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[FateTrap]

Nvidia's proprietary drivers i've heard are missing features & perform worse than on Windows.

The Nvidia proprietary Linux drivers are undeniably top notch. FreeBSD uses the proprietary Nvidia Linux drivers and they have very high performance, even on old hardware.

World of Padman benchmark

I tested World of Padman, the 'TIMEDEMO 1' benchmark BIGBALLOON-DEMO.DM_68 on FreeBSD. The resolution I chose for all tests: 1920x1080 in fullscreen...

forums.guru3d.com

WasmBoy Benchmarking results

You can take the test on this page: https://wasmboy.app/benchmark/ I use the open source ROM 'tobu tobu girl' and I myself score an average result of 570 FPS on Firefox Hardware: Intel i3-3240 @ 3.392GHz + 8GB RAM @1600MHz dual-channel + NVIDIA GTX 650 1GB + EVO 850 500GB Software: FreeBSD +...

www.techpowerup.com

One tip I would give for AMD/Intel GPU users is to use Clear Linux for gaming.
Clear Linux is incredibly easy to install, and it has the highest performance for gaming.

 

[T-Cake]

I'm waiting for Valve to make the Steam Deck OS into a general PC distro so that it works on any hardware. I admit I haven't tried Linux for many years but I see no need to switch right now.

 

[FateTrap]

I'm waiting for Valve to make the Steam Deck OS into a general PC distro so that it works on any hardware. I admit I haven't tried Linux for many years but I see no need to switch right now.

Valve based their system on Arch Linux. If you are going to use Arch you are going to have the same gaming experience as Steam Deck users.

If Arch Linux is above your skill level then you can use EndeavourOS or Artix Linux which are more user-friendly than Arch.

Some other systems that make it super easy to have a similar experience to the Steam Deck:

Nobara Linux | The Nobara Project

nobaraproject.org

ChimeraOS

Instantly turn any PC into a gaming console

The makers' choice for sysadmins, developers and desktop users.

Discover Tumbleweed and get the newest Linux packages with our rolling release. Fast! Integrated! Stabilized! Tested!. Discover Leap and get the most complete Linux distribution with openSUSE’s latest regular-release version!

www.opensuse.org

Purely for performance, Clear Linux is best suited for gaming.
It's also super easy to install, but it's only suitable if you're using an Intel or AMD GPU.

 

[Tarin02543]

I'm waiting for Valve to make the Steam Deck OS into a general PC distro so that it works on any hardware. I admit I haven't tried Linux for many years but I see no need to switch right now.

Came in here to post just that.

 

[Woffls]

shit, I'll get Windows reinstalled and configured before I even finish reading the op

 

[kruis]

If Linux wants to take over the reins from Windows, it needs a killer app. That app (or experience) should be so good that it's worth all the effort and pain switching over for.

But ever since Linux came into existence, it's only selling point seems to be "THIS IS THE PERFECT OS FOR PEOPLE WHO HATE MICROSOFT AND LOVE UNIX". It doesn't outperform Windows in any meaningful way, it's not more user friendly, it doesn't run games better, it doesn't have a bigger application library, in fact it's the opposite of all of those things.

It's a perfect OS though for people who enjoy learning a new OS and getting things to work rather than using an OS and creating work using applications. But even those born tinkerers will have off-days when they boot Windows to save themselves a day of exasperation.

But as long as Linux doesn't have a killer app, I'm not going to spend days or even weeks to learn a new OS, get all of my external hardware working, find replacements for apps that aren't available on Linux, learn how to use those replacements apps to find out Linux is only different from Windows but not better in any meaningful way.

 

[winjer]

 

[FateTrap]

Came in here to post just that.

I really think this distro has been around for a while.

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linuxgamingcentral.com

There’s far more strengths to ChimeraOS, however. It’s a great – and what, in my opinion, is the best – Linux-based distribution to transform your PC into a living room console. Install it and forget about the mouse and keyboard. Just bring the computer itself, the power cable, HDMI/DisplayPort cable, and your favorite gamepad to your next LAN party. Relax from a long, stressful day by turning the computer on and doing some hardcore gaming – again, all without needing that keyboard and mouse connected.

 

[Filben]

I'm used to Windows since 95 and I don't have the need to switch and/or to learn a new OS. Windows does the job just fine when I play games and use Word or Excel a few times a month, or browse on the internet or watch videos and movies.

I had to manage to navigate Linux on the Steam Deck, desktop mode and even simple things like erasing files directly without moving them to the trash bin was something I had to figure out. This is not something I want for my everyday use.

 

[ReBurn]

If Linux wants to take over the reins from Windows, it needs a killer app. That app (or experience) should be so good that it's worth all the effort and pain switching over for.

But ever since Linux came into existence, it's only selling point seems to be "THIS IS THE PERFECT OS FOR PEOPLE WHO HATE MICROSOFT AND LOVE UNIX". It doesn't outperform Windows in any meaningful way, it's not more user friendly, it doesn't run games better, it doesn't have a bigger application library, in fact it's the opposite of all of those things.

It's a perfect OS though for people who enjoy learning a new OS and getting things to work rather than using an OS and creating work using applications. But even those born tinkerers will have off-days when they boot Windows to save themselves a day of exasperation.

