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[Nothing1234]

I don’t agree that there is no talent at Xbox Game Studios. They just don’t have games that resonate at the moment.

 

[nial]

They just don’t have games that resonate at the moment.

When will they, though? It's a damn fucking joke of a generation for MS, even the Wii U is light years ahead of the Xbox Series in terms of first-party content in the same time frame.

 

[Spitfire098]

There you go.

It's even higher than 60-70%.

Destiny 2 & MLB in top 10, but not Halo Infinite...

 

[mckmas8808]

Can confirm that ... 30 fps even the 40 fps modes are just slow motion diarrhea... 60 fps is the way to go even with some graphical losses, but some people are less sensitive them others and will say is just fine... for me playing in 30 fps in my OLED is just impossible, i dont even test Quality modes anymore ... straight to perfomance and fuck it

Waiting for the PRO revisions.. cant come soon enough

So this maybe why so many more people on GAF are complaining about 30 fps games. Because my whole life people were okay with them (as long as they were a steady 30fps).

 

[Daneel Elijah]

But, Daneel, brother, you're proving exactly the point i'm trying to make : "they tried/are still trying", "they can be trusted", "it will work out", "no wrong expectations possible" etc etc, it's all based on hypotheses and goodwill after 2+ whole years, it's exactly what i'm saying...

Don't get me wrong friend, i'm not having a dig towards you, it's just that some customers/users (like i) are/were just fed up and jumped ship, i know it takes years to make games nowadays but, mismanagement is just that, mismanagement, i could care less if they showed a (CG) trailer too early, that's not my job to worry about it, my job is to give them money as a consumer and theirs is to provide me with a steady stream of (quality) content and so far, they weren't able to do so, i don't care if these now fabled exclusives are coming, it's the "when" that counts and i was just sick and tired of the constant no-shows, i didn't pay 500 euros to keep waiting for years, it's their job to keep me as a customer.

Cheers friend

I totally understand that. I do not have a Xbox, and never got one. So I just have a different view of the situation. I have games to play on my PS5, and games to play on my PC. And sometimes Microsoft buy/make a deal with a studio that make games that I like and I found myself becoming a Microsoft consumer. From the sidelines it do not really matter that Xbox games works or not, as they go to PC. So if there is a success I can try it and if it does not work I go back to all the others games that are waiting for me. In this situation Xbox is in a bad spot because of decisions made years, if not decades ago. If they did not disband the Fable studio we would not be discussing about the reboot being vaporware. Halo infinite happened in part because Bungie were let go etc...

I was frustrated like you are now in the PS3 and PS4 early years. But it got better. The problem is that Xbox make moves that they HAD to make. The 2020 CGI-fest show was needed because when a console is launched it needs all the hype it can get. And yes it creates problems down the line. As a consumer it is your right to say stop. And brother we have people that have said for years that if you have a PC having a Xbos is useless... Being angry for no games is normal. But each game is hundred of people working for years and it is too easy to simply ignore that. Each game that I talked about have their good points. And bad ones. As they have still time before they are ready I prefer to be optimistic. It won't change my life anyway if they fail. So I can ony be agreably surprised if one or more of those games (Everwild, Fable, the Indiana Jones one...) is good. And at least one of those will be. But I understand your point of view.

I am cautiously optimistic on Redfall as I think it will be a tad better than most expect even if it doesn’t light the world on fire.

Same. And also the Kill the justice league one. They are not what their fans want, but have potential. This is Anthem all over again for me. Those games would have been perfect for me as solo experiences with all the polish possible. When Anthem was compared to dark souls by it's creators I was 100% IN. Then is was a GAAS all online co-op experience and I was out.

I don’t agree that there is no talent at Xbox Game Studios. They just don’t have games that resonate at the moment.

A studio do what their publisher demands. There is talent in all studios. But if the management is incapable to bring it to light, or is harmful then it is worse. I love how Mark Cerny explained his tenure at Universal Studios: "nobody knew how to make games at the times. So I got a big bag of cash and no supervision". Xbox failed hard in the Xbox One era. And in a highly competitive market once you are behind it is harder and harder to go back on top. Because others will not stop to wait for you. Only Microsoft and giants like them can continue after so much efforts and so much losses. Remember that Nintendo keeps more than 10 billions dollars in banks just in case one of their consoles fail because they know that they will need it just in case. This is a hard market. And we need them to keep trying. But there is clear errors that they have made, notably in the marketing department. Too many games have been shown way too soon. And I do not like to point fingers at individuals, but the management at Xbox Games studios is to blame.

