Support NeoGAF

[Liljagare]

I am just saddened today, as Sweden is moving closer to joining NATO. One of the longest neutrality agreements going down the drain, because of the greens and socialists. We went from being able to put 800K troops on the ground, to 20K thanks mostly to the greens.

"War wont happen in Europe anymore", someone said. "Sweden need to show it supports the repressed", another politician said. Then we dismantled everything, and are enjoying one of the worst times in the last 120 years.

Swedens neutrality, despite being the target of many jokes, never was a joke. Until the late 80's, early 90's. Now, we are a nation that minorities flee from.

Nuclear power is bad, was shouted all over Europe, so we all turned to Russian gas.



End of a long era, but, hoka-hey? We done goofed.

 

[akimbo009]

Did you quote the right person?

I feel attacked for all the wrong reasons

 

[Gp1]

"Flaming debris" with a big propulsion, 1ton explosive warhead and guidance to sink ships...

 

[Tams]

I am just saddened today, as Sweden is moving closer to joining NATO. One of the longest neutrality agreements going down the drain, because of the greens and socialists. We went from being able to put 800K troops on the ground, to 20K thanks mostly to the greens.

"War wont happen in Europe anymore", someone said. "Sweden need to show it supports the repressed", another politician said. Then we dismantled everything, and are enjoying one of the worst times in the last 120 years.

Swedens neutrality, despite being the target of many jokes, never was a joke. Until the late 80's, early 90's. Now, we are a nation that minorities flee from.

Nuclear power is bad, was shouted all over Europe, so we all turned to Russian gas.



End of a long era, but, hoka-hey? We done goofed.

Come off it.

Your neutrality was cowardly. Finland had good reason, but you did not. Norway, who actually border Russia, knew what they were doing.

I can only agree that you very stupidly let your armed forces shrink so much. At least your defence industry is still up there with the best.

 

[Tams]

Russians claim they did not hit the mall, instead claim to have struck an industrial warehouse "containing foreign weapons and munitions" located very close to the mall.

The mall apparently caught fire due to burning shrapnel / debris flying in the direction of the mall, which is about a 1000 feet from the warehouses.

(Not my map)

Insanity.

There's literal video of the strike and there was no secondary explosion that hitting an arms depot would have caused. Best case, they aimed for an arms depot and missed, but are now lying about their fuck-up.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

I'd hope that the ukrainians try and keep the storage of weapons out of busy city centers/away from popular places. They just missed is what I think happened with their shitty rockets. But this is ofcourse impossible because Russian weapons are the best according to them and it's the west's fault.

 

[nemiroff]

Russians claim they did not hit the mall, instead claim to have struck an industrial warehouse "containing foreign weapons and munitions" located very close to the mall.

The mall apparently caught fire due to burning shrapnel / debris flying in the direction of the mall, which is about a 1000 feet from the warehouses.

(Not my map)

Yeah we all know that theory is as usual ruzzian compulsive lies.

 

[kuncol02]

I'd hope that the ukrainians try and keep the storage of weapons out of busy city centers/away from popular places. They just missed is what I think happened with their shitty rockets. But this is ofcourse impossible because Russian weapons are the best according to them and it's the west's fault.

Two rockets missed bigger target and hit same building 0.5km away? They deliberately aimed into that shopping centre.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

Two rockets missed bigger target and hit same building 0.5km away? They deliberately aimed into that shopping centre.

Of course always possible with Russians.

 

[RJMacready73]

Russia deliberately targets shopping mall, Orc looks at google maps, picks out nearest warehouse says Nato weapons storage facility.. repeat..

Anyone quoting or even remotely believing anything coming out of Russia is either a fucking idiot or a fucking idiot

 

[winjer]

I am just saddened today, as Sweden is moving closer to joining NATO. One of the longest neutrality agreements going down the drain, because of the greens and socialists. We went from being able to put 800K troops on the ground, to 20K thanks mostly to the greens.

"War wont happen in Europe anymore", someone said. "Sweden need to show it supports the repressed", another politician said. Then we dismantled everything, and are enjoying one of the worst times in the last 120 years.

Swedens neutrality, despite being the target of many jokes, never was a joke. Until the late 80's, early 90's. Now, we are a nation that minorities flee from.

Nuclear power is bad, was shouted all over Europe, so we all turned to Russian gas.



End of a long era, but, hoka-hey? We done goofed.

