MadchesterManc
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It could be a possibility if Onechanbara wasn't a thing
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I'm sorry Ryu, Kratos, and Dante, but Bayonetta still has better 3D Action combat than you
- Thread starter GigaBowser
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- Opinion Analysis
GymWolf
Member
I get what you say, but I love the art design for the angelic enemies in bayo 1
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Majukun
Member
second one is from bayo 2, but i do agree that it's refreshing when angels appear in bayo 3 compared to the new enemies that seem to lack the polish of the old enemies in terms of styleI get what you say, but I love the art design for the angelic enemies in bayo 1
Labolas
Member
I'll say they're best design enemies in the series. Grace and Glory ftw.I get what you say, but I love the art design for the angelic enemies in bayo 1
Hot5pur
Member
To debate the peak of the action hack and slash genre. Also for GoW fanboys to come to terms with reality in that character action fans don't really find the new GoW combat systems all that compelling.
Indeed I would say focusing on the cinematic aspect they took a lot out of the combat system that made it immediately fun and eye catching. You really have to dig (for apparently 6000 hours) to make it feel good.
I think in the case of GoW the examples of impressive gameplay are sparse and if you need to make an argument using a reference where someone has to invest 6000 hours to make the game look good (and for me personally it still doesn't hold a candle to the others), the argument actually starts working against you. There is a reason people aren't rushing out making GoW combo videos compared to the other games. The combat has some level of depth and is functional, but it's nowhere near peak character action hack and slash gameplay.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
The new GOW series does a lot of things better than DMC/NG, or the OG series. For one, the story isn't just window dressing (and even the old games had a way better story than these games), the voice acting is on point, not just garbage belonging to a bad anime dub, and the enemy/environmental designs are top notch.
Some fans of it get offended the moment you point out its flaws and/or limitations though.
Some fans of it get offended the moment you point out its flaws and/or limitations though.
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Ulysses 31
Member
Wouldn't say they lack polish, it's jus that most of them blend together when trying to remember because of the white, green color pallets. If you pause and inspect, the models do tend to look good though but the coloring masks at lot of visual details in combat IMO.
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Butthurt over God of War shitty combat? LOL man you are full of yourself. Go take some laxative and remove all that shit that's in your body.You can tell me huh?
Good to see the butthurt about GOW absolutely dominating the genre since 2005 is alive and well
Either way, God of War never had the best gameplay. It always was far behind DMC on that regard, and then behind Bayonetta too. Which is logical considering it tries so hard on other departments.
On another note in french we refer as hack n slash only the RPGs like Diablo. So when i'm coming here i'm a little lost in the categories. We only use the term "beat em all" for Bayonetta/DMC, a slight change from beat em up (that has a more 2D feeling as an expression i think).
As for the new God of War, there are so many things i don't like about the combats i don't even know where to start. Just with the runic attacks mechanic that revolves around a simple input and a cooldown i just can't...
GymWolf
Member
Angelic enemies are by far the thing i love more about the saga as a non-player of the saga, more than bayo whore design or the hairs made monsters.
There is something unsettling in angelic enemies, those happy faces with those demonic white bodies, always loved the contrast.
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GymWolf
Member
Do you think that people who post absurd combos from bayo or dmc doesn't have thousands of hours on the game just because it is not written in the description? Think again dude...
I know that gow is inferior to pure action games, but searching a video from an elite player to show how good the game can be is perfectly normal.
Nobody on gaf is gonna post personal gameplay to prove a point, we always post the videos where the game look at his best, especially when you have to show how high the skill ceiling is.
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Ulysses 31
Member
Didn't you play Bayo 2? The demonic enemies there had some cool designs too.
GymWolf
Member
I stopped playing pure action games after dmc3, i'm just not interested anymore in doing 100x combos and honestly hurting my hands (that i already fuck up at work and gym), i just don't find their "simple" structure super funny anymore, but i fully respect the genre.
The only pure action game i played after that were darksiders 2 (not pure but you get what i mean) and dmc 5, i bought bayo 1 remaster on pc many years ago but it didn't wanted to start on my pc so i asked a refund.
Maybe when i'm done with ragnarock i'm gonna tey to buy bayo 1 again, maybe on console.
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Labolas
Member
Origin was fun but come on.
Mephisto40
Member
It honestly just seems like another Nintendo fan reassurance topic to me
Thirty7ven
Banned
It’s very flashy sure.
BlackTron
Member
They either destroyed the brand or turned it into exactly what it needed to be depending on how you look at it.