 

[mckmas8808]

For me personally it started as just about 5 of us or so were hanging out in Mike's Twitch channel chatting and essentially when he found out I was an retired MLB pitcher with 2 World Series rings we just started talking which led to us playing together which led to him inviting some of us to an E3 and hang out behind the stage with the VIPs

I know a lot of people bang on Baseball but it afforded me a lot of opportunities

Now it makes sense how you have some many awesome toys LOL!

 

[mckmas8808]

I love Gary Whitta. Glad Kinda Funny released this.

Flight Sim and AoE4 are both great games, although obviously PC-centric. AoE4 is the one game I bought when my GP sub ended. Yet I will certainly deny the quality of Grounded, Sea of Thieves, and "so on."



lol I'm dying here. But seriously once someone invests in a console and then has to buy another console it's completely ogre for the first console in their mind. Reminds me of people who had to buy a PSX when Saturn shit the bed, they were never buying a Sega console again.

The bolded was me as a kid. I got burned by the Sega Saturn and Sega Gamegear that I vowed to never touch a Dreamcast controller.

 

[Goalus]

Cheer up guys! They're taking away decades old storied franchises from the competition. Games you would have had regardless. So you're still at a net zero, but you sure owned them ponies!

Sony takes games away from the competition on a regular basis, and it's good that they get a taste of their own medicine.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Sony takes games away from the competition on a regular basis, and it's good that they get a taste of their own medicine.

Sony Too™

No, no. Not like this.

P.S. You're literally the person talked about.

but you sure owned them ponies!

 

[azertydu91]

Sony Too™

No, no. Not like this.

Will psygnosis be brought up again ?
You'll discover next week in ...

 

[ZoukGalaxy]

Which one of you made this??

OH.MY.TOAD. These Hitler reacts never fails

Best quotes from Hitler (from video, better watch it directly, it's hilarious):

• "Native 4K ? My ASS ! Have you seen the graphics of your fucking GAME ?"
• "Sony PlayStation is releasing even their story games at 60FPS"
• "And here you are finally releasing a game after 2 years with graphics worse than post war Germany"
• "Next you will say, STARFIELD will run at 15 FPS because it is a CINEMATIC GAME !!!"
• "Don't cry Anna, we still have GAMEPASS.."
• "Go... and release another RAINBOW colored controller"
• "Do you even realize you release more controllers in a year than GAMES"
• "Order a PS5 for me..."

 

[Giallo Corsa]

I totally understand that. I do not have a Xbox, and never got one. So I just have a different view of the situation. I have games to play on my PS5, and games to play on my PC. And sometimes Microsoft buy/make a deal with a studio that make games that I like and I found myself becoming a Microsoft consumer. From the sidelines it do not really matter that Xbox games works or not, as they go to PC. So if there is a success I can try it and if it does not work I go back to all the others games that are waiting for me. In this situation Xbox is in a bad spot because of decisions made years, if not decades ago. If they did not disband the Fable studio we would not be discussing about the reboot being vaporware. Halo infinite happened in part because Bungie were let go etc...

I was frustrated like you are now in the PS3 and PS4 early years. But it got better. The problem is that Xbox make moves that they HAD to make. The 2020 CGI-fest show was needed because when a console is launched it needs all the hype it can get. And yes it creates problems down the line. As a consumer it is your right to say stop. And brother we have people that have said for years that if you have a PC having a Xbos is useless... Being angry for no games is normal. But each game is hundred of people working for years and it is too easy to simply ignore that. Each game that I talked about have their good points. And bad ones. As they have still time before they are ready I prefer to be optimistic. It won't change my life anyway if they fail. So I can ony be agreably surprised if one or more of those games (Everwild, Fable, the Indiana Jones one...) is good. And at least one of those will be. But I understand your point of view.


Same. And also the Kill the justice league one. They are not what their fans want, but have potential. This is Anthem all over again for me. Those games would have been perfect for me as solo experiences with all the polish possible. When Anthem was compared to dark souls by it's creators I was 100% IN. Then is was a GAAS all online co-op experience and I was out.