The only reason Sweden was able to maintain a pretense of neutrality, was because Finland was able to hold against the Russians.
Had Finland fallen during the Winter War, Sweden was likely to be next for Russian invasion.
That's why Sweden allowed it's own soldiers to take vacation time, or just leave the army, to go and fight along side the Finns, against the Russians.
Many Swedes and it's government understood very well that it was Finland that was protecting Sweden's freedom and neutrality. You should remember that too.

Joining NATO is the best chance countries bordering Russia, have to protect themselves and their people.
That's why several countries are joining now, because they don't want to became the next Ukraine.

 

[TwinB242]

Not defending Russia but the missiles are old & outdated enough that theoretically they could have been aiming for the factory but the missiles went off course at the end and hit the shopping center instead. Doesn't help that they were originally designed to be used against ships and not land targets.

Either way the fact that they're using old missiles against what they would consider to be a high value target (depot of western equipment) lends credence to the rumors that they're running low on modern precision weapons (which is a good sign).

edit: This confirms the inaccuracy of the missile

"The Russian side has started using Kh-22 type rockets. These are old Soviet rockets, such airborne ones. They have one problem - a circular probable deviation of 200-300 meters, that is, they are very, very inaccurate.

https://ukranews.com/en/news/855814...22-missiles-for-strikes-on-ukraine-arestovych

 

[PuffyCan]

Not defending Russia but the missiles are old & outdated enough that theoretically they could have been aiming for the factory but the missiles went off course at the end and hit the shopping center instead. Doesn't help that they were originally designed to be used against ships and not land targets.

Either way the fact that they're using old missiles against what they would consider to be a high value target (depot of western equipment) lends credence to the rumors that they're running low on modern precision weapons (which is a good sign).

edit: This confirms the inaccuracy of the missile



https://ukranews.com/en/news/855814...22-missiles-for-strikes-on-ukraine-arestovych

Or maybe we could stop listening to russia's propaganda and realise they used this old missile to target civilians since it doesn't require accuracy.

 

[MrA]

Or maybe we could stop listening to russia's propaganda and realise they used this old missile to target civilians since it doesn't require accuracy.

Ultimately hitting the shopping center intentionally or as a consequence of intentionally using trash equipment knowing they put civilians within the drift doesn't change anything, they put civilians in harms way intentionally

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

They’re scumbags but hey terrorizing the civilians is their MO.

Let’s hope the Kherson campaign yields results, losing that city would send a powerful message.

 

[Chittagong]

I think I saw UK intelligence saying today that they believe target was that building a bit away from the mall. Naturally Russia would have done that knowing that the inaccuracy means it very well could slam into a mall.

 

[FunkMiller]

Large increase in NATO activity and spending announced at G7. Finland and Sweden joining. Russia now regarded as greatest threat.

How’s that special military operation working out for you, you goat fucking moron?

 

[darth.shrimp]

Even knowing that missile's lack of accuracy, two of them "unintentionally" hitting the exact same target, that "unfortunately" happened to be full of civilians (because Russians gonna Russian), is very hard to believe.
(of course, Russia is claiming the shopping center was actually closed when the missiles struck it and there were no casualty... while also claiming they didn't hit it in the first place anyway)

 

[Gp1]

 

[TrumpacShakur]

Even knowing that missile's lack of accuracy, two of them "unintentionally" hitting the exact same target, that "unfortunately" happened to be full of civilians (because Russians gonna Russian), is very hard to believe.
(of course, Russia is claiming the shopping center was actually closed when the missiles struck it and there were no casualty... while also claiming they didn't hit it in the first place anyway)

There is a lot of debate whether the 1st or the 2nd missile was a direct on the mall or was it right next to it. The factory compound is massive.

Some say there is an impact crater visible at the start of the railway line, which is at the bottom right of the factory compound. ( haven't found the satellite image showing the supposed impact crater yet tho. )

Spoiler: Large Image

 

[winjer]

Large increase in NATO activity and spending announced at G7. Finland and Sweden joining. Russia now regarded as greatest threat.

How’s that special military operation working out for you, you goat fucking moron?

 

[LimanimaPT]

If the mall was the target or not is totally irrelevant. Nothing of this would have happened if the Orcs hadn't start the war in the first place.