But as long as Linux doesn't have a killer app, I'm not going to spend days or even weeks to learn a new OS, get all of my external hardware working, find replacements for apps that aren't available on Linux, learn how to use those replacements apps to find out Linux is only different from Windows but not better in any meaningful way.

Linux as an entity won't overtake Windows unless Windows ceases to exist. There are too many distros and as a result it is way too fragmented to be a competitive singular entity to Windows. A killer app wouldn't make a difference because there's no guarantee that it will run efficiently, or even at all, on every Linux install. But with modern Linux that is kind of the point.

Linux wasn't created with the intention of taking over the Windows market. It was designed as a server OS with and focused on high data processing volume throughput and multiprocessing. Different flavors emerged as processing needs became specialized and distros exist to focus on those specialized needs.

Desktop use is the goal of a handful of distros but the problem is that there are multiple distro projects vying for the desktop. As such the Linux desktop experience is inconsistent and generally not well integrated. These days people want integration and convenience, which is the modern killer app. That's never going to happen with Linux. MacOS fills that gap for a *nix perspective and is a better competitor on the desktop than Linux will probably ever be.

 

[kurisu_1974]

Linux is great as backend server or to run services or applications on a dedicated device like a Pi.

As a desktop? No thanks I'm good.

 

[RoboFu]

I still like Ubuntu.. as a developer it usually has the most up to date drivers and what not.

But I’m also an experienced Linux user so I can install and quickly configure Unbuntu to a very low level user experience.

I don’t have on Linux though. Too much trouble still.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Linux is great as backend server or to run services or applications on a dedicated device like a Pi.

As a desktop? No thanks I'm good.

But it works as a desktop.

 

[kurisu_1974]

But it works as a desktop.

It does the essentials I guess. I hate using it though. I think the strength of Linux is not its half assed desktop with its half assed applications that are more or less always worse than the Windows versions. It's in the CLI and being able to run stuff with minimal overhead.

 

[Hudo]

In the long-term it's easier for me to deal with Linux' shit than with Windows. And even on my Fedora Silverblue machine, I have yet to encounter a game that I couldn't get running. That being said, I am not a big multi-player guy, so maybe that's why I have an easier time.

 

[64gigabyteram]

t doesn't outperform Windows in any meaningful way, it's not more user friendly, it doesn't run games better, it doesn't have a bigger application library, in fact it's the opposite of all of those things.

It outperforms Windows in many basic tasks due to being more lightweight and the speed of the system doesn't degrade over the period of the install like Windows does
It can be as user friendly or user unfriendly as you want it to be, depending on your customization of the OS. That's the selling point. The freedom...
And as for the runs games better part.... There are many older games that you can give a major performance boost thanks to DXVK.

Operating systems really aren't like consoles. You need a lot more than a Killer app to make everyone use Linux... And besides, I can't think of one that would play into the strengths of Linux. Like what Killer app are you thinking of? a painting app? Video editing software? Filemanager?

Linux exists because there will inevitably be a day where MS shits the bed with Windows so hard that the OS becomes unusable. Maybe it's the new UI many people do not like. Or the TPM requirements on Windows 11, when Windows 10 goes out of commission. Maybe it'll be the new Windows as a service initiative they have going on. Either way, people are getting fed up.

It also exists because it's easier to use and tailor make for other systems. Take SteamOS for example. It's more efficient and battery saving than Windows on ROG Ally, and performs better at lower wattages despite running with a far less powerful chip and playing all of its games thru a translation layer. That's the power of being able to modify the kernel from the ground up.

Linux as an entity won't overtake Windows unless Windows ceases to exist. There are too many distros and as a result it is way too fragmented to be a competitive singular entity to Windows. A killer app wouldn't make a difference because there's no guarantee that it will run efficiently, or even at all, on every Linux install. But with modern Linux that is kind of the point.

This is also kind of wrong. If every app is built on the same Linux then it works with your Linux distro. It's just entirely dependent on the way you get it distributed to you, whether through your package manager, software library, or what file format the damn thing even comes to you in. Even then, that's becoming more homogenized and streamlined thanks to sandboxing like Flatpak and AppImage (the latter of which works exactly like EXE would on Windows)

The Distros are the biggest strength. The ability to easily switch to another OS if one ain't working out for you is what makes it good.

 

[JCK75]

When you have a specific build like SteamOS/ChromeOS where it's built for the hardware with regular updates and a refined interface, it's fantastic
But I only want this on portable gaming devices and perhaps if there is a steam console at some point for something like that.

When it comes to my desktop, Linux has too many limitations in things I need to run and I would never been satisfied.
it's come a long way though... it's not out of the question in the future.

 

[TheDreadLord]

UNIX and its derivatives are tailored for people solving/dealing with real issues like engineering problems, high perf. software development, etc.

Not sure why all this buzz around using it for gaming. I guess it comes from Mac OS being relatively popular (?).

 

[Neo_GAF]

I've grown up with Windows, know its oddities and how to get around them. I don't feel the need to learn something new that doesn't really add on top of something I don't really miss... I need my computer for a littley productivity (emails, word, excel, cutting videos) and mostly for gaming. For both of these needs Windows 11 works perfectly.

same. grew up in the 90s with win95. switched to mac over 10 years ago. i like how slick and unbuggy everything works, but the usability is very limited.
i tried getting into linux mid2000s and it was utter trash.
never looked back
but with steamOS and steamdeck i would love to give it another try, but atm its too expensive for me.