A studio do what their publisher demands. There is talent in all studios. But if the management is incapable to bring it to light, or is harmful then it is worse. I love how Mark Cerny explained his tenure at Universal Studios: "nobody knew how to make games at the times. So I got a big bag of cash and no supervision". Xbox failed hard in the Xbox One era. And in a highly competitive market once you are behind it is harder and harder to go back on top. Because others will not stop to wait for you. Only Microsoft and giants like them can continue after so much efforts and so much losses. Remember that Nintendo keeps more than 10 billions dollars in banks just in case one of their consoles fail because they know that they will need it just in case. This is a hard market. And we need them to keep trying. But there is clear errors that they have made, notably in the marketing department. Too many games have been shown way too soon. And I do not like to point fingers at individuals, but the management at Xbox Games studios is to blame.

Beautiful, levelheaded post

Cheers man

 

[Katatonic]

Sony takes games away from the competition on a regular basis, and it's good that they get a taste of their own medicine.

At this point I don’t think Sony is twisting any arms to get third party exclusives. The software sales numbers for multi plats on PS say all that needs to be said.

 

[JackSparr0w]

At this point I don’t think Sony is twisting any arms to get third party exclusives. The software sales numbers for multi plats on PS say all that needs to be said.

Of course they are. No one would ever say no to more money even if it was 1% extra.

 

[SportsFan581]

it would not surprise me if a lot of people think 30fps is 60fps and what have you. Like when 16:9 TVs came out, people would stretch 4:3 content so they "used the whole TV they paid for." You really cannot point to the average troglodyte with stuff like this.

Certainly possible. If the game does phenomenal on PC but never cracks the top 50 on console, well, then you could say the 30fps really affected things. If the game performs similarly between console and PC (sales, players, etc.) then you can make the case that the 30fps didn't matter. Same if the game just bombs everywhere, obviously it had bigger problems than this 30fps limitation on console in that case.

Personally, I can't think of a single console game ever that bombed for the sole reason it was 30fps.

Don't get me wrong, I'm one of the internet loudmouths that likes to type out my opinions on here, just for the fun of it. But whether it is those GTA definitive editions or those over priced Nvidia GPUs, I don't delude myself into thinking that the general market is in lockstep with my rants there (obviously they aren't ).

 

[aries_71]

When will they, though? It's a damn fucking joke of a generation for MS, even the Wii U is light years ahead of the Xbox Series in terms of first-party content in the same time frame.

Forza 5, Halo Infinite, Age of Empire, Flight Simulator, Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush, Psychonauts 2, not to mention things like Ghostwire Tokio, Deathloop... truly a joke, MS didnt release anything, you are right.

 

[Ar¢tos]

Of course they are. No one would ever say no to more money even if it was 1% extra.

1% won't cover the porting costs. Probably not even the publishing costs.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Forza 5, Halo Infinite, Age of Empire, Flight Simulator, Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush, Psychonauts 2, not to mention things like Ghostwire Tokio, Deathloop... truly a joke, MS didnt release anything, you are right.

Psychonauts, Ghostwire, Deathloop were third party releases and not made under Microsoft Supervision. Just because the studios were bought by MS at the tail end of development doesn't mean shit. Just as if Sony bought Square Enix doesn't suddenly make FF16 a Sony game.

AoE4 is very mediocre and still needs far more updates to even reach the same quality as 3, let alone the objectively superior 2.

Forza Horizon 5 is a glorified Expansion pack.

Halo Infinite is a fucking joke.

Only thing worth a damn they released has been Pentiment and Hi-Fi Rush. Flight Sim I can't speak much of, but I can at least say it is a quality sim experience.

 

[Nydius]

I don’t agree that there is no talent at Xbox Game Studios. They just don’t have games that resonate at the moment.

100% agreed with you. Talent isn't the issue. Shoddy management is. It's been a problem with Microsoft Game Studios for almost two decades. People remember the big name successes like Halo, Gears, and Forza but forget everything that was sacrificed for to make them the big names they became.

 

[Gudji]

For me personally it started as just about 5 of us or so were hanging out in Mike's Twitch channel chatting and essentially when he found out I was an retired MLB pitcher with 2 World Series rings we just started talking which led to us playing together which led to him inviting some of us to an E3 and hang out behind the stage with the VIPs

I know a lot of people bang on Baseball but it afforded me a lot of opportunities

 

[aries_71]

Psychonauts, Ghostwire, Deathloop were third party releases and not made under Microsoft Supervision. Just because the studios were bought by MS at the tail end of development doesn't mean shit. Just as if Sony bought Square Enix doesn't suddenly make FF16 a Sony game.

AoE4 is very mediocre and still needs far more updates to even reach the same quality as 3, let alone the objectively superior 2.

