-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
All The Last of Us 2 leaks/spoilers in here and nowhere else.
- Thread starter DonJorginho
- Start date
- News Spoilers
Paracelsus
Member
ZehDon
Member
"You are not ready". "You have been warned".
We're getting close to "John Romero is about to make you his bitch"-levels of self-delusion here...
S
Steve.1981
Unconfirmed Member
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
ZehDon
Member
What does the date of the article have to do with "trying harder"?
What's your statute of limitations on people saying things in interviews and articles on a game that isn't out yet?
What should I try harder at?
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I don't see ND calling fans names, and I doubt the people calling out ND are real fans either. Scratch the surface and its just layers of stupid people hearing what they want to hear and seeing what they want to see all the way down.
And all for what exactly? When you get people unironically claiming that TLOU2 is going to damage gaming for years to come, its obvious that we're way off the map in terms of projection and catastrophization. Its truly mind-boggling.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Because it shows a transparent ploy on your part to conflate old news with current controversy in order to try and prove a point.
Whereas the actuality, as demonstrated by the reaction from some quarters to the leaks, is that it VALIDATES Troy Baker's comment. Some people clearly weren't ready and have lost their shit over it.
ZehDon
Member
“Transparent plot”? Do you often assume everyone is lying and deceitful all the time? I quoted - and linked - the article I was referring to. If I was trying to be dishonest, why would I have done that?
Troy Baker clearly wasn’t referring to most people thinking the plot was utterly terrible and garbage, as has been the majority of t he backlash. Unless you’re insinuating he thinks this as well? I believe he, like ND and their “You have been warned” comments, are obviously tying to present this game as something incredibly affecting that gamers aren’t psychologically prepared to “endure”. I think it’s hollow torture porn based on everything we’ve seen. Hence my post.
I quoted those comments to demonstrate a pattern of representation.
Jon Neu
Banned
So it demonstrates that ND and Troy Baker knew the game was going to cause a huge controversy among fans given the nature of it’s plot.
Sometimes, you damage control so hard you go full circle.
ZehDon
Member
Check the layout of a qwerty keyboard, friend. Typing on mobile results in easy typos - such as hitting “t” instead of “y”. If you removed your head from your ass you might realise this. In any case, you’re a walking grammar nazi joke from early 2000s. Best of luck in the real world.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
"Why does the character need to look like you for you to relate?" - People telling anyone who doesn't want to play as boring white guy they should be okay with it.
lachesis
Member
I admit that I was reaching out as Naughty Dog as a company did not officially called anyone names - just few employees, including Druckmann's Kurt Cobain tweet - whatever his intention was.... and I've seen plenty of fans - only themselves know how much of fan they are, but I say a lot of them are like me who really enjoyed the first game and other ND games - attack them being SJW agenda driven in recent years.
Being a fan doesn't mean you have to suck up to everything they do, in my case I was pretty disappointed on the case of Last Jedi as a being a long time Star Wars Fan.
As a creator, though - you don't always have to sacrifice your creative choices for the audience - if you stick to the safe route to please, it will eventually backfire. However as a creator, you have to be at least a step ahead and fully anticipate the audience's limits when pushing it too. From what I've seen on the leaks though... it's a bit too much for me that I wrote in detail in my couple of posts. I can't really speak for the others reason. Some for the pushing the progressive agenda, or some for not delivering what they expected etc - in my case I was expecting something more in between, new enough yet familiar enough. Yes, much easier to be said than done - and you can't satisfy everyone. It's impossible. That's why being a creator is such a hard job. But I've seen the success going into their heads, making them arrogant and holier-than-thou attitude too.
I will not be the judge of that until the final product is delivered, and how Naughty Dog reacts to the criticism officially. At this point their hands are tied, as they are still trying to hide the whole MGS Raiden thing as much as possible. Maybe because it's the key point to the game, or not worth enough mentioning - and we'll see what it would be after the release.... and I'm afraid it's not going to be pretty, imho.
And I do agree that we are way off the map in terms of projection and making things even worse by going at each other politically over a mere video game too. It's certainly a strange time to live, as we are so disconnected at the same time, so connected over just a few clicks on the keyboard, and sensationalism is easier route for money and attention... and we are all part of it one way or another.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
ND doesn't call them names. They tell people to fuck off.
As for people calling out ND not being fans either, lol. So anyone who calls out ND aren't fans?
So for any gamer who doesn't like LoU2 due to Joel being killed, too much lesbian soap opera scenes, being forced to play Joel's killer in the game aren't real fans huh? LOL
We get it. You think LoU2 is a perfect game that can't be criticized.
