Neo Blaster
Member
Can an insider step in and throw us a little bone, so we can stop all this dog fight and focus on something else?
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Aceofspades
Banned
Are we back to Github? 
Say something Sony so this back and forth would stop
Just reveal the damn thing if its 8TF or 14TF , do us all a favor here
Say something Sony so this back and forth would stop
Just reveal the damn thing if its 8TF or 14TF , do us all a favor here
wvnative
Member
Gamernyc78
Banned
What are thy going to say? They've been saying lately psv is double digits yet warriors don't want to believe. You won't stop ppl with agendas.
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Fake
Member
How long until 'PS5 don't have RT' ?
hemo memo
You can't die before your death
Are we back to Github?
Say something Sony so this back and forth would stop
Just reveal the damn thing if its 8TF or 14TF , do us all a favor here
Saying “back” suggest that we actually left.
icy121
Member
I forget who, but I believe someone on this thread said Cerny was lying about RT cause Jim didn't mention it in his CES speech.
Like, what?
Did it ever? Mark Cerny lied!
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
The cult of FUD DEALERS worshipping at the alter of MisterMediaX.
Gamernyc78
Banned
No now it's "we have RT audio" omg thts a new feature psv doesn't have and is innovative
Imtjnotu
Member
See you in 4 years buddy
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Why are you taking a few individuals to represent an entire community's actions? It wasn't "xbox fans" that harassed Reiner and Klee. Those were individuals who happen to associate in some parts of the larger Xbox community.
You should never use the extremes of a few fanatical people in a community of millions, to represent that community as a whole. Xbox, PlayStation, and Nintendo all have idiots like that, but they don't represent the community as a whole. And if the idiots in question are kids or adults, well honestly, there's only so much I can say in dissuading that behavior before the parents need to do something, or the person needs to act their age. No one can force them to act more appropriately.
That's not the reason. The reason is because when you look at a set of persistent set of data that has been following an established pattern for a long time now, and is part of a larger set of data that has now been officiated through actual products unveiled matching that data, it's something you kind of have to take your bias goggles off for and actually acknowledge as being at least somewhat factual.
Like that saying goes, facts don't care about your feelings. The fact is that the benchmarks are real, they have been very consistent, and many even aside from the next-gen systems have turned out to exactly match officially unveiled products. That's a pretty good streak of luck IMO, and at that point it's probably more than just being lucky.
Right now you're exhibiting an emotional reaction and using emotion to suppose a reasoning that is definitely possible, but with what's actually been found and backed with any data, doesn't seem probable. Possibility and probability are two different things. And then you mix it in with some people who continue to insist that anyone who buys into a given source, even passively, such as the leaks from Github, as also insisting a given system (PS5) is 9.2TF, which honestly is nothing but conflation. You can take to the source in question without hoping for or even thinking it is fully indicative of what the final product will be.
I have my own best-case scenario probability for PS5 but it's informed from a mix of the leaks, the benchmarks, insiders, tech analysis from reputable sources, and articles/reports from the likes of Wired/Bloomberg/ITMedia etc. That best-case scenario is 10.4 - 11.04. But even THAT is moreso emotionally driven, because it means I have to put faith in some other PS5-related benchmark coming forth with a set of specifications that can provide that range, sensibly. Based on everything available though, I feel it's a more optimistic range than 9.2 or even sub that (as some feel it could be), and a more realistic range than 12/13/14+ that some others have been running wild with. This is just based on actual data, market realities, trends/patterns in data and shared points of agreement by multiple sources, and circumstantial rumors/events/information.
So to wrap it up; yes if it's something MS can do it's 100% possible Sony could do it, too. But that's why you don't look at possibility exclusively, you look at probability ,especially after you exhaust the possibility. And just going with what is known altogether, outside of some insider claims (which, again, don't have full context in themselves. Some have more context than others though), it's not very probable that Sony has a PS5 that is exactly the same as XSX in TF count or even higher.
