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It seems to me that Sony/Cerny chose higher quality accessories/console design over a higher Teraflops count. (A Risky Move)
- Thread starter MiyazakiHatesKojima
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Vawn
Banned
This isn't GameFAQs. Can we have conversations and disagreements without resorting to personal attacks?
KingdomHeartsFan
Member
I'm not downplaying the strength of the PS brand, I'm just saying coming out with a weaker console for the same price ain't a good look.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
It's a controversial and bold stance to have in the midst of this odd "PC Gaming" mentality when it comes to judging consoles.MiyazakiHatesKojima after reading the comments of this thread
Bumblebeetuna
Member
MiyazakiHatesKojima after reading the comments of this thread
Van says Useless
Ok I’m done wading in the kiddie pool. This bullshit has already been debunked in a million other secret sauce threads.
nikolino840
Member
The same Is more easy for the devs no?
For the ps5 now they have to code for the powerful SSD ,make more studies about audio in the engines, doing stuff for the haptic triggers and who know what else
Vawn
Banned
It's weaker in certain ways and stronger in others. That's the premise of the thread.
I don't think the PS5 is any cheaper to produce than the Series X.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Weaker in terms of graphical fidelity? Yes.
Weaker in delivering exceptionally unique gaming experiences and a solidly designed console/controller? Very unlikely.
Shakka43
Member
They will most likely cost the same and i don't see that hurting the PS5 too much.
Quasicat
Member
That makes me feel better. Thank you!
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
You clearly didn't read or watch Cerny's GDC panel or developer's statements about the PS5 being the easiest console to develop on.
KingdomHeartsFan
Member
Most other aspects won't mean as much. The main thing, the SSD being faster is already canceled out by the fact that you get less storage for me anyway.
Yes SSD's became affordable (within the 1500 dollar price range) about 15 years ago on PC. I expect it to take another 15-20 years before console's start using multi-GPU solutions. On the other hand, Xbox Series X is still hands down 2 more Teraflops of raw overhead graphical horsepower on a closed proprietary system. So if they want the prettiest, best, most technological astute looking game - it's theirs to create.
But console gamers are clueless as ever. I'm glad consoles look like they wanna be PC's.
But console gamers are clueless as ever. I'm glad consoles look like they wanna be PC's.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Debunked?Van says Useless
Ok I’m done wading in the kiddie pool. This bullshit has already been debunked in a million other secret sauce threads.
You're clearly triggered that this thread is challenging your notions of what makes a console superior in terms of overall quality.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
The original Xbox and Xbox One X were in this position, but it didn't change the average console gamer/consumer's mind because there are other factors that come into play.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
I don't think you realize how much of a difference the PS5's SSD is compared to the XsX's SSD......
Birdo
Banned
I'm tired, man.
I'm tired of this console warrior bullshit, I'm tired of the trolling, I'm tired of the gimmick accounts, I'm tired of the insecure fanboy crap. And to be honest, I'm just tired of this whole forum....
KingdomHeartsFan
Member
All I know is it better make a HUGE difference or else its gonna be embarrassing when people go to expand their storage and PS5 gamers are paying more for a 1.6TB SSD than Xbox gamers are for a 2TB SSD. Not to mention the Xbox storage is in addition to the internal storage and doesn't replace it.
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The only way a faster SSD could technically make a game look better, is by Either A. allowing you to traverse great distances at higher speeds. B. Allowing more assets to be loaded into the physical game world. C. allowing you to press a button, turn around (while in game, I don't mean what's been demo'd), and step into a new different world/game entirely with immediacy.. and seamlessly - as the games in question would need to be built to accommodate this.
These are the advantages of an SSD... none which are specifically graphical.
Meaning, a faster SSD will not allow you to load in assets with a higher topology/subdivision count it will not allow for better visuals it will allow for different experiences. Faster Virtual Memory means better draw call handling (this is performance related not visual related) and better streaming of distant objects with varying LOD.
Cold hard fact is, if Microsoft wants to harness it's extra TF's it will come far closer to achieving photorealism than it's competitor - as long as it attempt's to do it. If not, you wont see the difference as a consumer. Still wont make a difference when the history books will correctly record and herald the Series X with the Performance/Power crown.
These are the advantages of an SSD... none which are specifically graphical.