Last edited:
joe_zazen
Member
iirc Kubrick regretted that movie and pulled it from UK theatres after some irl people began using it as inspiration.
The main ones who are mad about this are the ones who already hated ND games for being so called movie games. I am sorry but it is true. Many of them were not going to buy it anyway. There are a small section of gamers who think that a game having a story and cinematics somehow takes away from the gameplay and Sony have been increasingly the target of that anger. Combine that with anger over so called wokeness and you have the backlash to TLOU2.
Anya7890
Neo Member
So why are Nate & Elena allowed to have ”soap opera“ scenes, but it’s made a thing when Ellie & Dina have the exact same shit? It’s the exact same fucking thing, except it’s a straight couple vs. a gay one.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Oh forgot..... Hey Ellie, I'm pregnant. Think of the family.
You'd think a game with zombies and thugs every few blocks would be more important for story and gameplay than Young and the Restless scenes.
You also purposely deleted the part where I said some gamers don't like Joel getting killed, or needing to play as his killer. What do you say to gamers who don't like that part of the new game?
Last edited:
Anya7890
Neo Member
Firstly, I didn’t purposely delete it and I do get people being upset about Joel dying and playing as his killer, those are legit gripes after all. But your whole argument about the relationship stuff falls flat because that’s basically a pillar of the series & that it’s not the only series that does it: the walking dead does the exact same thing. It’s a genre thing actually, the real focus is characters & relationships, while zombies & other humans serve as window dressing.
So, would it be the exact same fucking thing if say the "soap opera" scenes involved a brother and a sister?
I am just curious.
Anya7890
Neo Member
I guess it depends on what you mean by soap opera? Like if your just talking emotional scenes or banter, then yeah it could be the same.
The Mad Draklor
Member
They're bloody pixels. This "you should feel bad" preaching is way over the top.
VlaudTheImpaler
tl;dr
yeeeeeezy
Here you go.No, it isn't realistic to be that muscular... Especially in that situation... at all. Just gonna quote myself when I answered someone else...
"First off, lets just put aside the fact that I think that most UFC female fighters juice in some way or another...
Do you know how hard it is for females to gain muscle mass? Let alone men? Women actually have to work far harder than men to get the same exact mass as a man... If they even can. Men have far more muscle density, pound for pound. Larger bones and tendons and ligaments < where real, lasting strength comes from since bulky muscle fatigues much faster than tendons. To achieve this without juicing they would need to be on a very strict rigorous workout regime. There would be lots of downtime during recovery. Finally, you would need a very specific, HIGH quality diet to reach and maintain that mass. Those women in that pic, if they aren't juicing are most definitely taking the highest quality sups and vitamins on the market. Let alone an abundance of specific healthy foods and a strict meal plan.
In todays world of abundance where these things are easily available, this could be doable. But in a post apocalyptic world where the world and environment make the plans, not you? Where you need to be on your game and can't spare recovery days due to zombies and other crazy people and any other emergencies that would come up in that kind of situation? Where because of all of that you wouldn't be able to train those specific muscle groups as rigorously as you would need to because you need to be ready? IMO, I absolutely don't think so.
Go find me a real world example of tribes, or people who live in an environment where it is survival of the fittest, where the women are big and muscular. It costs a lot of fuel to maintain that mass. Truth is, that females function MUCH more efficiently in survival situations with less muscle mass and at much less of a fuel intake than they do with more mass. This is why all these tribal women who actually do stuff men do, look slender or less bulky. Because their bodies naturally perform MUCH more efficiently this way and it is dangerous for them to try to unnaturally perform outside of that range.
If you want some real world examples in real time, go watch Alone. There are several female participants from the second season on. Watch how they just melt away and their muscles become much leaner and FAR less bulky even though they are in a survival of the fittest situation and literally have to struggle every day to stay alive. You can easily compare to the men here, who lose mass as well, but on average not nearly as much. And due to having more muscle mass in general, and being able to pack it on faster when they DO have food due to the way testosterone works where it increases mass by increasing protein muscle synthesis, you'll see how they can last longer than females who are wasting away along with them. They can just produce far more muscle for their body to devour. Which I believe is why people aren't fussed about Joel so much since it is far more believable for him to look bigger. In fact, speaking on his forearms which I've seen brought up, hand strength in men is a particular area where men excel greatly.