 

[Filben]

Not sure why all this buzz around using it for gaming.

My guess is that some people are unhappy with Windows – because of Microsoft's policies and data 'collectathon' and telemetry and how Windows is at times pretty patronising towards the user – would love to switch but the same people are also gamers and want the best of both worlds; the gaming convenience of Windows and also the customisation and open nature of Linux. Or that you have more options and don't have to stick to Windows just because you want to play games, that you could always choose a different option without missing out on games or gaming.

 

[Azelover]

Ok, that was big. I'm not gonna read all of that. But I will assume you are making a case for Linux.

To which I'll say. I'm used to Windows and Android. It's comfortable just staying with them. If absolutely necessary I would definitely switch. But it's not the case currently..

 

[Soodanim]

UNIX and its derivatives are tailored for people solving/dealing with real issues like engineering problems, high perf. software development, etc.

Not sure why all this buzz around using it for gaming. I guess it comes from Mac OS being relatively popular (?).

1. No Microsoft and everything that does or potentially could come with that
   1. Remember GFWL and wanting to move away from traditional exe into their own storefront
2. Less overheads getting in the way of performance
3. Free

 

[BennyBlanco]

I had no experience with it at all before the Steam Deck but I actually really like it. No bloatware. Nice and snappy. Took me a while to wrap my head around the way files are organized but it’s totally fine. The fact that everything is free and works as well as it does is crazy. Proton is a game changer and Valve is a gift to the gaming community.

 

[Unknown?]

If Linux wants to take over the reins from Windows, it needs a killer app. That app (or experience) should be so good that it's worth all the effort and pain switching over for.

But ever since Linux came into existence, it's only selling point seems to be "THIS IS THE PERFECT OS FOR PEOPLE WHO HATE MICROSOFT AND LOVE UNIX". It doesn't outperform Windows in any meaningful way, it's not more user friendly, it doesn't run games better, it doesn't have a bigger application library, in fact it's the opposite of all of those things.

It's a perfect OS though for people who enjoy learning a new OS and getting things to work rather than using an OS and creating work using applications. But even those born tinkerers will have off-days when they boot Windows to save themselves a day of exasperation.

But as long as Linux doesn't have a killer app, I'm not going to spend days or even weeks to learn a new OS, get all of my external hardware working, find replacements for apps that aren't available on Linux, learn how to use those replacements apps to find out Linux is only different from Windows but not better in any meaningful way.

The killer app is freedom. You can modify it and customize it in ways that Windows can't. If you only use it for basic things like surfing or emails then even Chrome OS is a better fit than Windows.

As for user friendliness, I'd argue many distros are on par with it.

 

[phant0m]

I'm waiting for Valve to make the Steam Deck OS into a general PC distro so that it works on any hardware. I admit I haven't tried Linux for many years but I see no need to switch right now.

same. i really dislike what Windows has become as an OS since 8. Holo (Steam Deck's OS) has been pretty great so far with making things just work.

Sadly I think we'll be waiting awhile and it doesn't really support nVidia GPUs at all right now.

 

[Raploz]

Finally, if you're using a wifi card or adapter you're going to have a terrible first installation. Many distros don't come with wifi drivers and out of the box only support ethernet. You'll have to hook your PC up to the router or your phone to connect to the internet and install drivers. Whether or not this is different for mobos that have built in Wifi, it's certainly something to look out for.

Hey OP, this is not true. Linux ships most drivers with the Kernel, Including Wi-Fi and Bluetooth drivers, what happens is that because the drivers are usually built-in, if your hardware is too new or the Linux Kernel version you're using was released before your hardware (e.g. you're using a long term support distribution like Ubuntu LTS), you won't have those drivers, but most of the time the drivers are built-in and you don't have to install them.

I've been a Linux enthusiast for years, and I daily drive it. The problem with Linux nowadays is that it's perfect for either basic (e.g your grandma) or power-users, while intermediary users that THINK they know how to operate a computer (but actually don't) get a slap in the face when they try to do something advanced they don't understand well. If you're only browsing the web, watching cat videos and using spreadsheets Linux works perfectly fine, and if you are very technically minded and know how to perform complex operations you'll also have an easy time with it. Now, if you're somewhere in the middle and try to do advanced stuff without fully understanding what you're doing (e.g copying and pasting random commands from the internet without understanding what they do), you WILL break your system because Linux does not impose ANY limit to what a user can do. Heck, you can even delete your Kernel or the user interface if you want.

What's weird is how no one would blame Windows if it broke because the user replaced random system files and DLLs, but when the same users do that with Linux and the system breaks, it's always Linux's fault.

Remember: "With great power comes great responsibility".

 

[Crayon]

perfect for either basic (e.g your grandma) or power-users, while intermediary users that THINK they know how to operate a computer (but actually don't) get a slap in the face

This is so true. When I have a family member with a trashed computer, they get linux. idgaf. They won't know the difference anyway. I'm not going to be getting calls for a computer slowing down or stuck updating or hassling them to use different products etc. In fact, I'm not going to hear from them for a long time. Meanwhile it's the... uh... power users.... who can wreck their install and think linux is so unstable and hard to use. See linus in the 1 month linux challenge remove his desktop after the prompt tried to warn him again and again.

