I've said already, take it to the ban thread if you want to talk about it there, or PM me. But right now, you're acting the idiot.

so why sending infos to mods everytime rather to get vetted? is that much of a difference? others got banned for pretending to be insiders with theyr infos, i'm just curious why not you?

 

[Reindeer]

Just watched Good Old Gamer's video and he pretty said the obvious, that you cannot store any serious game data in SSD because of how slow it is compared to GDDR6. SSD is mainly there to eliminate load times and make certain less demanding data accessible faster.

 

[Agnostic2020]

In ideal conditions can be +20GB/s.

Damn thats crazy. Do you think ps5 can keep up with xsx performance wise ? I m assuming resolutions will be 15% lower due to gpu being 15% weaker .


Any comments on that ? Thanks man

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Each console has it own set of problems.

What about games that use more than 10GB RAM? Devs will need to deal with slow memory access on Xbox.

On PS5 devs will need to deal with their workload to get the max of the system.

From what I've seen:

SX has 10gb gddr6 that's @ 560GB/s and 6gb gddr6 @ at 336GB/s
PS5 has 16gb gddr6 @ 448GB/s

What to take from this?

First of all, this memory for the SX is NOT splitpool. So that needs to be moved away from instantly. However, there is 16gb total, and the OS takes up 2.5 of that. While I can understand the worry that there is some "slower" memory in there, you need to understand that some things you get into and out of memory don't require ultra fast speeds, and as such this will be utilised by the slower memory portion. This already happens in gaming RIGHT NOW, where you have some things that require fast response and some things that require slow, and this slower pool of memory will not speed up, or slow down, performance. What it WILL do however is free up valuable resources elsewhere, so that they can be put to better use (because to fully utilise the speed of the memory to its max potential requires valuable resources to be taken from elsewhere. Less max speed? Less to be taken).

What we don't know, is what the PS5 is doing with its memory. It appears to be a solid chunk of GDDR6, at a constant speed. But is the OS part of this? I was told before that they are doing something else here, and the chatter lead me to believe they may be utilising the SSD for the OS function rather than the memory. That could, in theory, allow the full 16gb to be used. However that's guess work on my behalf, and as such its safe to assume at this time they will be using 16gb GDDR 6 and taking a small portion of that for the OS.

So, they may both actually end up with the same available memory for games, but SX will still be using the faster memory for the most important things.

 

[xHunter]

Possible... possible...

But then, I’m of the opinion here that maybe they should have just not said anything at all like this. They couldn’t do an info drop, because people will only see the numbers, as this all proves.

It was a tricky position to be in really, I don’t envy them. Personally, the only way forward now is to let the tech do the talking. But as you said... to do that, means people may look at the upcoming games and go “oh, this looks shit now” lol.

Really weird situation to be in for them. I honestly don’t know what their best strategy is here.

I doubt that they are waiting to show games because of the last of us ( or other games). It didnt stop them in 2013 when they showed killzone, driveclub and infamous when the first last of us game came out 4 months later.

After seeing the talk, i think they should have published a blog post on tuesday with the spec sheets and then tell people that there is going to be a in depth talk about the hardware on wednesday, which probably would have been better overall.

 

[Shio]

Does anyone think this will be the shape of the PS5 console? Why such a random shape ?

reminds me a bit of the PS3 slim shape, maybe just enough to squeeze in PS3, PS2, PS1 under there

 

[Agnostic2020]

Just watched Good Old Gamer's video and he pretty said the obvious, that you cannot store any serious game data in SSD because of how slow it is compared to GDDR6. SSD is mainly there to eliminate load times and make certain less demanding data accessible faster.

Yea i assume LOD will be better with better ssd and less pop in for next gen .

Another thing is that ssd keeps the path for gpu and cpu operation clear as it provides the necessary info extremely fast so they can run more efficiently .

 

[Fulcizombie]

Cerny already said the cooling solution was something they looked at PS4 Pro and did better.
So you probably won’t have that situation again:

Said that we will need to see... deal with slow RAM is more complicated than a CPU and/or GPU clocked at less than 5% of the peak.

