Support NeoGAF

[havoc00]

Microsoft's next big game, the RPG Avowed from The Outer Worlds developer Obsidian, is coming out in February. Unlike some of Obsidian's other RPGs, Avowed is not an open-world game. This serves the game best, Avowed region director Berto Ritger said.

Avowed features large "defined zones," as opposed to taking place in an open world. Ritger said having established and distinct zones is a "good pacing mechanism" for the choices players make.

"We know roughly what you've done before you've gone to the next thing. It's still a very open structure within those zones, where you can do whatever you want for the most part, but it's not one contiguous area where you could be anywhere at any moment," Ritger said in an interview with Xbox Wire.

Narrative designer Kate Dollarhyde echoed Ritger, saying in the interview that one of the difficult elements of open-world games is pacing.

"You never know where the player is and what they're doing at any given time. So having these zones that happen in sequence means we always know what content you've just come from on the critical path," Dollarhyde said. "Maybe not what side quests you've done, but we always know you’ve just had this [core] experience."

Avowed releases on February 18 for Xbox and PC, and it will be available at launch for Xbox Game Pass. In addition to Avowed, Obsidian is making The Outer Worlds 2, which is also set for release in 2025.

In other Xbox news, Microsoft just recently held the latest Xbox Developer Direct event, and it included some big news and reveals, including the announcement of Ninja Gaiden 4.

Avowed Not Being Open-World Is A Good Thing, Devs Say

Avowed has "defined zones" that are large, but the developers say being truly open-world is not in the game's best interests.

www.gamespot.com

 

[rm082e]

That approach can work great, or it can be lame. It all comes down to the design. They've got to have enough interesting things for you to do in each zone and get some sense of meaningful progress before moving you onto the next.

 

[Mr Moose]

Microsoft's next big game

Hmm.

Not being open-world doesn't really matter too much for RPGs, I don't think, as long as the story is good.

 

[cormack12]

So kinda like Inquisition? I don't mind that hub model. I don't think it quite solves the problem they are talking about.

If you have sidequests, whatever the game then it will detract from the main pace of the game.

I don't think there is an answer to it though unless former over arching narrative is not a time sensitive cataclysmic event

 

[Buggy Loop]

Like BG3 chapters

 

[Cakeboxer]

Very few devs are good at filling open worlds anyways so this is good news.

 

[HogIsland]

This works pretty well in Outer Worlds.

 

[Alexios]

This is probably just gonna serve as bait for the negative nancies sadly, even though ace games that didn't make that game design distinction obvious by talking about it in this manner and people do think of as open world probably qualify as doing the same thing described here, like STALKER or Witcher or Baldur's Gate. To me it's whatever when discussed on its own in this manner, you can design a good open world game or you can design a good non open world game with levels, a seamless world or anything inbetween, just make it good. Fingers crossed for this one, it's very promising.

 

[Drake]

Avoid, non-buy-nary.

 

[drganon]

 

[adamsapple]

Very few devs are good at filling open worlds anyways so this is good news.

It's still got multiple big zones, if not a single big chunk like Skyrim etc, so there's gonna be a lot to explore as it is too.

 

[Mister Wolf]

I agree. Felt the same about Baldur's Gate 3 and Metro Exodus.

 

[Rawbutt Jellybean]

So like Indy? If so that'd be great and wish more devs would do it.

 

[March Climber]

So kinda like Inquisition? I don't mind that hub model. I don't think it quite solves the problem they are talking about.

If you have sidequests, whatever the game then it will detract from the main pace of the game.

I don't think there is an answer to it though unless former over arching narrative is not a time sensitive cataclysmic event

Inquisition’s problem is that it still had the grind of an open world game. If it wasn’t for that I would have been enjoying it better.

 

[DeepEnigma]

So, even less than "Elder Scrolls lite" that was trying to be coined.

 

[Kacho]

So like Indy? If so that'd be great and wish more devs would do it.

More like KOTOR if it’s like Outer Worlds. Large zones.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

It's ok, not every game needs to be a sprawling huge open world. Just depends on how they do it.

 

[adamsapple]

More like KOTOR if it’s like Outer Worlds. Large zones.

Yes, the game director said it's more like Outer Worlds in terms of structure, zones etc. Not a single big open land-mass.