 

[64gigabyteram]

hile intermediary users that THINK they know how to operate a computer (but actually don't) get a slap in the face when they try to do something advanced they don't understand well.

this is me.

I can poke and prod around in the registry, install OSes, do all that funky stuff. But i know nothing about programming and never had much use for the windows powertools
Using linux for the first time and even now, the terminal still isnt a strong suit of mine. gotta copy paste commands on the internet

 

[nowhat]

It's a perfect OS though for people who enjoy learning a new OS and getting things to work rather than using an OS and creating work using applications. But even those born tinkerers will have off-days when they boot Windows to save themselves a day of exasperation.

As a web dev, it has paid the bills for nearly 20 years now and is my daily driver both at work and at home. I do have a Windows VM for some rare legacy apps though, but I try to avoid booting it if possible and can go weeks without doing so.

 

[FateTrap]

I'm used to Windows since 95 and I don't have the need to switch and/or to learn a new OS. Windows does the job just fine when I play games and use Word or Excel a few times a month, or browse on the internet or watch videos and movies.

I had to manage to navigate Linux on the Steam Deck, desktop mode and even simple things like erasing files directly without moving them to the trash bin was something I had to figure out. This is not something I want for my everyday use.

To be perfectly honest there is virtually nothing important that windows does better than any other operating system.

Haven't you ever noticed that windows audio drivers have been zero quality for years?
Haven't you noticed that Word is only optimal for writing a shopping list or a short text that could have been created just as well with dozens of other apps?
For texts longer than 15 pages, LaTeX is already more optimal than Word.

Same story with Excel which is slow with large datasets and only optimal for small datasets for which you might as well have used Gnumeric (or many other software apps).
windows is a strange phenomenon, it only exists because people are too lazy to learn something new.

Most windows users people can no longer claim to be professionals because if you use a proprietary system you cannot give as strong guarantees regarding privacy of the data obtained.
For the climate, windows is not good either, all those apps and telemetry running very poorly optimized.

 

[FateTrap]

Linux as an entity won't overtake Windows unless Windows ceases to exist.

Linux left windows behind a long time ago.
Android is as much a Linux system as Ubuntu. It fits the definition of Linux perfectly.

And as everyone knows, Android has been more popular than windows for years.
Even in the Cloud, smart devices and IoT, Linux is more popular than windows. All new cars being developed use Linux for their UI or other things. Linux is woven into countless products, while windows is only present on the desktop.

And you can say that Chromebooks have proven that Linux works just fine on the desktop as well.

 

[FateTrap]

As such the Linux desktop experience is inconsistent and generally not well integrated. These days people want integration and convenience, which is the modern killer app. That's never going to happen with Linux.

If you take a weekly look at unixporn you will find that the Linux and BSD world has no shortage of extremely talented UI developers. Have you never wondered why there is no super refined Linux desktop system and why Unity 8 has been discontinued? Do you also not ask yourself the question why there is no general standard like Flatpak, Guix, Nix, AppImage or Snap that works perfectly?

I think this is mainly because there are few people in the Linux world who want to put a large part of the Microsoft crew out of work. But make no mistake, it is not the least problem for the Linux world to develop a desktop system that reduces windows to a farce in all 'desktop areas'.

 

[FateTrap]

same. grew up in the 90s with win95. switched to mac over 10 years ago. i like how slick and unbuggy everything works, but the usability is very limited.
i tried getting into linux mid2000s and it was utter trash.
never looked back
but with steamOS and steamdeck i would love to give it another try, but atm its too expensive for me.

Without knowing it, you've actually been using Linux all these years anyway. Not many people know this but Safari, the browser all macOS users use, is based on a Linux (KDE) browser.

Furthermore, many important core components of macOS have been based on FreeBSD software.

 

[boblob]

Last time I installed Linux it lasted a month before it failed to boot because there was something up with the boot sector in the HDD and I had to learn what GRUB was to fix it.
Then it happened again, and I went back to Windows.

Same machine never had an issue with Windows before or after that ill fated attempt to switch, and I can’t be bothered going back in to that world just to get my computer to turn on. Linux is great until it suddenly isn’t, and when it isn’t it isn’t so much that it makes you give up on it.
Computers should just work. Linux might be there now, but I’m never going to find out

 

[ReBurn]

If you take a weekly look at unixporn you will find that the Linux and BSD world has no shortage of extremely talented UI developers. Have you never wondered why there is no super refined Linux desktop system and why Unity 8 has been discontinued? Do you also not ask yourself the question why there is no general standard like Flatpak, Guix, Nix, AppImage or Snap that works perfectly?

I think this is mainly because there are few people in the Linux world who want to put a large part of the Microsoft crew out of work. But make no mistake, it is not the least problem for the Linux world to develop a desktop system that reduces windows to a farce in all 'desktop areas'.

While I don't doubt that there are many great UX designers and developers in the Linux and BSD world I completely disagree with your assessment that they could reduce Windows to a farce.

Windows and MacOS have the benefit of dedicated product ecosystems and integration API's that probably won't ever exist for Linux due to the open and democratic nature of Linux. One of the reasons for so many different flavors of Linux is due to the community's inability to rally around a consistent purpose and focus on it. It will take much more than pretty UI to become the dominant desktop OS. It will take leadership and focus that is antithetical to most non-commercial open source projects.