 

[TwinB242]

This thread is kind of downer if accurate. Basically, Ukraine is already withdrawing from Lysychansk and the surrounding areas to avoid encirclement. The city should have been the perfect defensible position but I think UAF was preparing for an assault from the Sviverdonetsk area and Russia instead poured most of its combat power into an offensive from the south. The capture of the city will be a huge victory for Russia unfortunately, as it will essentially give them full control of the Luhansk region

 

[ratburger]

Russia’s Surprising Economic Headache: A Strong Ruble

The Russian ruble has soared to a roughly seven-year high against the U.S. dollar, and that threatens Russia’s budget by reducing the value of oil-and-gas tax revenues.

www.wsj.com

The Russian ruble has soared to a roughly seven-year high against the U.S. dollar—an astounding turnaround for a currency that earlier this year was in free fall after Russia invaded Ukraine. The ruble on Wednesday had risen 41% against the dollar this year, making it the best performer against the greenback, according to a Dow Jones Market Data analysis of 56 currencies.
...
The ruble “really is too strong for Russia right now,” said Liam Peach, an emerging markets economist at Capital Economics, who said that with the ruble nearly twice as strong as it was three months ago, Russia is now receiving roughly half as much in oil-and-gas tax revenue in ruble terms. “The damage that this is likely to continue doing to the public finances has probably made policy makers quite concerned.”
...
Throughout February and March, Moscow took drastic measures. Russia’s central bank limited the amount of dollars that Russians could withdraw from foreign-currency bank accounts. Moscow initially required companies to change 80% of their foreign-currency revenues into rubles. And the country doubled its key interest rate to 20%, essentially rewarding people for holding rubles.

The capital controls worked and pushed the ruble higher. Meanwhile, Russia’s commodity exports, which were boosted by high prices, gave the currency further upward momentum. At its worst during the war, the ruble in early March reached a record intraday low of about 158 rubles to the dollar, according to data from Tullett Prebon. On Wednesday, it traded around 53 rubles to the dollar.

 

[Tams]

Russia’s Surprising Economic Headache: A Strong Ruble

The Russian ruble has soared to a roughly seven-year high against the U.S. dollar, and that threatens Russia’s budget by reducing the value of oil-and-gas tax revenues.

www.wsj.com

Eh, drastic measures are not sustainable.

Lots of financial people are surprised because most of them are just doing fancy gambling.

 

[TwinB242]

UK giving another $1 billion in military aid. Will hopefully include some more HIMARS

Ukraine War: UK pledges an extra £1bn in military support

Boris Johnson, speaking at a Nato summit in Madrid, said freedom is "always worth paying for".

www.bbc.com

 

[Tams]

UK giving another $1 billion in military aid. Will hopefully include some more HIMARS

Ukraine War: UK pledges an extra £1bn in military support

Boris Johnson, speaking at a Nato summit in Madrid, said freedom is "always worth paying for".

www.bbc.com

I doubt it, as they aren't mentioned in the article and we have very few (correction) M270s to even send. We don't really need many ourselves being an island a distance away, but that's also why we have so few.

Aid is aid though. The air defence systems, whatever they may be, will help a lot. Gotta keep those MLRSes and M777s safe.

 

[Sakura]

UK giving another $1 billion in military aid. Will hopefully include some more HIMARS

UK doesn't have HIMARS, they use the M270, of which they don't have a lot of.

 

[zombrex]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

 

[FatallyYours]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

Or, Russia should leave a sovereign country that it illegally invaded

 

[akimbo009]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

Zbot.

 

[Ironbunny]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

ruZZia leaves Ukraine and war is over. I wonder if these are the messages we would also get if ruZZia invaded Sweden or Finland. Finns have a great understanding what Ukraine is fighting for and what its worth. Calling it a proxy war just shows the lack of understanding the word independence. West is not medling...its supporting.

 

[RJMacready73]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

Failure? How's it been a failure, Ukraine is still a sovereign nation and not some hollowed out puppet state to facist cunt of a country, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel? Suck it up and stick a fucking jumper on, Ukrainians struggle with life at the moment and we need to keep helping them and punishing Russian zombies. You don't negotiate with terrorists who murder and rape kids end off story and this war will drag on for as long as it takes and hopefully at the end Russia ceases to be and Ukraine joins the EU and NATO, now fuck off and collect your roubles

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

I dont get these posts. You do realise they tried negotating before the invasion and even during it right? What was their strong position? If Botox Vlad didn't get his way he would've always invaded.

 

[zombrex]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

 

[Romulus]

Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying.

