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[David Ricardo]

how expensive is HBM2?

I read a couple months ago that it was around 120$ for 16GB. But also read that it needs some additional hardware to work that costs around 30$. So slightly cheaper than GDDR6 which is around 10$/GB.

There was also discussion about whether it was possible to avoid using the additional harware thanks to some process which name I don't remember well (TS_info or something).

Thing is, HBM is not as expensive anymore. We can't automatically discard a rumor just cause it has HBM in it.

 

[nosseman]

Could it be 2.0Ghz 13,3 Tflops but with turbo - IE not all the time?

MS said many times to DF that their numbers was "all the time" and "locked". Perhaps they know something?

 

[M-V2]

Xbox series X devkit

 

[SSfox]

Xbox series X devkit

Why do the Devkit looks like an actual console while the console looks like a Devkit?

 

[Mendou]

No idea how a common pc can match this purpose built gaming monster.

Games designed to take full advantage of that NVME SSD will likely not make it to PC anytime soon considering most are using HDDs and ~500mb/s SATA SSDs.

 

[NathanDiego]

I accept an account ban switch with Tommy Fisher,ban me for the time he has left and bring the guy back,take that as a rescue.I read more than make comments already.I want to see what he has to say now, if he comes back.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

That sounds very expensive, and i'm not even sure you would need all that. A full 16gb for games would be very nice though, especially with XSX having 13.5gb for games.

If that plays out and the 8GB HBM2 is on either a single stack or two stacks, that could give PS5 a combined bandwidth of either:

1x 8GB HBM2 module, 1024-bit bus, 256 GB/s + 16GB DDR4 (2 channel interfaces) 128-bit bus, 69.312 GB/s.

1148-bit effective system memory bus, 325.312GB/s total system bandwidth

OR

2x 4GB HBM2 modules, 2048-bit bus, 512 GB/s + 16GB DDR4 (2 channel interfaces) 128-bit bus, 69.312GB/s.

2176-bit effective system memory bus, 581.312GB/s total system bandwidth

And the 2nd would fit the part of his rumor with PS5 having more memory and more bandwidth, though it's kind of accomplished though fudging i.e combining different memory pools (same thing MS tried combining DDR3 and ESRAM bandwidths with XBO).

David Ricardo The "extra hardware" is the interposer. Generally it adds a good chunk of complexity to the design but it's required for HBM in general. The $30 quote there might be for older interposers; newer ones have brought the costs down IIRC and I think the price depends on how many stacks there are in general. Can't see it being $30 per stack of HBM for example.

If that $120/16 GB HBM2 quote is actually true then I have to wonder why anyone would go with GDDR6 over it though. So either it's still costlier than 16GB GDDR6 equivalent or MS just...maybe stupidly didn't pick HBM2 despite it potentially being cheaper and having other performance gains because....??????

It's one or the other, definitely not both.

 

[Dodkrake]

Xbox series X devkit

I like how the cables don't seem to be plugged in to the "final" form. Makes total sense, it's a showcase, but interesting nonetheless.

 

[David Ricardo]

No he never said what kind he said bigger with. MOre bandwidth

Just did a search in his post history and you are right. He didn't say PS5 had HBM. I edited my previous message. Sorry.

 

[DrDamn]

It's not optimized. AFAIR they spent less than two weeks on this.

Yeah, but my question is why show it as a comparison, it gives a bad impression and downplays what the machine can actually do.

 

[Sosokrates]

I'm kinda wondering when Sony is going to do some kind of bombastic reveal, not even price just like the overall form factor, and maybe some games reveal? Cause at this point Sony is dead silent, and Corona virus kinda killed the whole: We are going to go to hundreds of community events to promote the PlayStation brand.

Fanboys will act like its a big deal, but a 9% better gpu on ps5 will be a bit lackluster after all this time.

Im mean come on sony you waited all this time just to show a 9% better GPU.... Would be a bit of an anti climax.

 

[Dodkrake]

There's also a black dev kit on the left.

 

[Fake]

Xbox series X devkit

Very similar to One X. Maybe because was the same team behind Xbox One X with was a smart choise.

 

[Zero707]

 

[Sosokrates]

Xbox series X devkit

Arent those 1X devkits?

 

[Dodkrake]

Fanboys will act like its a big deal, but a 9% better gpu on ps5 will be a bit lackluster after all this time.

Im mean come on sony you waited all this time just to show a 9% better GPU.... Would be a bit of an anti climax.

You are not considering the marketing angle.