What slow Ram ? The majority of the ram used for games is much faster on the XSX plus the bus speed is much faster too . Oh and I would hope that they would have a better cooling solution than pro or else the ps5s will either start exploding or taking off and start flying. They don’t need a better cooling solution than the horrible solution on the pro, they need something amazing.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

so why sending infos to mods everytime rather to get vetted? is that much of a difference? others got banned for pretending to be insiders with theyr infos, i'm just curious why not you?

Ok, you're going on ignore, because you clearly have too much time on your hands and are fucking up the thread. but I'll answer this one last time. All my info was sent to Mod of War and he was asked if I could post it, and I did. Getting "vetted" is the same bloody thing. I was a secondary contact who passed on info, and as such all of that was proven. If you want to "vet" me yourself, I've got more than enough shit out there, from retail games I've worked on, indie titles and the like. Hell, nvidia recently had their head of gaming technologies send me a damn 2080ti for my work on Q2RTX. So please, vet me yourself if you think I've made the whole thing up. But for now? Welcome to the club, enjoy the soup.

 

[LokusAbriss]

I didn’t see anything about yet.

It just feels liks Sony is nowhere near a final product. Maybe it is not clear, how much RAM their OS will need. Not that it is a problem, because we are far, far from release day.

On the other hand, it is pretty impressive to see Microsoft with a finished product and OS features that already work.

 

[Shmunter]

And what exactly would draw these amazing assets , that the XSX would have to reduce to half of their quality or frame rate, the hidden ultra powerful PS5 gpu ? Some of the takes are simply wow !!! We are at a stage where computers, because that is what consoles are, are working differently that what we had known until.....yesterday. But have fun waiting for all these, at double the frame or double the asset quality , ps5 games to appear.

Why the hostility bro? The PS5 has been announced, check out the ssd speed on the thing. It streams shit, faster than anything before it. Do the homework and rest in the comfort of knowledge.

 

[Fulcizombie]

From what I've seen:

SX has 10gb gddr6 that's @ 560GB/s and 6gb gddr6 @ at 336GB/s
PS5 has 16gb gddr6 @ 448GB/s

What to take from this?

First of all, this memory for the SX is NOT splitpool. So that needs to be moved away from instantly. However, there is 16gb total, and the OS takes up 2.5 of that. While I can understand the worry that there is some "slower" memory in there, you need to understand that some things you get into and out of memory don't require ultra fast speeds, and as such this will be utilised by the slower memory portion. This already happens in gaming RIGHT NOW, where you have some things that require fast response and some things that require slow, and this slower pool of memory will not speed up, or slow down, performance. What it WILL do however is free up valuable resources elsewhere, so that they can be put to better use (because to fully utilise the speed of the memory to its max potential requires valuable resources to be taken from elsewhere. Less max speed? Less to be taken).

What we don't know, is what the PS5 is doing with its memory. It appears to be a solid chunk of GDDR6, at a constant speed. But is the OS part of this? I was told before that they are doing something else here, and the chatter lead me to believe they may be utilising the SSD for the OS function rather than the memory. That could, in theory, allow the full 16gb to be used. However that's guess work on my behalf, and as such its safe to assume at this time they will be using 16gb GDDR 6 and taking a small portion of that for the OS.

So, they may both actually end up with the same available memory for games, but SX will still be using the faster memory for the most important things.

Sony would be screaming if all the 16 GB were available for gaming, not happening and I am not a developer just using common sense. Instead we have radio silence.

 

[Reindeer]

Good Old Gamer also confirmed my suspicion that base clock of PS5 GPU is around 9.7 tflops. He also said variable frequency solution is not a good solution in the long term because of CPU and GPU having to constantly underclock and overclock all the time.

 

[Burrito Bandito]

16% performance difference is not even enough to have 1800p on one and 2160p on the other, that would require 40% performance difference. What we are talking about here amounts to 1440p VS 1512p, at most 1620p (maybe that would be too much). I think Xbox fans will be very disappointed when the Digital Foundry comparisons start rolling out.

real world most games (especially 3rd party) will be using 9.2 tflops, rather than maxing out the boost clocks constantly. so you are looking more at a 31-32% difference in just gpu. Then you have to factor in the extra cpu clocks of the xsx and the 44% more ray tracing capabilities.

you are realistically looking at noticeable difference in resolution, frame rate, and ray tracing quality.

but the ps5 will load the game a fraction of a second faster...

 

[lepermessiah]

Youtubers and twitterati know more than Cerny it seems.