Sony has certainly managed to keep GoW relevant in terms of reputation and sales even if the PS2 people aren't as impressed with the core game. The way they handle software now makes it easy for me to wait until later in the gen to dip in, but clearly most of the paying world disagrees with me so they did something right.
It feels like Sony fans have to go through the same things Nintendo or Sega fans already had to, every big IP gets ruined to chase a different audience eventually. GoW is now too big and important to allow it to be too complicated for some people. I think in Sony's eyes, if you can be Aloy or Nathan you can be Kratos, they aren't games "meant" for tastes of different gamers it's just the next media consumption event to them.
Edit: I forgot to mention my original thought, which is that Sony may have changed their games to be more approachable but we're lucky they did it in a much more balanced way that fans of the original can still appreciate than the shit Nintendo pulled to try and be successful in the past.
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GymWolf
Member
And yet the game is as hard if not harder than previous games.
Not sure from where this dumbed down narrative come from when the game is every bit as hard as the hardest souls game.
Nintendo games are all tailored for 10 years old players, they are way more dumbed down than sony games, at least combat wise, except smash bros.
BlackTron
Member
I didn't post my edit in time lol.
I'm not saying GoW suddenly became super easy. It just lost action DNA and gain some Sony cinematic DNA. Resulting in the best entries being older ones in the opinion of many.
It's a common pattern for the older game to have more depth/core design but the newer one to edge it out with graphics, features and QoL improvements. Starcraft vs SC2 repeated over and over my entire life...
MasterDerico
Member
Im Sorry OP, but Dmc series and Ninja Gaiden are miles ahead Bayo...
That's my opinion, and for me she deserves the third place!
Who deeply played those series, its obvious.
That's my opinion, and for me she deserves the third place!
Who deeply played those series, its obvious.
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IDKFA
I am Become Bilbo Baggins
You're right.
God of War is so much better thank those other games. It's actually insulting to GoW to utter it in the same breath as DMC, NG and Bayo.
drotahorror
Member
Probably not but this dude makes God of War games look like they have a lot of depth:
And buddy only has half the moveset available.
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Reizo Ryuu
Member
Bayonetta is the absolute king though.
The entire final sequence of the first game still blows my mind 13 years later.
The entire final sequence of the first game still blows my mind 13 years later.
Miles ahead i disagree, but yeah i would put DMC 5 on top.
Ninja Gaiden is trickier to judge, doesn't revolve around creativity as much as the other two. I'd say 1/Black is one of the greatest action game ever though.
Kiya's Guard
Member
Yes, but I wish bayonetta came out in another platform. You can hear the switch agonizing when running bayo 3, and the resolution god damn. Waiting for an update
GymWolf
Member
Ok maybe some bosses like gael or maleena are harder but i'm still halfway through ragnarock and i didn't even fought the hardest enemies yet.
Normal enemy encounters are way harder in ragnarock, no doubt about this, at least on max difficulty.
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Kokoloko85
Member
If GOW is a walking sim what does it make something like Skyrim? A talking sim with awful combat?
For talking sims their voice acting and interactions are so much worse than the acting in Naughty Dog or recent GOW. RDR2/GTA etc are all amazing. Elder scrolls NPC are notorious for there lame acting and voice acting.
So crap voice acting for a talking sim, plus crap combat.…
Plus you’ll never hear the retards say Hellblade/Hellblade 2 is a walking sim lol….
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MadchesterManc
Member
Funnily enough the combat with Origin was dumbed down compared to previous games, sacrificing the combo depth etc for flashy combat, which is why I didn't say Origin
Labolas
Member
^Astral Chain is fun as hell. I'm ready for a sequel.
While I disagree Bayo is the best imo, all three definitely are kings in their own right. They are the golden standard.
Origin is the most appealing one and the only one I really was interested in playing. I'll probably get around to trying out the others as well.
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Fbh
Member
Eh my view on good combat has always been a bit different. I don't think good combat only applies to complex combos and flashy moves, and in general I put more importance on how a fight feels the first time instead of what you can do if you decide to spend 2 hours on a single encounter coming up with a sequence of attacks that looks cool.
Don't take me wrong I think Bayonetta 3 was great and the combat was a lot of fun. But I still prefer, say, Bloodborne over it even though it's a simple system with a light and heavy attacks. But the hits have more weight to them, the fights feel more methodical and tense, the enemies feel more distinct and the bosses are on a different tier.
Don't take me wrong I think Bayonetta 3 was great and the combat was a lot of fun. But I still prefer, say, Bloodborne over it even though it's a simple system with a light and heavy attacks. But the hits have more weight to them, the fights feel more methodical and tense, the enemies feel more distinct and the bosses are on a different tier.