 

[Filben]

To be perfectly honest there is virtually nothing important that windows does better than any other operating system.

Haven't you ever noticed that windows audio drivers have been zero quality for years?
Haven't you noticed that Word is only optimal for writing a shopping list or a short text that could have been created just as well with dozens of other apps?
For texts longer than 15 pages, LaTeX is already more optimal than Word.

Same story with Excel which is slow with large datasets and only optimal for small datasets for which you might as well have used Gnumeric (or many other software apps).
windows is a strange phenomenon, it only exists because people are too lazy to learn something new.

Most windows users people can no longer claim to be professionals because if you use a proprietary system you cannot give as strong guarantees regarding privacy of the data obtained.
For the climate, windows is not good either, all those apps and telemetry running very poorly optimized.

Nothing to argue there, you're probably right.

As I said, I do simple Word and Excel stuff. I don't need to learn new programs for which I'm already perfectly fine with. Same with the OS. I'm learning new things everyday in my job, with my hobbies, when I'm outside and doing things I love. I don't want to add a new OS on top of that just for the sake of it. It's not fun to me and I fortunately don't need to for my work or for the other stuff I've been doing on my PC.

 

[Tams]

Haven't you ever noticed that windows audio drivers have been zero quality for years?
Haven't you noticed that Word is only optimal for writing a shopping list or a short text that could have been created just as well with dozens of other apps?
For texts longer than 15 pages, LaTeX is already more optimal than Word.

Using a shopping list as an example for Word use? Even Microsoft themselves have several other programs that are better at and even specifically for that. What a poor example.

Anyway, 'LaTeX'. Yeah, I know academics love it, but you need to learn how to even install the fucking thing. Not to mention all the competing different editors, almost all with websites that look like they are from the 90s.

Microsoft have several WYSIWYG text editors, most that also support pen input (without having to install anything extra - that then didn't work half the time).

I've spent literal hours messing about with much lauded free software for text layout. In the end, I just went back to MS Word, Publisher, OneNote, and even PowerPoint, because they just work.

 

[FateTrap]

Nothing to argue there, you're probably right.

As I said, I do simple Word and Excel stuff. I don't need to learn new programs for which I'm already perfectly fine with. Same with the OS. I'm learning new things everyday in my job, with my hobbies, when I'm outside and doing things I love. I don't want to add a new OS on top of that just for the sake of it. It's not fun to me and I fortunately don't need to for my work or for the other stuff I've been doing on my PC.

Windows hasn't stayed the same over the years either. A fair number of things have changed in the XP -> Vista -> windows7 -> windows8 -> windows10 -> windows11 cycle.To learn to work with a user-friendly Linux distro is not a step much bigger than learning to work with a new windows edition. You have a lot of apps in the Linux world that work very similarly to Word. And you also have a lot of apps that work similarly to Excel. If I remember correctly, most of the functions in Gnumeric work exactly the same as in Excel. But Gnumeric has higher performance and unlike Excel, it makes no or far fewer calculation errors.

The problem with windows is that it is meant for old people and non-technical users to hold their hands. So what you see with 98% of windows users is that after using it for decades, they have learned next to nothing in terms of operating systems. Systems like windows and macOS encourage stupidity in the IT world. I also very often notice that the best IT apps don't work as well on macOS and windows. Think of RawTherapee, which crashes all the time on macOS, but is completely stable on Linux and BSD systems. Think of mpv media player which works perfectly on Linux, but works much less well on windows. Although it has better picture quality and efficiency than all windows alternatives. Many apps also have higher performance on Linux and BSD. And most malware is still developed for windows. So windows users fall victim to malware very frequently. Furthermore, Microsoft also has a very long history of privacy abuse.

People who are not pathetic do not stay stuck in abusive relationships for years.

 

[StueyDuck]

If you need 500 things to make something work vs just launching the game then it'll never be the best option.

Linux as everyone knows is great for servers and so on but for dedicated gaming it's just too much of a headache when on PC I just click play

 

[K2D]

I'm not smart enough to just 'get it' right off the bat.. I've got to work at it, and I have been working at it at two or three separate occasions.

For the time being I've still given up, but I really want to have the option and freedom of choice in the future, so I'll probably try again.

 

[Filben]

A fair number of things have changed in the XP -> windows7 -> windows8 -> windows10 -> windows11 cycle

Sure, but we're talking about changes over two decades. What have changed for me from W10 to 11 is a more unified UI, some slight changes to the right click context menu and the addition of having tabs in the file explorer. The rest is the same user experience to me when I was using W10. And the jump from 7 to 10 wasn't that much of a change either. If I was using XP and jumped straight to W11 this might be a different story. Then again, Windows has its oddities and certain "ways" to handle things that just stick with it. The "Windows experience" is more or less the same. Even its constrains are so common that I've learned my ways around it, or that I can anticipate what it is doing when something don't work the way I want (which is rarely happening these days).

I'm completely fine with what's Windows is offering. Even if I was getting familiar with Linux to the same level and it would only took a day it's a day I don't want to spend. I'm fine in my Windows cave of ignorance to Linux.