But like I was also saying earlier, TFs are not the only metric for measuring next-gen whatsoever, and there's much more to a system than just that. And you can still have systems that are close or virtually equal in performance even if there is a gulf in something like teraflops. PS1 and N64 were relatively similar in performance for their gen despite N64 having a much faster CPU and being 64-bit. PS2 games (especially 1st party) were visually competitive with Gamecube and Xbox titles because overall the architecture matched up well with Nintendo and MS's stuff even if the latter handily outdid it in some areas such as resolution output or raw polygonal performance. I could go on and on. Yes it meant that there were certain areas where one system had a noticeable advantage over the other but things almost always would balance out in the end when taking in ALL system components, developer pool, budgets, SDK efficiency etc.
And that's not even factoring how, whatever areas of advantages PS5 and XSX will have over each other, is softened by the reality of diminishing returns.
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Neo Blaster
Member
I suspect the Xbox Defense Force will use the GitHub leaks even if Cerny step front in an event saying it's 11-12 TF, and will continue to do so till the end of next gen, no matter who makes what technical analysis.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Sorry, I meant I used them when downloading games or big updates. Other than that I just shut it down. I doubt it'll do any harm either way, just look at smartphones. But I prefer to shutdown PC/console when finished, and I can't say the other way is wrong or harmful.
shenmue mugen
Member
You think both a 9 and 13 TF PS5 are out of question, so what would a reasonable value be? 10 - 11?
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VanSiriusGabriel
Member
-It's not a big team.
-It's not a first party, contrary to Hellblade 2, we don't know how much support they have from Sony.
-We don't even know if it was taken from PS4 and just cooked with PS5 to have some "exclusive" the same time as MS. Outriders is also on SeX, does it look like 12 tf? MS lied 8 tf confirmed.
Comparing Hellblade 2 and Godfall is like comparing two different tracks with Bolt and me. After I lose "daaamn I was running on some ass terrain I tell ya".
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Kazekage1981
Member
People are stuck at 9.2 TFLOPS , I am still stuck and in shock that the GitHub leak has the same number of compute units as PS4Pro. Do you guys really find that believable ?
which begs the question: is it better to have less compute units with higher frequency or more compute units with less frequency ?
which begs the question: is it better to have less compute units with higher frequency or more compute units with less frequency ?
geordiemp
Member
I dont believe 36 CU as it will be 8TF, Sony would only do that if they were launching early (2019) or they are going low cost and learnt nothing at all from releasing the Pro and what the high spending / high budget Ps4 owners want.....
If they ditched 2019 release and kept the same 36CU offering for the following year....when all the new and more Powerful AMD stuff was well roadmapped, and worse Sony know MS was waiting for that in 2020 and any imbecile could see MS would target double XSX (they even said so), then Sony are either stupid or we are vastly underestimating costs and prices and SEX will be somthing like $ 700 + dollars.
All will become clear one day. Those who think a small die 36 CU will be expensive and a 52 CU will be justa bit more are equally over optimistic in my view.
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James Sawyer Ford
Member
Remember what Klee said
Nothing has changed, PS5 leads
10-15% difference
That’s around 13TF
Nothing has changed, PS5 leads
10-15% difference
That’s around 13TF
Kazekage1981
Member
how many compute units to make it 13 ?
THE:MILKMAN
Member
52 active @2.00GHz for 13.3TF.
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Which he said weeks ago, before he requested a ban. There's much newer information from OsirisBlack who says X is in the lead.
Rusco Da Vino
Member
Are u crazy, man.
This shit is not going to stop. Just a few days away from waking up from that "wet dream" of seeing a 9.2tf PS5.
They are going to sqeeze it, hard!
Fake
Member
Not comparing, I saying we can just assume the console perfomance IF both exclusive and running on proper console hardware, not PC.
He can't assume 9TF on PS5 if Godfall is a multiplataform because both seX and PS5 will have... Unless the build is saying 'running on PS5'.
Even Shenua was not running on seX and thats the point. We can't assume console power using a build running on a PC...
The Godfall video was an old PC build btw.
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Kazekage1981
Member
Hmmm... what if PlayStation 5 used RDNA 1 or 1.5 to make it 13 TFLOPS? Would it be better or equal to XsX 12 TFLOPS RDNA 2 ?
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Less CU is cheaper if you cool it right. Die size is largest cost factor, less CU = smaller chip = cheaper APU + added cost for cooling.