Meaning, a faster SSD will not allow you to load in assets with a higher topology/subdivision count it will not allow for better visuals it will allow for different experiences. Faster Virtual Memory means better draw call handling (this is performance related not visual related) and better streaming of distant objects with varying LOD.
Cold hard fact is, if Microsoft wants to harness it's extra TF's it will come far closer to achieving photorealism than it's competitor - as long as it attempt's to do it. If not, you wont see the difference as a consumer. Still wont make a difference when the history books will correctly record and herald the Series X with the Performance/Power crown.
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TLZ
Banned
If they do this alone, I'm there day ONE.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Correct me if I'm wrong. But didn't Xbox already say that its storage devices are proprietary, meaning you cannot buy off the shelf SSDs and only from Microsoft?
825GB of a superior SSD is more favourable to a slower but larger SSD. The implications behind Sony's SSD also feeds into its first party titles and how their level designs will differ from the rest of the games, making PS5's exclusives even more unique.
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Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
I disagree,
The PS5 shares a very similar stratagy as the PS4, they aimed to make the best console they could without taking a huge loss, which is why they choose 36cus.
However halfway through development they got wind that ms are aiming for power so the hardware team did what they could to get more performance out of the GPU. I dont buy cernys story that really high clocks was always the goal, it makes no sense, they would of been better off going for 44cus @ 1830mhz the performance would be practically the same and they would have way less of a headache cooling the thing, i dont think it would cost more either, because the cooling would be cheaper.
The DS5 is a natural progression over the DS4 and the SSD is similar to the "future goals" of the ps4s gpgpu hardware.
Sonys approach does have its perks, but at the end of the day what matters is how the game will look and perform, switch like rumble and slightly faster loading times are nice, but its the game playing experience which is the most important.
Also I would not be surprised if Xbox add fancy rumble to the next elite controller.
The PS5 shares a very similar stratagy as the PS4, they aimed to make the best console they could without taking a huge loss, which is why they choose 36cus.
However halfway through development they got wind that ms are aiming for power so the hardware team did what they could to get more performance out of the GPU. I dont buy cernys story that really high clocks was always the goal, it makes no sense, they would of been better off going for 44cus @ 1830mhz the performance would be practically the same and they would have way less of a headache cooling the thing, i dont think it would cost more either, because the cooling would be cheaper.
The DS5 is a natural progression over the DS4 and the SSD is similar to the "future goals" of the ps4s gpgpu hardware.
Sonys approach does have its perks, but at the end of the day what matters is how the game will look and perform, switch like rumble and slightly faster loading times are nice, but its the game playing experience which is the most important.
Also I would not be surprised if Xbox add fancy rumble to the next elite controller.
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MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Ironic you're downplaying the PS5's SSD but overexaggerating over 1.87 teraflops of extra theoretical teraflops.
Jtibh
Banned
It will be the walkman of this generation.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Look and perfomance is not going to make a turd like Crackdown 3 or, Cerny forgive me, Knack 2 any better in terms of games.
Cerny's GDC panel proved that the overall gaming experience can be improved by focusing on neglected factors such as loading times, audio, controller feedback, etc.
KingdomHeartsFan
Member
Yea their proprietary but still if I wanna expand my storage I pay $150 and get 1.6TB storage on PS5. If I wanna expand my storage on XSEX I pay $150 and get 2TB in addition to 1TB so i end up with 3TB total (Using made up prices to make a point).
I pay the same amount but I end up with almost double the storage on XSEX compared to PS5. That is a major plus for the XSEX. That SSD in the PS5 better be doing some mindblowing stuff to make up for that and I'm not talking about faster loading screens.
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Lighting, shadows and reflections will be conquered within a few generations/GPU cycles. Resolution disparity (the jump from 8k to 16k and then 32/64k/128k ect) will not be handled so elegantly. I just hope Microsoft does not ignore the fact that higher resolution in games does not equal better graphics and actually attempts to harness their console's power advantage for graphical prowess.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Gamernyc78
Banned
Bro we see through the schilling
new account and you are going hard to prop up Xbox lol No matter how hard you go Sony will still have the best games, be remembered for their goty contenders and winners like every Gen in your history books and their dope hardware and features. They will still outsell Xbox and still be remembered as the market leader in your history books.
Vawn
Banned
I'm tired, man.
I'm tired of this console warrior bullshit, I'm tired of the trolling, I'm tired of the gimmick accounts, I'm tired of the insecure fanboy crap. And to be honest, I'm just tired of this whole forum....