 

[FateTrap]

Last time I installed Linux it lasted a month before it failed to boot because there was something up with the boot sector in the HDD and I had to learn what GRUB was to fix it.
Then it happened again, and I went back to Windows.

Same machine never had an issue with Windows before or after that ill fated attempt to switch, and I can’t be bothered going back in to that world just to get my computer to turn on. Linux is great until it suddenly isn’t, and when it isn’t it isn’t so much that it makes you give up on it.
Computers should just work. Linux might be there now, but I’m never going to find out

There are Linux distributions that virtually never have this kind of problem, and there are Linux distributions that frequently have this kind of problem. Do not blame "Linux" when you have had a specific problem because you have used one of the least quality distributions. This simply means you don't know what the quality distributions are. It says little or nothing about Linux.

Your specific problem would probably have been avoided by using one of the following systems:
mageia, Mint, Devuan, FreeBSD, Void Linux, openSUSE

 

[FateTrap]

While I don't doubt that there are many great UX designers and developers in the Linux and BSD world I completely disagree with your assessment that they could reduce Windows to a farce.

Windows and MacOS have the benefit of dedicated product ecosystems and integration API's that probably won't ever exist for Linux due to the open and democratic nature of Linux. One of the reasons for so many different flavors of Linux is due to the community's inability to rally around a consistent purpose and focus on it. It will take much more than pretty UI to become the dominant desktop OS. It will take leadership and focus that is antithetical to most non-commercial open source projects.

I think it is a farce. You have super large organisations using LibreOffice instead of MS Office without any problems. It usually doesn't matter in reality in terms of productivity and features. It's just, MS Office is paying even though it doesn't have any killer features that you can't match with free software. You can replace Active Directory with FreeIPA. Etc.

You have many companies using Coda doc instead of MS Office. Again, they mostly use it because they find it more convenient than MS Office. You have companies that use Collabora. You have companies that use ONLYOFFICE. Usually, you see that they are more productive with this software than with MS Office.

There are large companies in India, Turkey, Russia, Africa, China, Germany, Korea, France, Spain, Japan, Norway, USA, Italy etc where they have completely replaced windows with Linux systems. The conclusion of all this empirical evidence: Using Linux is usually not a deterioration in your software. And you save a lot of money.

I will make the statement that most companies can even use FreeBSD for all their desktop systems, and that this is anything but a difficult transformation.

 

[nemiroff]

I've been a Linux "pro" for two decades in engineering and development teams, but I have to say Linux nerds online are the most obnoxious shills. Yikes..

 

[FateTrap]

If you need 500 things to make something work vs just launching the game then it'll never be the best option.

Linux as everyone knows is great for servers and so on but for dedicated gaming it's just too much of a headache when on PC I just click play

Gaming is often not click and play on windows.

I remember when Assassin's Creed Odyssey came out there were tons of bugs in the game. (as is often the case with modern games) I played this game through Wine + DXVK on Arch Linux. My sister had played the game on windows10, on a high-end desktop system. She then also played the game on my Arch Linux desktop for several hours and was impressed about the stability of the game. She said the experience was much better than on her windows10 system.

Going where no Steam Play has gone before with Elite Dangerous

Going where no Steam Play has gone before with Elite Dangerous

What’s the one game keeping you a dual booter? Maybe it’s PUBG, or Rainbow Six: Siege? Maybe it used to be Overwatch? For me, that game was Elite Dangerous, and one year on from Proton’s release, I have a story to tell.

www.gamingonlinux.com

Meanwhile, on the way, something amazing happened. Those custom patches had made their way into mainline Proton, DXVK had improved, and suddenly, with one small tweak (installing dotnet40, needed for the launcher), I could fly my ship on Linux.
Not only that, but the issues I’d always had with the drivers for my HOTAS, a Saitek x52 Pro, were all gone, including installers that aren’t even fully compatible with Windows 10, default clutch modes that just don’t go away, and weird bugs picking up some buttons as a 2nd mouse. On Linux, a perfectly usable driver for the joystick and throttle is right there in the kernel! The game fully picked up my Ultra-Wide monitor, when on Windows the OS would fight and move my other windows around failing to compensate. “ED Market Connector”, an external app I use for journey tracking, trade data sharing, and more, has a fully working Linux version. Lastly, and this blows my mind, it all works in VR — Sheer magic.

Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows

Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows

interesting article on phoronix, a linux portal always well informed about the evolution of gpu drivers on linux Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Blender-2.80-GPU-Requirements

blenderartists.org

Radeon Drivers stability in linux vs windows?


Phoronix has come to the conclusion several times that the Mesa driver is the most stable 3D driver and the driver with the highest performance for 3D apps.
What this means is that the open-source Linux drivers from AMD and Intel have higher performance and higher stability than the windows drivers.

Clear Linux vs windows for gaming.

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/windows_10_vs_ubuntu_vs_clear_linux_vs_debian_on_intel_core_i9/432aff7.svgz

Clear Linux With Mesa 13 Is A Strong Match For Intel Linux Performance - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

https://openbenchmarking.org/embed.php?i=1910200-HU-ICELAKEOS18&sha=432aff7&p=2

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/amd_epyc_genoa_linux_distro_benchmarks/fe276a0a39fe.svgz

https://global.discourse-cdn.com/clearlinux/optimized/2X/3/3044a67874369959acf91f3b8d063c1bb912af4c_2_580x500.png

https://openbenchmarking.org/embed.php?i=2205127-NE-XEONLINUX78&sha=a77475ab8838&p=2

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/up_squared_ubuntu_vs_clear_linux/432aff7.svgz

 

[StueyDuck]

Gaming is often not click and play on windows.