Gamernyc78
Banned
Kazekage1981
Member
Does this seem realistic to you ?! Jumping from 36 CU from github leak to insiders saying it’s 13 TFLOPS. It’s a huge variance
I don’t consider us as insiders I think if anyone in here was a real insider we would have known a lot more by now Me personally I’m lucky to know someone that works on the PR side of things for Sony and even she don’t know much sometimes she hears rumors I think Sony is keeping shit tight last thing I heard from her was the Xbox series X reveal trailer at the gaming awards how she got that info I don’t know just know one thing Sony and Microsoft got insiders on each other I’m betting on both consoles are really close on performance and features one thing I was told Sony really gonna try to make us focus on the DualShock 5 features more than the console that’s something they gonna be pushing hard as to set them selfs apart from the rest..
Kazekage1981
Member
OH not this again
shit, didn’t mean to make this thread go in circles. I have amnesia. Dammit soooooonnny
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VanSiriusGabriel
Member
No, you can't, because Godfall is AA, Hellblade 2 will likely be very big as a production. They will just spend more time detailing every single asset and stuff. We should take something as the next Killzone or wathever. For what we saw Godfall can't just use the hardware as much unless PS5 is really bad.
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JAMMA
Last warning for console wars
Thy run on sentences are hard to read, but are you making fun of audio Ray Tracing? Cerny was the first to talk about it so it’s most likely going to be in both consoles.No now it's "we have RT audio" omg thts a new feature psv doesn't have and is innovative
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Gamernyc78
Banned
I know bro just messing with you. But in all seriousness this topic was mentioned few pages ago..
THE:MILKMAN
Member
It is just the figures you asked for. I'm waiting for Sony to confirm what PS5 is. The fact that multiple insiders are saying/indicating that both are within a Gnats bollock of each other and that XSX is confirmed 12TF tells me that 9.2TF is less likely as it stands, but only Sony can end this debate.
Do you find it believable that rumored PS5 has the same amount of cores as PS4?
Do you believe that PS5 only has 2x the memory that PS4 had?
36CU is believable, because that GPU is bigger on considerably smaller and more espensive process then PS4 and Pro GPUs were (212mm² / 230mm²). Thats before we even add VRS/RT hardware on die.
M.Night Shyamalan
Member
When are target specs released to devs? If he looked at targets... Sony and MS will 100% hit their targets, the difference is usually what can be improved upon, like how far clocks can be raised. Are those what are called white paper documents?
Fake
Member
You don't understand. I saying that for the sake of that argument, not for downplaying Shenua.
My point stands. We can't use games running on PC as a measure for console TF. Neither PS5, neither seX.
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LED Guy?
Banned
He didn't exactly say 10 - 15% difference between them, he specified that the difference between PS5 & XSX is like the difference between Xbox One fat (1.3 TF) and Xbox One S (1.4 TF), so that's like 7% difference between XB1 & XB1S.
Applying the difference to PS5 VS XSX, we get 12 TFs (XSX) VS 12.9 TFs (PS5).
Remember, he said that these are dev kits and final numbers might not end up EXACTLY like that for PS5, maybe a bit higher or a bit lower than 12.9 TFs, now we got XSX confirmed to be 12 TFs which is like what he said, now let's wait for PS5.
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
I understood that you don't want to compare the two, but I also say that even as a single case I don't expect Godfall to tell us anything, even as an hypothetical exclusive. Battlefield 6 will probably do much better on the very same PS5, but the console is the same. Just not the right game for a benchmark.
Lampiao
Member
I think what will define the ps5 to be 9tf or 13tf will be the sales performance of ps4 pro vs ps4 slim. If that ratio is today at least 50/50, sony may want to seek power, otherwise, if it is still around 20% or 30%, forget it, sony will embrace 70% or 80% and make a console for the crowds.
I remember what Klee said. He said Lockhart is dead and PS Meeting will be in February.
And no, Coronavirus didnt cancel that meeting, I am 100% sure. No one bar Osiris and Klee has said anything about February, and if it way cancelled rest assured Jason or someone else would make a story out of it.