Avowed might look like Skyrim, but its director says Obisidian's new fantasy RPG is actually much closer to The Outer Worlds than anything from Bethesda

And there's a healthy dose of Pillars of Eternity too, of course

www.yahoo.com

the comparisons with The Elder Scrolls 5 are inevitable. But according to Patel, that's not necessarily how the game actually plays out.

"As far as comparisons go structurally and mechanically, I'd say it's a bit closer to The Outer Worlds," she explains

 

[killatopak]

Disappointing for me personally. I expected open world from Obsidian.

The only good thing about this is that this would make the world more dense per se. I would love for them to reconsider it if a sequel ever becomes greenlit.

 

[ValiantInstance]

"We know roughly what you've done before you've gone to the next thing. It's still a very open structure within those zones, where you can do whatever you want for the most part, but it's not one contiguous area where you could be anywhere at any moment," Ritger said in an interview with Xbox Wire.

This is such a different mentality to what led to New Vegas.

 

[CompleteGlobalSaturation]

I prefer semi open hubs/zones versus open world games.

Open world games generally have inferior level design and variety.

 

[TVexperto]

The towns in the preview videos looked so empty, 2-3 NPCs thats it ... hope they will fix it for release

 

[Puscifer]

Witcher 2 was like this and everyone loved it. I actually prefer it because it lets you maximize small areas and reactivity in the world vs buy open worlds.

I replayed 2 several times and haven't even bothered with the DLC of Witcher 3 so there's that.

 

[R3TRO]

Good

Most open worlds are awful.

 

[Angry_Megalodon]

This is potentially good news since most devs nowadays suck at designing engaging open worlds.

 

[Badlucktroll]

I don’t really feel like getting this game

 

[DownLikeBCPowder]

Good for the developer, maybe...

And it can be a good thing, sure - we'll just have to see how it plays out. A well designed and more linear experience can be excellent. It just depends on the rationale I think behind the decision.

 

[M.W.]

30fps on console certainly is a choice too lol

 

[DeepEnigma]

30fps on console certainly is a choice too lol

Creative Decision™

 

[winjer]

Considering most devs use open world as padding for increase a game's length, instead of adding anything worthwhile, it's a good thing.

 

[Esppiral]

No lies detected

 

[Buggy Loop]

The towns in the preview videos looked so empty, 2-3 NPCs thats it ... hope they will fix it for release

There's not a single preview that could show or went into the starting area's first big city, City of Paradis.

 

[Mr Hyde]

I think this is a good approach. It can enhance the level design and make it more distinct in ways wide open areas cannot.

 

[Vlodril]

Personally i prefer hub design like the new deus ex games. Open worlds are vastly overrated because they are very hard to do in some aspects (pacing and quality of storytelling for example).

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Can anyone type up a short list of really successful new IP that wasn't open world? Preferably games released in the last 5 to 10 years?

 

[Sooner]

Can anyone type up a short list of really successful new IP that wasn't open world? Preferably games released in the last 5 to 10 years?

There aren't many new ips, in general. But lots of big franchises, especially Japanese, aren't open-world.

 

[Big Baller]

It better have some good quests and story

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

How many crusty white dudes are buying?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

There aren't many new ips, in general. But lots of big franchises, especially Japanese, aren't open-world.

I've heard people say this before, but Yakuza and Persona are kind of your ceilings and they're both heavy story centric franchises.

I don't think Avowed falls into that camp. Didn't the Final Fantasy director say they didn't want to go open world because it would have added two additional years of development? Then it came out and kind of did mediocre on the market. Gamers like open world. It is known.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Can anyone type up a short list of really successful new IP that wasn't open world? Preferably games released in the last 5 to 10 years?

Baldur's Gate 3
Sekiro
Black Myth Wukong
God of war (2018, not really old God of war)
Astro bot
Returnal
Bloodborne (up to 10 years you said)
Control
Hades
Metaphor: Refantazio

If you open up without "new IP"
Last of us part 2
Mario odyssey
Half Life Alyx
Titanfall 2
Uncharted 4
Alan wake 2
Ratchet and clank rift apart
Dishonored 2

Could even fit Nier automata here as its one large overworld but with series of smaller linear maps.
Starting area of Avowed is quite big and is only a tiny part of the world map. Even if they are split, its a huge game by all means.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Baldur's Gate 3
Sekiro
Black Myth Wukong
God of war (2018, not really old God of war)
Astro bot
Returnal
Bloodborne (up to 10 years you said)
Control
Hades
Metaphor: Refantazio

I feel like this is a pretty weak list if you want Avowed to make some waves in the industry.