I remember when Assassin's Creed Odyssey came out there were tons of bugs in the game. (as is often the case with modern games) I played this game through Wine + DXVK on Arch Linux. My sister had played the game on windows10, on a high-end desktop system. She then also played the game on my Arch Linux desktop for several hours and was impressed about the stability of the game. She said the experience was much better than on her windows10 system.

Going where no Steam Play has gone before with Elite Dangerous

Going where no Steam Play has gone before with Elite Dangerous

What’s the one game keeping you a dual booter? Maybe it’s PUBG, or Rainbow Six: Siege? Maybe it used to be Overwatch? For me, that game was Elite Dangerous, and one year on from Proton’s release, I have a story to tell.

www.gamingonlinux.com

Meanwhile, on the way, something amazing happened. Those custom patches had made their way into mainline Proton, DXVK had improved, and suddenly, with one small tweak (installing dotnet40, needed for the launcher), I could fly my ship on Linux.
Not only that, but the issues I’d always had with the drivers for my HOTAS, a Saitek x52 Pro, were all gone, including installers that aren’t even fully compatible with Windows 10, default clutch modes that just don’t go away, and weird bugs picking up some buttons as a 2nd mouse. On Linux, a perfectly usable driver for the joystick and throttle is right there in the kernel! The game fully picked up my Ultra-Wide monitor, when on Windows the OS would fight and move my other windows around failing to compensate. “ED Market Connector”, an external app I use for journey tracking, trade data sharing, and more, has a fully working Linux version. Lastly, and this blows my mind, it all works in VR — Sheer magic.

Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows

Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows

interesting article on phoronix, a linux portal always well informed about the evolution of gpu drivers on linux Blender Developers Find Old Linux Drivers Are Better Maintained Than Windows https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Blender-2.80-GPU-Requirements

blenderartists.org

Radeon Drivers stability in linux vs windows?


Phoronix has come to the conclusion several times that the Mesa driver is the most stable 3D driver and the driver with the highest performance for 3D apps.
What this means is that the open-source Linux drivers from AMD and Intel have higher performance and higher stability than the windows drivers.

Clear Linux vs windows for gaming.

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/windows_10_vs_ubuntu_vs_clear_linux_vs_debian_on_intel_core_i9/432aff7.svgz

Clear Linux With Mesa 13 Is A Strong Match For Intel Linux Performance - Phoronix

www.phoronix.com

https://openbenchmarking.org/embed.php?i=1910200-HU-ICELAKEOS18&sha=432aff7&p=2

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/amd_epyc_genoa_linux_distro_benchmarks/fe276a0a39fe.svgz

https://global.discourse-cdn.com/clearlinux/optimized/2X/3/3044a67874369959acf91f3b8d063c1bb912af4c_2_580x500.png

https://openbenchmarking.org/embed.php?i=2205127-NE-XEONLINUX78&sha=a77475ab8838&p=2

https://www.phoronix.com/benchmark/result/up_squared_ubuntu_vs_clear_linux/432aff7.svgz

When you have to post 13 different links and a whole document of text then you are kind of proving my point.

Gaming on pc does have its issues but at the end of the day it's still easier to use which is why 99% of users won't do it.

And with apple coming to the party now in a more meaningful way you are going to see alot more people jump ship to Mac (if they support it properly) Linux is great for people who really wanna use Linux, but it's not gonna be for most people, at the end of the day it's a fucking headache to setup.

 

[Porticus]

AMD video drivers on windows let me use VRR/freesync through HDMI for my TV while Linux doesn't even support it natively, let alone for HDMI connection (only DP), just saying.

Much stability....

 

[FateTrap]

AMD video drivers on windows let me use VRR/freesync through HDMI for my TV while Linux doesn't even support it natively, let alone for HDMI connection (only DP), just saying.

Much stability....

I don't think it will be long before FreeSync works perfectly on Linux systems.

Linux Wayland is pixel-perfect and if you get high FPS in a game and use a fast panel (144Hz) then your experience should feel the same as G-Sync or FreeSync.
It's only at low frame rates that FreeSync is really useful on Linux systems, but don't forget that most FreeSync monitors don't offer FreeSync when your fps drops below a certain (low) frame rate.
The point I want to make is that in most situations FreeSync is not going to make any difference.

When you have to post 13 different links and a whole document of text then you are kind of proving my point.

Gaming on pc does have its issues but at the end of the day it's still easier to use which is why 99% of users won't do it.

And with apple coming to the party now in a more meaningful way you are going to see alot more people jump ship to Mac (if they support it properly) Linux is great for people who really wanna use Linux, but it's not gonna be for most people, at the end of the day it's a fucking headache to setup.

I gave several proofs of standard situations where windows just does not work properly. How can you call something that doesn't even work properly 'easier to use'.