Klee knowing if Lockhart exist or not, when and why PS5 was delayed, when PS meeting will be and what are the specs from both systems triggered alarm in my head because he said he is no longer in gaming industry (for 20yrs) and that he is in Alaska working nightshifts. So where does he get all that info, which apparently no one else has? From guy who showed to him vertical slice of next gen game on USB? Doubt it. And how the fuck did his developer friend have USB with secret next gen game on it? It all sounds very, very hard to believe.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I'd love to know if the rumoured latest PS5 dev kit has had any spec changes and what they are.
ethomaz
Banned
Yeap... how games run over 200W is magic lol
Again there is no limit... late games drawns over 200W and it can reach max 380W without any issue.
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hardseppo
Member
Here's my hot take on the current Teraflop situation. If I was stronger than 12 TF, I'd instantly would shout it from the rooftops, if I catch wind that my opponent is 12 TF (to not let him gain momentum).
If I had less than 12 TF, I would keep silent until I figure out how to make my features sound better I'd imagine. "Yeah honey, but size isn't everything!"
I am still convinced, no matter how many TF both consoles have, we are in for a treat on both systems exclusive-wise. And both I must have on day one as usual (I just can't help myself... that incredible "new-console" feeling).
I always want them all... lol
If I had less than 12 TF, I would keep silent until I figure out how to make my features sound better I'd imagine. "Yeah honey, but size isn't everything!"
I am still convinced, no matter how many TF both consoles have, we are in for a treat on both systems exclusive-wise. And both I must have on day one as usual (I just can't help myself... that incredible "new-console" feeling).
I always want them all... lol
CrustyBritches
Gold Member
That would likely be the original Gonzalo 1.8GHz/8.29TF SoC. Then Oberon got the push so either 9.2TF or 10.2TF depending on whether they go with 36/40CU.
*Note* Whether PS5 has another GPU, or Oberon is only showing the BC portion of the chip, Gonzalo and Oberon were/are PS5 at some point just by virtue of the clocks and nomenclature. I wasn't here for the whole Github thing, but Apisak had already dropped the Gonzalo benchmark info back in June 2019. DF says in October 2019 they are "99% certain Gonzalo is the silicon going into PS5".
My only point in saying this is that Github leak happens in December 2019. It isn't necessary for any the speculation concerning PS5 and XSX, which were leaked in January 2019. I suppose since I was on hiatus during that time, it's curious that it's constantly brought up.
LED Guy?
Banned
Nope, all insiders and journalists were wrong about Lockhart being cancelled, Tom Warren, Digital Foundry, Windows Central, Jez Corden, Jason Schreier, all of them were wrong and that's due to Microsoft's rapid planning changes in real-time, they paused it, resumed it, paused it etc etc..... Stop lying and spreading misinformation.
About the PS5 February reveal, he did say that it may not be in February 2020, but then again, EVEN if he made a mistake, it doesn't render every other thing he said as wrong, because until now, everything he said is turning out to be correct, both consoles are more powerful than AMD's 2019 graphics cards and more feature-packed than RX 5700 XT, well that's now confirmed for XSX, we'll just wait for PS5.
Like I said again, you're lying and making up things.
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M-V2
Member
Some people here say" Tommy Fisher, Osirisblack, Jason schreier, Kleegamefan, Matt & many others" are lying don't believe them BUT believe me. Why do I believe you?? Because I push the narrative of PS5 being 9.2tf, why do I need believe your narrative?? Because I'm netrual (despite preaching about 9.2tf 24/7)
Those people who play the card of "I'm going to buy the PS5 despite it's low in power" I mean if you wanna buy the PS5 why are you preaching 24/7 & praying for PS5 to be 9.2tf? Since you wanna buy it you should wish it to be as powerful as the Series X or very close to it. This card is already got burnt stop fooling yourself. Bruh.
In the end people won't stop this BS until Sony comes out & destroy their foreheads & I can't wait for that time to come.
Those people who play the card of "I'm going to buy the PS5 despite it's low in power" I mean if you wanna buy the PS5 why are you preaching 24/7 & praying for PS5 to be 9.2tf? Since you wanna buy it you should wish it to be as powerful as the Series X or very close to it. This card is already got burnt stop fooling yourself. Bruh.
In the end people won't stop this BS until Sony comes out & destroy their foreheads & I can't wait for that time to come.
jackets with pockets
Banned
So was 8GB of RAM for this generation.
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