 

[Gavin Stevens]

Sony would be screaming if all the 16 GB were available for gaming, not happening and I am not a developer just using common sense. Instead we have radio silence.

If there's one thing Sony's recent personality has shown me, its that you can't take anything they do for granted, because you just don't know. But yeah, I would assume it would have been spoken about. They would have come up with something to get that edge in, because that would be a win in their book. As it stands, from the whole memory perspective, its most certainly SX > PS5 at this time. I really would like to know what they are doing there.

 

[Fulcizombie]

Why the hostility bro? The PS5 has been announced, check out the ssd speed on the thing. It streams shit, faster than anything before it. Do the homework and rest in the comfort of knowledge.

It streams faster but what would draw the high quality assets in the first place ? The thing has an inferior cpu, an inferior gpu and , up until further notice, slower ram to feed that gpu.

 

[CuriousToe]

Let the Shit show begin. I won't duck throw your cabbage and tomatoes.

Any explanation on what happened? Bad sources?

 

[thelastword]

Custom Engineering is the future...…..I always told folk it's what's most important.....

After watching the full 52 minute breakdown from Cerny, the PS5 is a beast of design relative to Custom Engineering...I too wanted lots of TF's, but what Cerny has done here is to focus on eliminating pretty much any bottlenecks you get in modern engineering and that will eradicate any differences you see on paper in the TF divide....

Think of it...

GPU= 36CU's at 2.23GHZ with a geometry engine+primitive shaders, with GPU cache scrubbers, the latter being unique to the PS5 to improve performance.

This is a significant improvement on the geometry rendering that we saw on PS4 PRO, this time, the dev has more control over what happens in the pipeline and aspects of geometry you can't see, this will improve optimization in games significantly….

MS vs Sony's approach is different, MS is more straight forward, less custom engineering work as I suspected, they simply went for a more bruteforce and higher TF, but Sony's approach is so custom, the engineering is built around it's cooling solution, where they would never be able to get GPU clockspeeds as high otherwise.....Of course, such high GPU clockspeeds means even higher performance for rasterization work and the general pipeline and in tandem with the extremely faster SSD technology, real world results will be what tells the tale....


16GB at 448GB/s, there's no ram clocked lower, it's consistent...

With the extremely fast SSD speeds working in tandem and who knows, PS will most likely use less memory for it's OS, since it's typically faster and not as layered as the MS OS, the ram will then prove to be more accessible with less bottlenecks.


5.5GB/s SSD speeds, that's higher than anything out there right now, XBOX Series X SSD speeds are much lower than current gen peaks of 3.5GB/S, it's only 2.4GB/s

That will be the biggest differentiator, the PS5 was built around the SSD and it shows, the vision was to eliminate load times and the inesxistent seektimes and the much faster HBCC interchange will ensure that next gen games are improved by a great deal in level design, texture and asset lods…….



CPU 8C/16T at 3.5 GHZ...…..The XBOX Series X is at 3.6GHZ across all threads, PS5 is at 3.5Ghz, However the XBOX's OS will use more CPU power, it typically does and sound will consume more of the XBOX's CPU power, which means in realtime for games, PS5 will have more CPU power available since it has dedicated custom silicon for sound processing, it's so powerful it's pretty much equivalent to the entire 8core Jaguar PS4 CPU just for sound.....This means, PS5's CPU will also have more legroom for physics processing....


Sound Chip, Custom Tempest Engine....
I don't think MS has an answer here, the research and engineering on 3D audio is huge.....Virtual surround, choosing a sound profile that best suits how each individual receives and perceives sound is simply genius.....I think I told folk, I missed PS3 audio....I always spoke of Resistance in 7.1, still being one of the benchmarks in game audio...….Sony wants to make sure everyone gets an amazing audio experience with virtual surround and through headphones....This will be a great transition point to get gamers to appreciate better aural response......Games are audio/visual and it's about time that everybody does not focus only on 4K and high level textures and PBR+lighting, but great audio engineering as well....