You're basically tired of all the things you've been doing lately?
Hobbygaming
has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
I came to post this. Cerny chose the internals he chose for a good reason I believe and when we see the games we'll be surprised in a good wayIn Cerny i trust
Potato Chip PRO
Member
One thing I want from the PS5 is for me to insert PS2 games in that bitch.... Reeee +150 games that I need to complete
What's ironic is I, as a computer scientist have put a lot of thought into the advantages of a faster SSD and none of these advantages equate to assets with higher polygon count's based purely on a next gen SSD array. The only performance I can manage to see garnered will be in the draw call department with the theoretically quicker Virtual Memory. Every asset rendered in game creates 1-4 drawcalls which could technically make some games more efficient and in fact possible that were not possible before. This will not improve texture's aside from whatever proprietary tricks they may have programmed into the architecture and it will certainly not mean higher polygon count's across standard assets, but perhaps more standard objects scattered across screen and displayed than a slower ssd.
Series X on the other hand can easily add another level of subdivision across all of it's asset's, begin adding in legitimate sculpt detail and then re-topologize those same assets to increase it's Poly Count with negligible to no performance impact.
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MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Okay buddy, show's over. Take off the mask and tell us who you really are because I can't take you seriously anymore.
This is the second time you claim this shit and it's obvious you're trolling.
Bryank75
Banned
Yup, I mean Series X isn't really a console... it's a small form factor PC. Even their approach to games is the same as PC.
PlayStation will be the only real next gen console on the market this Christmas. It's also the only one that is bringing true innovation as opposed to what Xbox is doing, which is just a linear upgrade in the traditional mold.
PlayStation will be the only real next gen console on the market this Christmas. It's also the only one that is bringing true innovation as opposed to what Xbox is doing, which is just a linear upgrade in the traditional mold.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Read my OP again and see where I say that "....led me to believe...."
These are not statements, just educated guesses based on the information that we have.
And yes, according to devs, the controller feels great.
Bro we see through the schilling
No matter how hard you go Sony will still have the best games, be remembered for their goty contenders and winners like every Gen in your history books and their dope hardware and features. They will still outsell Xbox and still be remembered as the market leader in your history books.
If Microsoft doesn't intend to deliver graphically - it's their game to lose.
On the other hand, if they continue at this trajectory - Xbox is poised to dominate all facets of gaming after another 2 generations and Sony will fall to the wayside.
"PS7 can only emulate 10% of PS5 games"
meanwhile
"Microsoft finally got all it's shit in gear, and you can stream Xbox 6 games across all platforms at no performance loss"
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
We do have diminishing returns, while I do like better graphics. When I was watching Steven Spielberg's cgi film "tin tin" i did love all the path tracing, advanced water and physics simulation etc etc, but I was thinking to myself while this is a lot more advanced when it comes to mimicking reality a game like uncharted 4 does not do that much worse, the water in UC4 still looks like pretty convincing water, as do the trees, explosions, character models etc.
So yes your right lighting does have a long way to go in gaming, however its still pretty far from perfect in big CGi movies regardless if its path traced.
Human skin in direct sunlight still does not look real, even if cgi can simulate light accurately the way the light reacts and looks on certain materials like human skin still looks incorrect.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
This is what i'm trying to say with this thread: Consoles should never act like their PC counterparts and always attempt to differentiate themselves through innovation.
Luckily, Sony has Cerny to do just that for them.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
aside from switch like rumble, an internal usbc battery and a microphone things like durability will be similarly, X1 pads are very durable.
I like the switch rumble it does add to games, but im sure ms will add it to a new elite controller too. Im pleased ms are choosing to use the BOM on the SoC instead of new controller features.
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
MiyazakiHatesKojima
Banned
Downplaying the DualSense's haptic feedback as "Switch like rumble" doesn't make your argument/post look good, tbh.
And FYI, the elite controller costs more than $100 and only caters to certain gamers.
Brofist
Member
You heard it here boys, pack em in graphics have hit the peak and no where to go from here.
Like this same comment verbatim hasn't been said before the launch of each new console since the PS2 probably.
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Vawn
Banned
And going from PS360 to PS4/XBO was the most underwhelming "leap" we've had since I started gaming on Atari.
This one, from a graphics standpoint, will be even less exciting. There's only so much better visuals can get.
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