Let's assume, for a moment, that Sony does have the edge. This is our assumption, we don't know this, only devs / insiders / whatever.

With this in mind, Sony waiting and having the stronger product bodes well for them, because once they release info, MS will have nothing to show for. They are basically firing all their bullets without (I presume) any actual intel on final form PS5. This can play really well if they have the strongest machine, or really bad if they don't.

It doesn't really matter if you have 9% or 2% more, the XBox angle has been "12TF" and they seemed to have moved a bit from it. Now imagine that Sony releases something that says "The benchmark has been reset: 13TF" or something like that.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Dev kit looks like an X, yet the final version looks like a big kleenex box?

Looks like they could have made SeX look like another X, but purposely made it like a small tower for uniqueness and image of power?

 

[David Ricardo]

That sounds very expensive, and i'm not even sure you would need all that. A full 16gb for games would be very nice though, especially with XSX having 13.5gb for games.

Tommy Fisher didn't say that. I was wrong. Sorry.

Although I don't think 20GB for games is too much. It's 4 times what PS4 has. Smallest jump in RAM size for Sony ever.

 

[On Demand]

Mod of War unban Tommy Fisher please. He was right to a t about SX specs and i want to know what other info he has about PS5.

Thanks.

 

[Dodkrake]

Dev kit looks like an X, yet the final version looks like a big kleenex box?

Looks like they could have made SeX look like another X, but purposely made it like a small tower for uniqueness and image of power?

"Towers over the rest" I like that angle. Didn't think about it, but its subtle.

 

[Fatal Enigma]

Arent those 1X devkits?

No need to reinvent the wheel for a devkit

 

[DemonCleaner]

Die size is 360 mm2

thats kinda insane

 

[TheAmazingSpiderMan]

Why do the Devkit looks like an actual console while the console looks like a Devkit?

I reckon we're too used to that form factor, but yeah the Devkit could easily pass for the retail version, looks good too.

 

[RasAlGhoul]

Mod of War unban Tommy Fisher please. He was right to a t about SX specs and i want to know what other info he has about PS5.

Thanks.

He already did.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Fanboys will act like its a big deal, but a 9% better gpu on ps5 will be a bit lackluster after all this time.

Im mean come on sony you waited all this time just to show a 9% better GPU.... Would be a bit of an anti climax.

Nah once sony show some games there are golden even if the a little weaker .
All this stuff is nice but once people see for eg HZD2 gameplay or GOW gameplay they will be hype.
The specs will only be a big talking point for a few even if they a little weaker or stronger .

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Mod of War unban Tommy Fisher please. He was right to a t about SX specs and i want to know what other info he has about PS5.

Thanks.

He already did.

 

[megreotsugua]

I can't stop laughing with that gif.
9 seconds!? wtf!

I wonder how Sony devs are feeling with this news.

 

[Insane Metal]

	CPU	GPU	SSD	RT	RAM
XSX	3.5 Ghz	11-12TF	1TB 2.3GB/s	Similar to 1080Ti	16GB GDDR6 (+ 4GB DDR4?)
PS5	3.2 Ghz	12-13TF	1TB 5GB/s	Similar to RTX series	18GB GDDR6 + 4GB DDR4

Here's my two cents. About the 18GB I have no idea how that will work but I have a good reason to believe it. Maybe there's some 2GB reserved separately for the RT? No idea.

XSX: 16GB GDDR6
PS5: 18GB GDDR6 + 4GB DDR4
SSD: 2.3GB/S x 5GB/s

These are genuinely my guesses. Also according to our own Osiris, PS5 devkit is insanely loud and PS5's RT solution is indeed better than XSX's.

I'm keeping my thoughts on 44-52 to PS5 and 52-56 CUs for XSX.

Oh it can't be 60 per RDNA? I don't think there's a limit like that. GCN had a very low limit but that's not the case with RDNA I believe?

Looks like I was close enough.

 

[Self High Five]

That sounds very expensive, and i'm not even sure you would need all that. A full 16gb for games would be very nice though, especially with XSX having 13.5gb for games.

Going with HBM is the only logical reason why Sony could clock their GPU higher than MS. HBM draws less heat than GDDR6.

In terms of performance I don't believe that setup would even be better than a full 16GB. It's just more long term planning as HBM will become cheaper overtime + the benefit of reduced heat to clock their GPU higher.

 

[Nivek OnlyOn]

So shader Ray Tracing?
PS5 asaumed to have dedicated RT cores.
Whats going on?