Forza Horizon 5 is a glorified Expansion pack.

Halo Infinite is a fucking joke.

Only thing worth a damn they released has been Pentiment and Hi-Fi Rush. Flight Sim I can't speak much of, but I can at least say it is a quality sim experience.

That one is a joke, this other thing is a POS, and the one next to it is also bad… I see, pure rational discourse. Little else to add, haters will be haters.

 

[Fbh]

So this maybe why so many more people on GAF are complaining about 30 fps games. Because my whole life people were okay with them (as long as they were a steady 30fps).

Maybe I'm in the minority but I don't think 30fps looks that bad on OLED.
I think the biggest factor is that these last 2.5 years have been the first time in like 4 consoles generations that most games have offered a 60fps mode. Once people got used to playing (almost) every game at 60fps going back to 30 is harder.
I also think there was always also a bit of a platform warring element to it with console gamers deflecting shit talk from PC players about 60fps.

30fps can probably still get back acceptance among core gamers in places like GAF IF we get some games that truly show a big generational leap, but Redfall aint it. If you want me to accept 30fps you need to show me something with crazy physics/interactivity OR something that visually blows Forbidden West out of the Water.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

My favorite sports movie ever

 

[Goalus]

Sony Too™

No, no. Not like this.

Indeed.
Sony does it in sneakier ways.

P.S. You're literally the person talked about.

Could be.
That doesn't invalidate my point though.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Indeed.
Sony does it in sneakier ways.

Could be.
That doesn't invalidate my point though.

You have zero point. Context and nuance is a lost artform.

 

[Dr. Claus]

That one is a joke, this other thing is a POS, and the one next to it is also bad… I see, pure rational discourse. Little else to add, haters will be haters.

And whose alt are you, Xbox Warrior? I use logic and reasoning, not emotional attachment to a plastic box and a company I know will never recognize me.

 

[Goalus]

You have zero point.

Proven by hand-waving and picture memes. OK, I take the L.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Proven by hand-waving and picture memes. OK, I take the L.

The L has always been there.

 

[Goalus]

The L has always been there.

Not until the hand-waving in this thread. But it's gotten intense enough that you might have convinced me, as I said.

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

Between this and that skit Greg did trashing PC players, I might have to actually start watching Kinda Funny again.
I quit watching them when Colin left cause Greg is/was a lil bitch.

 

[nial]

Forza 5, Halo Infinite, Age of Empire, Flight Simulator, Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush, Psychonauts 2, not to mention things like Ghostwire Tokio, Deathloop... truly a joke, MS didnt release anything, you are right.

Take out the late ports, multiplats, and bad games and you only have FH5, Pentiment and Hi-Fi Rush. Add in the fact that many of their announced games in 2019-2021 are STILL MIA, yeah, you have to demand better.

 

[rapid32.5]

The main problem I have noticed with MS since the X360 gen, they can't market their games, hype during online conferences, and deliver content consistently.
You can have 100 studios but if you fail to market you get average results at best.
Now MS releases half-baked games without coop or performance mode this is unacceptable in Sony's world. You get fired and deal with it, you are not good enough to compete with top devs.

 

[[Sigma]]

Game doesn't look no where near good enough to warrant it not being 60fps day 1. That is a Arkane and yes Microsoft dev support issue.

 

[Punished Miku]

Forza 5, Halo Infinite, Age of Empire, Flight Simulator, Pentiment, Hi-Fi Rush, Psychonauts 2, not to mention things like Ghostwire Tokio, Deathloop... truly a joke, MS didnt release anything, you are right.

I forgot As Dusk Falls also. I can't keep track of all these non-existent games.

 

[Gobjuduck]

Destiny 2 & MLB in top 10, but not Halo Infinite...

MLB just came out, destiny just got an expansion. Halo’s recent update isn’t substantial.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

So this maybe why so many more people on GAF are complaining about 30 fps games. Because my whole life people were okay with them (as long as they were a steady 30fps).

Expectations change with technoloy otherwise we'd still be gaming on tiny CRTs at 480p.

 

[Bernardougf]

So this maybe why so many more people on GAF are complaining about 30 fps games. Because my whole life people were okay with them (as long as they were a steady 30fps).

In my case specifically I've always played only on consoles, so 30 fps or even shit 30fps was the "normal" and was fine ... but after the waive of 60 fps titles I just cant go back, is so much better for me to play this way every game that I really cant understand who trades some bells and shinning lights for a much more fluid image... personal tastes and all i know.. but for me is really impossible to go back

 

[Unknown Soldier]

The funny thing is I don't even think most people know what Redfall is. It looks like a Left 4 Dead clone to me but is there really a market for that in 2023? L4D was popular like 20 years ago now.