Name 3 experts that are saying that.

 

[FatallyYours]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

Suffering for e eryone means higher pasta costs and a little more for gas in your car for us. We have it easy. And it's a cost we should all suck up and take. We could be getting raped, bombed and genocided.

Fuck yeah it's to weaken Russia. Fuck them. Well done Ukraine on doing such a bang up job with such little overall power. Let's spend billions getting them what they need so that we can live in a safe, united, democratic West. Sounds good to me

Ukraine can't win? Says who? Russia? Congrats, you've fallen for Russian propaganda and will be blocked after this for spouting utter bollocks. Ukraine have as much chance of winning as Russia given the chance, so let's give them that chance yeah?

Ukraine has the god damned right to continue fighting, with or without our help. Its not up to you, or France or Germany to determine when Ukraine gives up, that's on the brave souls fighting for their homeland, which is being destroyed inch by inch.

You and macron don't like that your life has a few new inconveniences in it. Suck it up buttercup. Don't buy that extra game. Don't get that takeaway each Friday. Don't have a holiday thus summer. Better than being killed when shopping randomly by Russian missiles.

You're an idiot

 

[Tams]

UK doesn't have HIMARS, they use the M270, of which they don't have a lot of.

My bad, but there's not much different between them, especially as Ukraine are using them.

 

[Tams]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

 

[FatallyYours]

Name 3 experts that are saying that.

Putin
Putin with a fake moustache
Putin with a wig on

Dudes a clown. Ignore him

 

[nemiroff]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

The Z avatar fits you well. The irony of a z-bot calling my family and friends in Ukraine pawns.. Their hopes and dreams of just living life in peace worth nothing, only good to be sacrificed via rape, torture and murder. Fuck you, and sincerely so.

 

[rofif]

"Flaming debris" with a big propulsion, 1ton explosive warhead and guidance to sink ships...

Shit blows up good... sadly they can probably keep this coming for years, new or old gear

 

[gradient]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

Okay, let me break down what your issue comes down to...

This stupid proxy war needs to end. The west needs to stop pumping in billions as it has been a huge failure with no geopolitical goals achieved. The Russian ruble is stronger than ever. Meanwhile, citizens in the west struggle to afford fuel for transport and heating.
Would have been better for everyone had Ukraine negotiated peace when they were in a strong position, instead the west continued to push for more war. This conflict will now drag on for years, and Ukraine will suffer, they have been made a sacrificed pawn a larger game.

Your issue is that the destruction and genocide of another nation inconveniences you. You're upset because other people won't lie down and die and forfeit their lives, wellbeing and nation for your own shortsighted and selfish desires.

What country are you from? C'mon, cards on the table here, lets see what position of security you're making these bold statements from. Would you be so willing to surrender everything you have and ask that the rest of the world turn a blind eye to it's invasion and the genocide, rape, slaughter, torture and destruction of everything and everyone you hold dear? I don't think you would. In fact I'll wager you are in a country that you regard as safe from aggression either through the protections provided by an alliance with other strong nations or one which you feel will benefit or at least not face any threat from Russia if you just capitualte and turn a blind eye to the suffering and destruction of others.

Russia has openly stated they intend to take back the entire of Ukraine and other former Soviet countries. They have demonstrated that they are completely untrustworthy and will not stop (Crimea). So when you say "Would have been better for everyone" who exactly do you mean? The Ukrainians? Slaughter, loss of rights, history, freedom, mass torture, rape and murder in the inevitable political and social cleanse that would follow? How about their neighbors that are also in Russia's sights (we've already seen that Moldova is in line for invasion according to plans that have been shown)? Would the same fate be best for them? how about the western european countries that would be next? the ones with a gun held to their head after Russia had seen how effective the threat of war was and how easily it got them what they wanted?

...or by "better for everyone" do you really just mean better and more comfortable for you?