MiguelItUp
Member
Different strokes for different folks, that's all there is to it. I dig the combat games that have flashy spastic combat where you have to constantly move, or the combat games that have the, at times, slower and more methodical combat. It all works, and as long as it works, I'm happy.
I will say though, as much as I enjoyed DMC 5, I put it down and never picked it back up, not really sure why. GOW and Ragnarok's combat has been great, IMO. It can get as complex and simplistic as you want it to. Bayonetta's combat has always reminded me of DMC's combat more than anything else. I enjoyed 1&2, but don't know when I'll touch 3.
I will say though, as much as I enjoyed DMC 5, I put it down and never picked it back up, not really sure why. GOW and Ragnarok's combat has been great, IMO. It can get as complex and simplistic as you want it to. Bayonetta's combat has always reminded me of DMC's combat more than anything else. I enjoyed 1&2, but don't know when I'll touch 3.
Carmen Winstead
Member
Big L to all people who call God of War 2018/Ragnarok a walking sim and its combat basic.
And another one to those who compare it to hack and slash games which only have their combat going for them and are only played for that and besides have not much to offer in contrast to GOW which is in all other aspects miles ahead.
And another one to those who compare it to hack and slash games which only have their combat going for them and are only played for that and besides have not much to offer in contrast to GOW which is in all other aspects miles ahead.
kikii
Member
i think that game runs like those gif's and same resolution3 pages and still no mention of Astral Chain? I'm disappointed af GAF.
MadchesterManc
Member
To be honest I was just poking a bit of fun bringing it up, as something that started out as a Simple Series release on PS2 it'll probably never be as slick as these big budget beasts in comparison
You may enjoy Z-II Chaos (PS4 or Steam) if Origin was fun as its kind of an in-between the old games and the latest on the gameplay front
stn
Member
All are good but I prefer the combat of NGB and NG2 (vanilla). Bayo has excellent combat but it can be hard to see what's going on sometimes, and DMC is good but can control a bit awkwardly at times. GOW's combat is also excellent, and I'm playing it now in fact so it is fresh in my mind.
Shh
Member
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Topher
Identifies as young
GymWolf
Member
The discussion about feeling vs mechanics is as old as the stars in the sky.
Tlou2 might be an extremely simple, slow paced, not much varied, even easy tps, but when you kill mofos in that game, the feeling is best in class, same for rdr2 that has some of the shittiest tps mechanics ever made, and still killing anything in that game feel extremely good because of the weight, details, gore, euphoria engine etc.
A lot of games have better tps mechanics but they don't feel nearly as satysfying.
It's the reason why some people like gow over faster paced action games, it just feels better killing mofos (debatable of course)
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SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Characters that hit hard don’t need five pages of cute combat moves.
BlackTron
Member
I feel like I will catch a lot of flak here but even as someone who likes Nintendo and bought a Wii U day one, I have never played Bayonetta.
I just don't like the vibe of the character or her design. The opinion was doubled down by her appearance in Smash.
A few years ago after she went N exclusive one of my friends commented on how fucking cool and awesome and sexy and badass she is. It made me feel silly to hear it, I tried not to say anything back but I think he noticed my expression lol.
This is the first time I've ever admitted that the only reason I haven't played this supposedly incredible action game is I don't like the character. I try not to judge anyone who likes her but it comes off as the kind of thing you'd like despite the character, not because of it. Unless you are 15 or something.
It's a weird topic because I find her flaunting of sexuality off-putting, but that's not really something I'm generally against in games. Maybe something about her ridiculous poses appearing on the cover of a Nintendo game so they can say "see? We have a mature game" even though it comes off as the most immature high school shit anyway. In a strange fail-ception.
It's hard to put into words really, but I actually do still want to try it eventually starting with 1.
I just don't like the vibe of the character or her design. The opinion was doubled down by her appearance in Smash.
A few years ago after she went N exclusive one of my friends commented on how fucking cool and awesome and sexy and badass she is. It made me feel silly to hear it, I tried not to say anything back but I think he noticed my expression lol.
This is the first time I've ever admitted that the only reason I haven't played this supposedly incredible action game is I don't like the character. I try not to judge anyone who likes her but it comes off as the kind of thing you'd like despite the character, not because of it. Unless you are 15 or something.
It's a weird topic because I find her flaunting of sexuality off-putting, but that's not really something I'm generally against in games. Maybe something about her ridiculous poses appearing on the cover of a Nintendo game so they can say "see? We have a mature game" even though it comes off as the most immature high school shit anyway. In a strange fail-ception.
It's hard to put into words really, but I actually do still want to try it eventually starting with 1.
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