Hand-grip strength of young men, women and highly trained female athletes - European Journal of Applied Physiology
Hand-grip strength has been identified as one limiting factor for manual lifting and carrying loads. To obtain epidemiologically relevant hand-grip strength data for pre-employment screening, we determined maximal isometric hand-grip strength in 1,654 healthy men and 533 healthy women aged 20–25...link.springer.com
Your forearms are a huge contributor to your grip strength. So for Joel it makes sense. Especially when you think about it in context with everything I've said. Men grow muscle faster due to testosterone. The one thing that men do workout ALL the time, even if they aren't training, is their hands. They are constantly moving them and gripping things. More activation in that area is going to mean more mass. More muscle mass, especially continual repetitive movements which would also strengthen tendons as well are going to cause more vasculature, which also grow easier in men. Thing is, our bones keep growing all our life. But areas with more vasculature are going to grow even more. So men who do more with their hands, even when not on a training regime, are just going to continue to have larger forearms and hands throughout their life because that area is going to keep growing faster than others. If you look around you at some of the older service men or manual labor workers who otherwise look unfit, you'll see this. Which is why Abby's forearms alone look so frigging ridiculous. Not even to mention everything else... To achieve that would be crazy hard for a real woman today, living in a world of abundance. Let alone maintaining it in that environment."
And I'd like to say something about the gym as well...
Man, I can't think of... working out... at the gym... in an apocalyptic situation... as being anything but selfish. Unless you are in physical therapy... maybe.
I've slept on this one for a while but it still bothers me. There would be absolutely NO shortage of work in that world. No shortage of crucial projects and people needing things done. This is how you would be "working out." On top of the fact that danger can strike at any moment and you need to be ready to face it. It's not like you have entire army's worth of people to replace you if you can't. When you work out you go through a recovery phase where your muscles are trashed. During this phase you aren't going to be very effective at all for physical labor. This is why many people with very physical jobs, in this relatively carefree present day full of abundance, don't ever go to the gym because they stay busy and can't afford the downtime for recovery since their job provides enough of a workout for them anyway. But In TLOU kind of world?... I just can't imagine actually having the time. Unless you are being selfish and letting other important things go to waist.
I don't know man, that's just something that's just really unbelievable to me. I have to believe that the world would go back to being like the Amish sort of, but actually more intense and with more to do. And I've never seen one of them just sitting around not doing something. Like, Ever. And they certainly don't go to the gym and work out. But good Lord the dudes are some of the physically strongest people I've ever known because they get their workout from their environment. Much like the pioneers, which the Amish take after.
Last edited:
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I don't have an issue with telling avowed racists. misogynists and homophobes to fuck off. Its not "punch a nazi" silly-bollocks posturing, it concisely communicates a feeling.
To be honest. telling people with the intellect of tree stumps to just fuck off i a helluva time saver.
I mean I waste so much time on here diligently rebutting the bilge spouted by idiots like yourself, knowing full well that you lack the wit to know when you are being schooled, or the character to admit that you were wrong in the first place...
And no, I don't believe TLOU2 or ND are above criticism, its just that so much of the criticism I see leveled is so ignorant, inane and pathetically easy to dismiss, I can't help but feel compelled to respond out of duty to show there are still sane people posting on the topic.
joe_zazen
Member
.
admit it, you like feeling like the smartest, most righteous guy in the room. And arguing on a games forums lets you do that.
I don't have an issue with telling avowed racists. misogynists and homophobes to fuck off. Its not "punch a nazi" silly-bollocks posturing, it concisely communicates a feeling.
To be honest. telling people with the intellect of tree stumps to just fuck off i a helluva time saver.
I mean I waste so much time on here diligently rebutting the bilge spouted by idiots like yourself, knowing full well that you lack the wit to know when you are being schooled, or the character to admit that you were wrong in the first place...
And no, I don't believe TLOU2 or ND are above criticism, its just that so much of the criticism I see leveled is so ignorant, inane and pathetically easy to dismiss, I can't help but feel compelled to respond out of duty to show there are still sane people posting on the topic.
admit it, you like feeling like the smartest, most righteous guy in the room. And arguing on a games forums lets you do that.
or is that me
Last edited:
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
We can share the "glory" LOL
Honestly, I try not to be mean to people for no reason and Ideally I'd prefer to be more enthusiastic and positive.
Some of this stuff just gets on my tits though, videogames have been a huge part of my life for the last 40 years and I genuinely, deeply care about the medium. Seeing great work getting shredded for no good reason... I give zero respect to those with no respect for the talent and effort involved in its creation.