Summary: I think if you are only looking at a just TF count, in this case you are doing it wrong, just watch the video and see how much processing is taken away from typical CPU and GPU cycles to custom chips on the PS's mainboard....Higher TF won't mitigate such custom silicon, it's a much smarter design that's for sure, with what seems to be a proper vision for the console, in all aspects of engineering, GPU+CPU tied to cooling......Insanely Fast SSD tied to memory and amazing innovation on sound.....On the GPU, Mesh Shading/Primitive Shading is in, but their Geometry engine is even more complex than simply Mesh shading, something I don't see MS has an answer to......In essence, optimization will be much faster on PS5, many aspects of the pipeline will be faster.....


It is always said, work smarter, not harder... and to me what Cerny has given here is highly genius and perhaps the most innovative piece of engineering we've seen in decades…..The proof will be in the pudding I believe, primarily with first parties but with third parties too...….Imagine you have the next COD game that loads much faster, memory is accessed with less bottlenecks, more CPU resources because less of it is hogged, that's a genius design and it's great he actually went to developers and asked them what do they want to see solved......Even now, people are looking at the insanely fast SSD's, but it's not just a Gen 4 SSD they simply tacked into a PS5, there is so much more silicon within the MCC, like: the DMA, several I/O co-processors and much better decompression technology than XBOX which tapes up to 9GB/s using Kraken......So if you remember on PS4, sometimes in the COD games and others, when you had achievements and lots of text popping onscreen you would get frameskips, essentially, that would be gone.....All the stuttering loading assets and traversing large open worlds, will be gone too......In that regard PS5 will be so ahead of Series X, you will see it very tangibly in games, just as the sound will be more remarkable there......

One thing I'd also like to touch on is AMD smartshift, it's something I've been excited about from the time it was revealed, it's in the PS5......That basically improves performance by 10%, it basically boosts performance to either GPU or CPU based on the task at hand or where it's most needed...I also suspect because of the closed box of the PS5 and it's insanely fast SSD and so much custom silicon, it will be even higher than a 10% improvement.....So in many ways I could see Smartshift was probably developed by Sony or with them in mind....seeing as how their cooler and PSU is so perfectly designed to utilize it.....The cooler is something I will want to see more details on....Cerny said we will be impressed when they have a teardown so looking for ward to that.....

Having said that, the spec reveal is just one thing, every developer seems to be highly stoked for PS5, it will be very easy to get a game running on it, as Cerny said you can see your on screen transformations in little under a month, even PS1 was 1-2 months.....That's great since everybody is saying it's extremely dev friendly, so that goes a long way too....

But yes, all the spec talk is only half of the equation.....I'm really looking forward to see the OS and the new and improved features at OS level, the controller and what new mechanics they bring with that, haptic, perhaps a screen improved share button and I would imagine and enhanced audio port on the controller since they are going all out on sound, there is a lot to be excited for.....Where do they take remoteplay shareplay and streaming and course what ports do we get on the PS5, what type of Wifi etc......I also need to know of what custom silicon they have for media and hoping they have custom silicon for the OS too....Also looking forward to see the new camera as well....

Of course the games will be the most exciting part and we will see what such custom silicon will deliver on screen, that surely will be another thread, but I think these are exciting times for both console manufacturers.....I generally prefer a better vision in console engineering, but I think fans on both sides of the equation should be very pleased, just be sure to advocate for higher quality games and revolutionary game experiences for these pieces of kit.....

 

[Agnostic2020]

It just feels liks Sony is nowhere near a final product. Maybe it is not clear, how much RAM their OS will need. Not that it is a problem, because we are far, far from release day.

On the other hand, it is pretty impressive to see Microsoft with a finished product and OS features that already work.

I m praying they would say they have 4 gb ddr4 for os when talking about os in reveal .haha

 

[Reindeer]

I

real world most games (especially 3rd party) will be using 9.2 tflops, rather than maxing out the boost clocks constantly. so you are looking more at a 31-32% difference in just gpu. Then you have to factor in the extra cpu clocks of the xsx and the 44% more ray tracing capabilities.

you are realistically looking at noticeable difference in resolution, frame rate, and ray tracing quality.

but the ps5 will load the game a fraction of a second faster...

I think base clock is higher than 9.2 tflops and probably closer to within 5% of the total tflop amount. 10% seems way to high for the difference between base clock and boost clock.

 

[CJY]

I find the idea that some people think that variable clock speeds was introduced as a response to XSX laughable.