 

[Bernd Lauert]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

While I agree with you in principle, I also think there's no real alternative. Putin clearly isn't interested in negotiations, he wants a complete capitulation of Ukraine, which is unacceptable. So yes, the war will keep going on for years, cost a lot of lives and a lot of money, and there's not much we can do about it.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

- So what you're saying is that if a country invades a weaker country, they should just surrender and we as 'the west', should turn a blind eye?
- How do you know what politicians are saying in private? Sources please.
- Sure giving them weapons is not just about helping them, but also about causing harm to a disgusting country.
- Of course Russia can 'win' if they want to. Just like the US could easily 'win' in Vietnam by just bombing everything and everyone without looking.
- You casually ignored my serious reply when saying that they already tried negotiating. Before AND during this war. Some people even showed signs of poisoning during the negotiations. So yeah, seems like a good idea.
- When was, as you put it, 'Ukraine in a position of power'? When they kicked out their Russian proxy government?
- You do realize that the Russians have now changed the reason for invading about 10 times? NATO expansion, Nazis, Anti-Russian genocide, returned land to the motherland,.... how the fuck do you negotiate with someone like that?
- I know you've seen all the horrors the Russians have caused, including a guy posting pictures of himself RAPING A BABY? You think Ukrainians are willing to surrender to people like that? We should just all forgive them? You think it's 'the west's' fault for at least giving them a chance to not be murdered, oppressed, raped?

Your posts just read like 'Please let them take Ukraine, because I'm paying 30 bucks more for my gas'. I hate it too, but I'm not over there having my children blown up/raped, so I'll take the punch to my wallet if that means those people have at least a fighting chance and get some hope they wont end up in a russian proxy shithole like Belarus.

 

[rofif]

Guys can you least read the post and respond to the points being made, not just the outrage reactions. The west is giving billions to Ukraine but it's not helping significantly, just prolonging the war and suffering for everyone. The west is not giving Ukraine billions because of pure philanthropy, everything has a reason and that is to try to weaken Russia for geopolitical reasons.
Ukraine is a pawn and can't win in the long term, it's not a controversial idea, that's what most the experts are saying. This war is poised to go on for years at this rate but it will be Russia who benefits from such a situation. Ukraine's manpower has been greatly reduced and in private politicians are already conceding Russia will keep much of the territory it has gained.
People need to see the true situation. This is beyond supporting Ukraine, those wishing this to continue are willing to Ukraine's demise whether they realise it or not.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate being called a Russian supporter, zbot and other baseless responses that are personal attacks and not based on the point. I expect that on that other website not here.

Critical thinking = zbot or fanboy on this forum. DONT USE YOUR BRAIN or express your own opinion

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Your posts just read like 'I have to pay more for gas, please let them take over!!!'.

Yes? What’s the alternative? Mind you, this is on the West as well, including Merkel’s disastrous decisions to close nuclear power plants following tsunami in Japan. Now they are talking about reopening coal plants…

Here the deal - Ukraine is one country, and the whole EU is suffering. Inflation in the Eurozone is close to 8%, in Poland it’s 12-13%. I can guarantee when winter comes and industries will have to start shutting down due to no power available this thing will be over very soon, and not in a good way for Ukraine.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

Yes? What’s the alternative? Mind you, this is on the West as well, including Merkel’s disastrous decisions to close nuclear power plants following tsunami in Japan. Now they are talking about reopening coal plants…

Here the deal - Ukraine is one country, and the whole EU is suffering. Inflation in the Eurozone is close to 8%, in Poland it’s 12-13%. I can guarantee when winter comes and industries will have to start shutting down due to no power available this thing will be over very soon, and not in a good way for Ukraine.

NOT close nuclear plants would be a start. And yes, take the punch, I know times might and probably become bad. But it's easy to talk from a position of wealth and safety. You'd say the same if you were living in Ukraine? No you won't even though you'll claim otherwise.

 

[rofif]

Name 3 experts that are saying that.

Really? We are doing this now? Are you going to ask his mom to shut him up?
His opinion is not controversial AT ALL.
It is obvious Russian will drag this for years and years. They have unlimited amounts of resources.
I am polish and WE KNOW THIS. This is obvious stuff if you know how Russians operate.
Ukraine might be getting gear and support for years but there will be nothing left fighting for at some point...
USA will send one packed Humvee and russia will send 10 ladas in this place. It's always been like that.
Maybe they will run out of resources sooner than later... but I wouldn't count on it. They do not act logical

 

[Cyberpunkd]

NOT close nuclear plants would be a start. And yes, take the punch, I know times might and probably become bad. But it's easy to talk from a position of wealth and safety. You'd say the same if you were living in Ukraine? No you won't even though you'll claim otherwise.

No, I wouldn’t. But it’s the same argument as the West spending money in Africa because ‘they live in bad conditions and need help’.

Of course I am speaking in a position of wealth and safety, and I want to keep it that way - since when this is a problem?