 

[johnjohn]

Sony employees, have been giving fake info to insiders. It's conceivable that he was played by his sony source, who previously gave him the good news. It's also possible that his friend told him to stop and he knew he couldn't keep his mouth shut so got banned to save himself.

It doesn't really matter though, he was spot on pretty much



Whats pretty clear is although Tommy gave you some really good news that was 100% correct, better than other so called xbox insiders, but because this information also comes with the caveat that the PS5 is stronger, you don't like the man or what he's said.

The man was spot on for god sake, not close, not in the ball park, not +-0.5 tflops which all would be acceptable margins.

BUT SPOT ON? NAILED ON EXACT NUMBERS?

Seriously, clownshoes, he's legit as they come, best get hoping Sony down clock rather than trying to prove Tommy wrong. Seems more likely to me.

The original quote was, which they have selectively used was "The most powerful console WE'VE ever made"

This is true, and fits with the our most powerful console.

Stop falling for marketing BS until they actually say those words, it's not happening.

Tommy has already been proven wrong though lmfao.

 

[xHunter]

Xbox series X devkit

why did they go for a tower design for retail when, according to insiders, the dev kit would run very silent and very cool in the One X like case?

for example o'dium said the following:

The SX for comparison, is pushing 12 and over (figure not yet known), but from everybody I’ve spoken to, including public leaks, chats and what have you, the damn thing is near silent, AND cool. Which means possible headroom to adjust if required.

why would they need the tower when the dev kit was already silent enough and had spare room?

 

[Burrito Bandito]

PS5 could still be higher. 20gb would be nice with 4gb for the os.

higher tflops, more memory, and faster ssd?

i just dont buy it, simply because Sony is not releasing a $599 console and we have reports of them targeting $400. something will have to give.

 

[DeepEnigma]

so anything he said has to be true? meaning you also believe in the photoshopped DualShock 5?

sorry but he was wrong about that deal. there is no way in hell you can say this deal might still be real without being so unbelievably biased (which you obviously are) that it makes you think irrationally (fanboys are inherently irrational so that makes sense)

he nailed the TF number and CU count of the Series X, and that's really impressively precise.
and that's all we know.

stop inferring other shit from this singular fact.

what I would want now is for him to explain himself, because the controller and all these deals MS and Sony apparently made are 100% fake.

did he say those things to keep people off his tracks maybe? when he spreads bullshit like that maybe he thought this would help keep his sources safe? make it seem to people in the know like he was just having lucky guesses?

we don't know but that's why I, like many here, want him to return.

He not only nailed the TF number and CU, he nailed the GPU speed to the T as well.

Maybe he was trying to throw people off the scent with other things. This would not be the first time this has happened.

Hopefully he comes back and explains it.

 

[ethomaz]

Xbox series X devkit

It is actually better design.

 

[thelastword]

Told u so lol

Yeah, some people ripped Tommy a new one here, especially the 9.2TF crowd...….We need to crown that boyyyyy….

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

You are not considering the marketing angle.

Let's assume, for a moment, that Sony does have the edge. This is our assumption, we don't know this, only devs / insiders / whatever.

With this in mind, Sony waiting and having the stronger product bodes well for them, because once they release info, MS will have nothing to show for. They are basically firing all their bullets without (I presume) any actual intel on final form PS5. This can play really well if they have the strongest machine, or really bad if they don't.

It doesn't really matter if you have 9% or 2% more, the XBox angle has been "12TF" and they seemed to have moved a bit from it. Now imagine that Sony releases something that says "The benchmark has been reset: 13TF" or something like that.

How have they moved from the 12TF angle if that in fact was just them stating 12TF and the actual specs are even slightly above that (12.14)? They weren't stating 12TF and also stating "most powerful" alongside with it. Really if anyone was taking that interpretation, it was us.

We also know that console specs alone don't mean anything if the games aren't there, so I'm assuming MS are getting specs out of the way mainly to put a spotlight on the games once the time comes for those a little later this year. Whether or not they've been speaking specs this soon as some hint they have the more powerful system could never be absolutely gauged anyhow, nor is it really ultimately important whether that turns out to be part of the case or not, because it wouldn't have been the main motivation or factor, either.

 

[Moridianae]

Well, it stands to reason and it isn't a difficult leap to ascertain.

If the Sony ninjas and their console being shrouded in secrecy all the way til now, it is possible he faked something to disappear if they were closing in.

 

[Fake]

higher tflops, more memory, and faster ssd?

i just dont buy it, simply because Sony is not releasing a $599 console and we have reports of them targeting $400. something will have to give.

Honestly question: In what you believe?