 

[mckmas8808]

Between this and that skit Greg did trashing PC players, I might have to actually start watching Kinda Funny again.
I quit watching them when Colin left cause Greg is/was a lil bitch.

I never left Kinda Funny. I just watch both Colin and Greg on their respective platforms now.

Expectations change with technoloy otherwise we'd still be gaming on tiny CRTs at 480p.

But 60fps isn't or "SHOULDN'T" be some minimum bar that all games need to be released at. We don't do that with resolution either. If the game looks good enough, 30fps should be fine.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

If hellblade wont have 60fps mode wont be big suprise and not a big deal as its singlepalyer (and stunning looking) game but multiplayer shooter that looks like should run 120fps on xss ?

 

[Varteras]

Will psygnosis be brought up again ?
You'll discover next week in ...

Bro, Lemmings was the Call of Duty of the 90's. How do you not know this?

 

[Dick Jones]

Bro, Lemmings was the Call of Duty of the 90's. How do you not know this?

I knew the level "No Russian" was familiar.

 

[TrebleShot]

Sony has never “taken a game away from another platform” they are the industry leaders by a huge margin and it’s growing.

Publishers are desperate to get their games on Sony consoles as that’s where the market and their sales are.

There are probably devs and publishers choosing to be exclusive rather than being forced to…aren’t square doing this and Balders Gate 3?

 

[j.k.2021]

People forget that Xbox devs. have to optimize their games for Series x, Series s and PC at the same time unlike the competition so they need to stop with these apple to oranges comparisons.

 

[SportsFan581]

Sony has never “taken a game away from another platform” they are the industry leaders by a huge margin and it’s growing.

Their market position has nothing to with it. They have purchased timed and full exclusivity on third-party games, the very definition of "taking games away from other platforms" LOL. MS has done the same, even Nintendo and Sega did it at times, there are no saints in regards to this behavior.

 

[GHG]

Bro, Lemmings was the Call of Duty of the 90's. How do you not know this?

It was to me.

Lemmings was amazing.

 

[MikeM]

Their market position has nothing to with it. They have purchased timed and full exclusivity on third-party games, the very definition of "taking games away from other platforms" LOL. MS has done the same, even Nintendo and Sega did it at times, there are no saints in regards to this behavior.

Or you can look at it as:

“Sony/MS/Nintendo is helping fund the development costs of said game, with the caveat of exclusivity. Publishers then take that info and run numbers on expected sales to estimate profit to determine the deal’s viability. Then they decide whether to go forward or not.”

Lets be real, corps gonna corp on both sides.

 

[ChiefDada]

So this maybe why so many more people on GAF are complaining about 30 fps games. Because my whole life people were okay with them (as long as they were a steady 30fps).

It's not hyperbole. I've never been a 60fps/high framerate die hard until I purchased an oled the same day I got the ps5. And honestly, I still don't believe I am. It's just 30fps literally looks like a slideshow I can't stress enough. I never was a fan of FPS games but even if i was its not even an option with oled. I get sick within 2min. as was the case with RE Village which ran at 45 fps. 3rd person 40fps is pretty good though, no sickness or headaches at all. I'm very thankful that it has become so popular.

 

[Gobjuduck]

Sony has never “taken a game away from another platform” they are the industry leaders by a huge margin and it’s growing.

Publishers are desperate to get their games on Sony consoles as that’s where the market and their sales are.

There are probably devs and publishers choosing to be exclusive rather than being forced to…aren’t square doing this and Balders Gate 3?

What? You didn’t say a single thing correct here.

Baldur’s gate 3 is by larian, not square. They said that the game wasn’t launching on Xbox because they are having issues with co-op on xbox (likely series s). It will come out later for xbox.

PlayStation has paid a lot of money to keep games off xbox (mostly), pc and switch. It’s not just an assumption.

Sure some smaller titles skip xbox, but those games are pretty niche or mostly have an eastern audience. Xbox is an American consumer console, it’s support reflects that.

 

[Hoppa]

The funny thing is I don't even think most people know what Redfall is. It looks like a Left 4 Dead clone to me but is there really a market for that in 2023? L4D was popular like 20 years ago now.

Back4Blood released in 2021 and it kinda came and went