At the end of the day, McDonald's is the most popular and 'easiest' eating place for the average person. But let's see if it's the "best" place to eat:

Report: Consumers say McDonald's has the worst quality fast food

Report: Consumers say McDonald's has the worst quality fast food

The golden arches chain could use some help in the kitchen, according to a new consumer report.

www.foxnews.com

Obesity is a Common, Serious, and Costly Disease

Get the latest data and facts about adult obesity in the US.

www.cdc.gov

From 1999 –2000 through 2017 –March 2020, US obesity prevalence increased from 30.5% to 41.9%. During the same time, the prevalence of severe obesity increased from 4.7% to 9.2%.

I think it is much more useful to look at what is best than what is easiest:
World of Warcraft:
Minecraft Benchmark:
The Witcher 3:
Marvel’s Spider-Man:
Uncharted: Legacy of Thieves Collection:
Assassin's Creed Valhalla:
Cyberpunk 2077:
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive:
Godfall:
Monster Hunter World:
Dirt Rally 2.0 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywJUyUG3qWM

I know there's no system easier to install than Clear Linux. And once installed, it automatically keeps itself up to date. You can't make a system much easier than this anyway.
It's pretty obvious to me which is best, and that's all I care about. I care much less about the 'easiest' thing, but you're wrong there too.

 

[StueyDuck]

I don't think it will be long before FreeSync works perfectly on Linux systems.

Linux Wayland is pixel-perfect and if you get high FPS in a game and use a fast panel (144Hz) then your experience should feel the same as G-Sync or FreeSync.
It's only at low frame rates that FreeSync is really useful on Linux systems, but don't forget that most FreeSync monitors don't offer FreeSync when your fps drops below a certain (low) frame rate.
The point I want to make is that in most situations FreeSync is not going to make any difference.



I gave several proofs of standard situations where windows just does not work properly. How can you call something that doesn't even work properly 'easier to use'.

At the end of the day, McDonald's is the most popular and 'easiest' eating place for the average person. But let's see if it's the "best" place to eat:

Report: Consumers say McDonald's has the worst quality fast food

Report: Consumers say McDonald's has the worst quality fast food

The golden arches chain could use some help in the kitchen, according to a new consumer report.

www.foxnews.com

Obesity is a Common, Serious, and Costly Disease

Get the latest data and facts about adult obesity in the US.

www.cdc.gov

From 1999 –2000 through 2017 –March 2020, US obesity prevalence increased from 30.5% to 41.9%. During the same time, the prevalence of severe obesity increased from 4.7% to 9.2%.

I think it is much more useful to look at what is best than what is easiest:
World of Warcraft:
Minecraft Benchmark:
The Witcher 3:
Marvel’s Spider-Man:
Uncharted: Legacy of Thieves Collection:
Assassin's Creed Valhalla:
Cyberpunk 2077:
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive:
Godfall:
Monster Hunter World:
Dirt Rally 2.0 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywJUyUG3qWM

I know there's no system easier to install than Clear Linux. And once installed, it automatically keeps itself up to date. You can't make a system much easier than this anyway.
It's pretty obvious to me which is best, and that's all I care about. I care much less about the 'easiest' thing, but you're wrong there too.

Lol ok

If it was that much better everyone would be using it. Again you've installed a 100 things and there's 5000 different open-source options etc.

I mean I don't know who you think you are convincing except yourself. People use windows and Mac because it's easier..

 

[FateTrap]

Lol ok

If it was that much better everyone would be using it. Again you've installed a 100 things and there's 5000 different open-source options etc.

I mean I don't know who you think you are convincing except yourself. People use windows and Mac because it's easier..

It is mainly an educational problem.
I think people just use windows and macOS because it's how they were taught.
Persons who would learn to work with Linux or BSD at school (and would not have to deal with macOS or Windows) would be much more likely to use it later in life.

At its core, this boils down to a basic reality. If teachers were gifted, education would be a very useful tool that would benefit people for the rest of their lives.
If teachers are mentally less bright, then there is a high probability that the majority of people will be educated to be imbeciles.

Why scholars should write in Markdown

https://blogs.harvard.edu/pamphlet/files/2014/08/markdownpost-acmsmall.pdf

Our IQ is steadily declining

Our IQ is steadily declining

Should you be worried?

sciencenorway.no

There was once a study that tested the language skills of Linux, macOS and Windows users.
That test showed that Linux users had significantly better language skills than the macOS and windows users.

Educationally windows and macOS don't have a positive impact.

It is also not correct that windows is much easier. Suppose I were to run a test and time how long the following tasks take:
- Compare windows installation time with Alpine Linux installation time
- Time of installing packages with xbps package manager or apk package manager versus installing the same software with windows
- Time of configuration of many popular open-source software on BSD or Linux, versus configuration time of this software on windows

Etc.

What you will see is that in all these basic situations the windows users will be much slower and will need much more time. Is this because windows is 'easier'?

I once had my sister install the super useful and popular magic-wormhole package on windows. It literally took her almost 90 minutes to troubleshoot all the issues and configure everything correctly. On my FreeBSD/Void Linux/Devuan/mageia/.. systems it all installed completely in +- 20 seconds.

So much for the ease of windows in installing popular Python apps. I have a popular webcam manufactured by Microsoft. It works perfectly in FreeBSD, but windows10 has no working driver for it, although it is a Microsoft product with a 'windows10 compatible' sticker on it.

I just mean that windows is something made for and by imbeciles.