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Niked
Member
Thank you, lets desect this, shall we. See my comments after your answer.Addressing a few of his points...
1) "Corporations don't care as much as the creator" It's the same writer director as the first one. - Its the first time Bruce Stanley is not in the picture. Also Amy Hennings influence is gone.
2) The christian homophobic cult thing isn't even confirmed. It was part of a fake leak a month ago that people threw in with everything else. - the "fake leak" is 99% confirmed by the real leak that is what I understood confirmed this.
3) It's not confirmed whether Ellie dies. - i guess you did not see the picture..
4) Joel and Ellie are not heroes just because we like them, the game asking us to question that is not bad writing. - they might not be heroes in the context of the actions they do but they are the main characters that we all love and are one of the main reasons we play and love the game.
5) Abby is not Trans. - the real leaks seems to say otherwise and Niel is trying hard to push the full rainbow eventhough Its not fitting in a Clickers-filled world with shortages of supplies and doctors.
6) Plenty of people like both the gameplay and the story. - Yes, but the story is the main reason as gameplay is not anything that stands out. Its the story, level design, animation, voice acting, sound and caracter design that does it.
7) No, they aren't asking you for more of the first game, they ask for whatever the trailers show. Which is a revenge story with TLOU gameplay. - no, this is not what a sequal implies. This is a far reach for you to take. A bit silly. This is not a stand alone game Its a sequal. Please stop disregarding what a sequal is.
8) Cycle of violence was already a part of the first game in someways, kicking off a story based on what Joel is actually one of the most honest ways to approach it. - cycle of voilence Yes, but that does not mean you kill of the characters and play the murderer If you care about the fans. If the story main character was on voilence you could argue that characters only surved as the vessel.
9) How the player feels towards Abby or Ellie while playing as them is not something leaks or even out of context footage can answer. - true to some degree but it must be a revolutionary story telling to feel anything for abby. Come on... She fucking calls Joel! Joel must be revealed to be Hitler to meet the need to feel anything for Abby
Explosive Zombie
Banned
Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
Jayjayhd34
Gold Member
Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
Yeah weird. If you click the tweet and go directly to Twitter it will work.
Elcid
Banned
Accurate. Honestly, after how perfect part 1 was, I'm good. I didn't even play the DLC for part 1 since the base story was that good, I deemed it unnecessary. To me the Last of Us will always be Joel's story.
D.Final
Banned
D.Final
Banned
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Not really, considering the number of subscribers to the channels supposedly DMCA'd over hosting leaked stuff its a kinda weak brigading effort.
Tamy
Banned
Is this true or not:
www.neogaf.com
4Chan Rumor: The Last of Us Part 2 is rumored to be a story of revenge...
https://www.vg247.com/2020/04/12/last-us-part-2-rumor-christian-cult/ The archived plot leak claims The Last of Us 2 will center around a budding romance between protagonist Ellie and love-interest Dina – a plot point that has already been confirmed by the game’s developers. However, this...
Jayjayhd34
Gold Member
Is this true or not:
4Chan Rumor: The Last of Us Part 2 is rumored to be a story of revenge...
https://www.vg247.com/2020/04/12/last-us-part-2-rumor-christian-cult/ The archived plot leak claims The Last of Us 2 will center around a budding romance between protagonist Ellie and love-interest Dina – a plot point that has already been confirmed by the game’s developers. However, this...
Nope
joe_zazen
Member
joe_zazen
Member
in all seriousness, if you can get into a mindset from before the critical theorists took over, you might enjoy it. You know, the time before the people who believe everything we think, say, or do is political, and therefore everything we think, say, and do must be controlled, and began cancelling and mobbing dissenters. And how everything is about oppression and the oppressed, and the self righteous calls for real and metaphorical violence against those who haven't taken or bought into those first year theory courses, and therefore do not understand reality and the need for cleansing the entire world and every culture and system of belief in order to bring about a utopia.
The dlc story is sweet and you dont have to spend 90% of your time murdering people, dogs, zombies, etc. It is way better than the main game and is the best walking sim ever. You really can inhabit the body of a 14 year old lesbian with feelings of first love, masterful as far as ps3 era interactive entertainment can be anyway.
However, if you can‘t wind the clock back from before millennial theory mobs and their fascistic language policing, then yeah, dont bother as it will just be irritating.
Last edited:
Screamer-RSA
Member
Last edited:
saintjules
Member
Dr. Claus
Banned
I can think of 20 studios that have had better pedigrees in story telling, game design, etc than Naughty Dog. The fuck is he even talking about?