Avowed strikes me as a gameplay oriented RPG with a bit of jank to it. That doesn't seem to fit with the higher performers on that list.

 

[Sooner]

I've heard people say this before, but Yakuza and Persona are kind of your ceilings and they're both heavy story centric franchises.

I don't think Avowed falls into that camp. Didn't the Final Fantasy director say they didn't want to go open world because it would have added two additional years of development? Then it came out and kind of did mediocre on the market. Gamers like open world. It is known.

FFXV was open-world and XVI is the much better game.

 

[adamsapple]

Avowed strikes me as a gameplay oriented RPG with a bit of jank to it. That doesn't seem to fit with the higher performers on that list.

And what does any of that have to do with being open world? Irrespective of Avowed, elaborate based on the other games that Buggy Loop mentioned.

 

[GigaBowser]

watched gameplayed for like 30 second annnnnnnd it looked like more boring skyrim hope its goord will get for switch 2 ifffffff it is

 

[Raven117]

The open world isn’t the issue.

It’s whether they write a compelling story. Modern Obsidian is like Bioware. Absolutely toothless and shadows of their former selves.

 

[Buggy Loop]

The open world isn’t the issue.

It’s whether they write a compelling story. Modern Obsidian is like Bioware. Absolutely toothless and shadows of their former selves.

With Pillars of Eternity 2 in 2018 and Pentiment in 2022?

Hard disagree

They're not a blob, they have many different teams. Its not because you are disappointed by Outer World, at least I'm guessing because that's the easy bone to pick. Well guess what. MULTIPLE TEAMS, wow.

How are they a shadow of their former selves? Have you EVEN looked at who works there?

Most peoples working there are still from the beginnings of Obsidian












But you won't watch that uh? You're not a fan. You're not following Obsidian. You got your easy dopamine hit with coming into the thread and shitpost. Satisfied?

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

And what does any of that have to do with being open world? Irrespective of Avowed, elaborate based on the other games that Buggy Loop mentioned.

I would argue story centric games benefit less from being open world than gameplay centric games.

Zelda got a massive open world bump in sales because story takes a back seat.
I don't think there's a strong pull for Yakuza to go open world because it's audience craves the cutscene.

 

[adamsapple]

I would argue story centric games benefit less from being open world than gameplay centric games.

Zelda got a massive open world bump in sales because story takes a back seat.
I don't think there's a strong pull for Yakuza to go open world because it's audience craves the cutscene.

It can have both its ups and downs. The problem is implementing a fully realized living breathing open world is no joke. Big studios like Remedy had to drastically scale back production of games like Alan Wake cause it was proving to be too challenging for them. For a game where the narrative is the central component, yes I agree that mostly those tend to be linear games with not a lot of player agency in how to tackle events.

The MGS games are perfect examples of this. MGS 1-4, linear games, very corridor like in most cases, but they focused more on the story. Phantom Pain, FANTASTIC game to play, still arguably the best open world game play experience, but the narrative suffered, whether directly because of it or not, that can be debated.

 

[wipeout364]

Outer worlds was great and it was not open world. I honestly think open world is overrated in a lot of cases. It can be amazing like in GTA or it can just be boring and lifeless in many games.

 

[Raven117]

With Pillars of Eternity 2 in 2018 and Pentiment in 2022?

Hard disagree

They're not a blob, they have many different teams. Its not because you are disappointed by Outer World, at least I'm guessing because that's the easy bone to pick. Well guess what. MULTIPLE TEAMS, wow.

How are they a shadow of their former selves? Have you EVEN looked at who works there?

Most peoples working there are still from the beginnings of Obsidian












But you won't watch that uh? You're not a fan. You're not following Obsidian. You got your easy dopamine hit with coming into the thread and shitpost. Satisfied?

Guess we are going to find out. 2018 was awhile ago.

If Josh Sawyer is allowed to go nuts. Then Avowed will be great. If it’s Don’t by Committee like outer worlds… then it may not be great.