There is no evidence of this. Sure, PS5 may have possibly been given higher capped speeds to, you know, maximise the system and maybe in response to XSX, but regardless, the variable clocks are such a fundamental part of the design of the chip, baked in at the silicon level, that it truly is laughable to suggest that the variability was introduced solely in response to the XSX.

Fact is, even if PS5 was capped at 9.2TF, it would still have variable clock speeds, because that's HOW IT WAS DESIGNED and INTENDED to be.

 

[Handy Fake]

real world most games (especially 3rd party) will be using 9.2 tflops, rather than maxing out the boost clocks constantly. so you are looking more at a 31-32% difference in just gpu. Then you have to factor in the extra cpu clocks of the xsx and the 44% more ray tracing capabilities.

you are realistically looking at noticeable difference in resolution, frame rate, and ray tracing quality.

but the ps5 will load the game a fraction of a second faster...

You need to stop it with this.

 

[Fulcizombie]

Youtubers and twitterati know more than Cerny it seems.

Cerny is a sony employee, he is not impartial. When MS presented the XSX they invited specialized journalists, showed a ton of stuff from Ray tracing examples to enhanced BC, explained their philosophy behind the console and then let the journalists present their own take on the console, Sony had Cerny talking about how TF don’t matter, 3d audio, SSD speed and variable clock speeds.

 

[Reindeer]

Youtubers and twitterati know more than Cerny it seems.

People said the same thing about GitHub and look how that turned out. Once you got the data infront of you and have the main info about the GPU and CPU you pretty much got a general idea about how it should function.

 

[Agnostic2020]

I find the idea that some people think that variable clock speeds was introduced as a response to XSX laughable.

There is no evidence of this. Sure, PS5 may have possibly been given higher capped speeds to, you know, maximise the system and maybe in response to XSX, but regardless, the variable clocks are such a fundamental part of the design of the chip, baked in at the silicon level, that it truly is laughable to suggest that the variability was introduced solely in response to the XSX.

Fact is, even if PS5 was capped at 9.2TF, it would still have variable clock speeds, because that's HOW IT WAS DESIGNED and INTENDED to be.

Ofcourse man and the clock is lowered by 2% to lower the electrical power draw by 10%.thats so minor

10.08 to 10.28 is that really worth discussing? Lol

 

[SportsFan581]

No you don't know both CUs are the same, we need either a die shot or official confirmation for that to be a fact. If PS5 die size is not revealed I sniff something interesting. As 20 CUs are supposed to be a lot of space and seems either that custom I/O Complex is HUGE, or CUs are larger than normal hence supercharged.

Either way a huge amount of die space for something we don't know about (I/O Complex) or don't fully know about (Bigger CUs) needs to be explored and speculated here.

@dark10x care to comment pls? what is ps5 die size?

The XSX chip doubled in transistor count, while only adding 27% more CUs. Yeah, those CUs are bigger than the old ones.

Speaking of transistor sizes, doesn't it seem like doubling total transistors on roughly the same size die is a bit much for 16nm > 7nm transition? Are these consoles on EUV?

 

[CJY]

Cerny is a sony employee, he is not impartial. When MS presented the XSX they invited specialized journalists, showed a ton of stuff from Ray tracing examples to enhanced BC, explained their philosophy behind the console and then let the journalist present their own take on the console, Sony had Cerny talking about how TF don’t matter, 3d audio, SSD speed and variable clock speeds.

Cerny is an independent contractor and his company is hired by Sony as a system architect. He is not a Sony employee.

 

[RaZoR No1]

I understand that the extreme fast SSD will be able to support/expand the RAM capabilities, but regardless of how fast you can get the files: dont you have process every file / texture etc. through the CPU and GPU regardless of the SSD speed(expect the sound files due to the extra SPU) ? I dont mean the de-/compress process, but the normal process itself. All files (uo to 9GB/s) need to be go at least through one of the processers to be visible on TV at the end.
Does the PS5 now have the GPU and CPU proccesing itself as bottlenecks?

In the end this would be like having a huge RAM size and I dont think, that this (at the moment) allows for example PC gamers to have a huge performance jump in processing power.


I am really really curious how the real performance will be and what "new" bottlenecks will be found by the devs.

In the end I will buy both consoles, regardless of the realworld performance and I am really happy that we have to company which try 2 different approaches to get the max out of the consoles