 

[Lacix]

It is actually better design.

Probably it is a vacuum cleaner.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Honestly question: In what you believe?

nInE pOiNt tOo

 

[SportsFan581]

So shader Ray Tracing?
PS5 asaumed to have dedicated RT cores.
Whats going on?

I'm taking it that the core RT calculations are happening in parallel with the standard shader work (what DF appears to be saying). It's possible that moving this to the CUs has given AMD an advantage in the amount of RT performance they are getting, we'll need to see a head-to-head on PC to compare.

 

[LiquidRex]

You are not considering the marketing angle.

Let's assume, for a moment, that Sony does have the edge. This is our assumption, we don't know this, only devs / insiders / whatever.

With this in mind, Sony waiting and having the stronger product bodes well for them, because once they release info, MS will have nothing to show for. They are basically firing all their bullets without (I presume) any actual intel on final form PS5. This can play really well if they have the strongest machine, or really bad if they don't.

It doesn't really matter if you have 9% or 2% more, the XBox angle has been "12TF" and they seemed to have moved a bit from it. Now imagine that Sony releases something that says "The benchmark has been reset: 13TF" or something like that.

Microsoft have locked their specs down, and are ready to manufacturer... Sony will have too, but if Sony remain silent then I would think the PS5 is less in power over the XSX and Sony.

The die leaks to the XSX have been correct... The leaks of the PS5 die have been smaller, smaller die less CU's

That's why I think the PS5 will be 9.2tfs 36CUs, high clock hence elaborate cooling solution.

The CPU in the XSX is locked at 3.8 which was expected... Will be interesting what the CPU on the PS5 will be clocked at

I would love both consoles to be close in power.. But I just don't see it, until Sony confirm one way or the other

 

[Sosokrates]

You are not considering the marketing angle.

Let's assume, for a moment, that Sony does have the edge. This is our assumption, we don't know this, only devs / insiders / whatever.

With this in mind, Sony waiting and having the stronger product bodes well for them, because once they release info, MS will have nothing to show for. They are basically firing all their bullets without (I presume) any actual intel on final form PS5. This can play really well if they have the strongest machine, or really bad if they don't.

It doesn't really matter if you have 9% or 2% more, the XBox angle has been "12TF" and they seemed to have moved a bit from it. Now imagine that Sony releases something that says "The benchmark has been reset: 13TF" or something like that.

It certainly would be better from a marketing perspective then if they came weaker,
But boasting to much about a 9% advantage could backfire if the games dont show better performance on PS5.
Imagine the shit the 1x would of gotten if it was only 4.6tflops.

 

[Bligtgate]

Can we have some PS5 specs now!!! Can’t wait for the full picture of next gen

 

[Sosokrates]

Microsoft have locked their specs down, and are ready to manufacturer... Sony will have too, but if Sony remain silent then I would think the PS5 is less in power over the XSX and Sony.

The die leaks to the XSX have been correct... The leaks of the PS5 die have been smaller, smaller die less CU's

That's why I think the PS5 will be 9.2tfs 36CUs, high clock hence elaborate cooling solution.

The CPU in the XSX is locked at 3.8 which was expected... Will be interesting what the CPU on the PS5 will be clocked at

I would love both consoles to be close in power.. But I just don't see it, until Sony confirm one way or the other

Tommy fisher being right about the exact xsx specs pretty much confirms ps5 is 52cus @ 2000mhz

 

[Trumpstyle]

Fisher did seem to nail them to the T, over anyone I take it?

Should his ban be lifted?

Nope he said Xsx would be 7nm EUV, he failed and 1,8ghz with 52CU's is was a common prediction for 12TF.

"Anaconda 12TF (52CU, 1,8ghz) " Trumpstyle on 9 Dec, 5 days before tommy fiser!

Rumor:PS5 & Anaconda Scarlet GPU on par with RTX 2080, Xbox exclusives focus on Cross gen, Developer complain about Lockhart.UPDATE: Windows Central said Xbox Anaconda target 12 teraflop

Pff looks like it's over, Anaconda > PS5PS5 is 40CU clocked at 2ghz as oberon leak suggested (10,2TF).Lockhart 4TF (18CU, 1,8ghz)Anaconda 12TF...

gamrconnect.vgchartz.com

 

[Hhhhttt]

Tbh I would love for tommy to be right about ps5 specs but there’s also a chance he’s trolling ps fans/ or had different sources for ps5 info

 

[On Demand]

He already did.

He already did.

Oh i didn't realize. Cool.

 

[saintjules]

Ruh roh