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Captain America: Brave New World | Official Trailer

There is no continuity or 'canon' in comics
eyes looking GIF by Warner Bros. Deutschland

That's complete nonsense, marvel 616 has never had a hard reboot, it just has an (in-universe) sliding timescale so events stay current, this means some small backdrop things change like which war the punisher fought in his past, but nothing else; a good example of this is the destruction of genosha which happened in 2001, and the founding of krakoa which happened in 2019, in-universe these events are only about 3 years apart and in the same continuity.
 

Saber

Member
He takes many full power double fisted strikes from a HULK. How much kinetic energy can these wings absorb? It's a believability busting move because it essentially makes Sam invulnerable. Hardly the worst thing in this film as he'll need all that juice for the big team films coming, it just makes the film yo-yo when he 'decides' to fight a human mano-y-mano and takes a cracked rib but then 'gets serious' with fighter jets and then 'super serious' taking down a Hulk. There is little personal threat to him and its hard for the audience to feel the stakes because he (and largely his sidekick 'almost Falcon' as well) can fly supersonic, effortlessly use drones and stuff, and keep a snarky attitude the whole way. I suppose it a bit of a "bitch eating crackers" because stuff like this is littered throughout the MCU, especially after the first couple of films, but if they want a serious tone they need to adjust the power levels and use the fights to address the characters (IMHO).

I realize most of these are overly pedantic and bordering on petty complaints. But given the overall mess of the film, the attempt to weave in a serious tone and tackle more mature themes clashes horribly with the dull, pedestrian plot contrivances and the cartoony action. How much of this lies at the feet of the inexperienced director versus a sloppy overly complicated script is hard to say. Or too much interference and demands from corporate? Regardless, its sad to see what should be one of the tentpole MCU films (I've always considered the Capt America and Avengers films to be the "Main Quest advancing" films) become a muddied sidequest to whatever the "big narrative" is.

I don't think its petty at all. The whole point of superhero movies is introducing some kind of rules so that the person can understand what the capabilities of the character is and how they can contorn that. Batman for instance beat up enemies with gadgets and his cunning. Not like he can take or even face Doomsday in real combat.
Also this is a fucking movie I paid for, why is wrong to point the inconsistences? I think its totally valid, hence why we don't see things like Black Widow in true combat with Hulk.
This is a 5/10 (6 at best), I think being actually loyal or not with comic is meanless if the movie is poorly created and not entertaining.
 

AJUMP23

Parody of actual AJUMP23
I think it had a good opening weekend so marvel and Disney got what the needed from the international box office.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
You guys spending a lot of time and energy arguing over superheroes and the worst rated Captain America movie since a shitty 1990 movie with Ned Beatty.

It's like picking apart every nuance in a SW movie. It might be high budget films, but it's sci fi fun flicks meant for kids.
 

Saber

Member
I think it had a good opening weekend so marvel and Disney got what the needed from the international box office.

I don't think it included marketing and other costs though. Theres aways more than the actual budget announced for them to actually start making money, so they need to keep momentum if they ever wanted to get that.
 
Can people help a moose out. For the people who actually saw the movie, give it a rank 1-10. 10 being top notch. 1 being, well…Amazing Spider-Man 2, or Justice League.
 

Saber

Member
Can people help a moose out. For the people who actually saw the movie, give it a rank 1-10. 10 being top notch. 1 being, well…Amazing Spider-Man 2, or Justice League.

5 normally and 6 at best(if you're generous).
I guess the best thing in this is maybe Harison Ford, but the guy is so old, he can't keep up with Disney slop movies anymore.
Its better than The Marvels but gods above, that ain't much and that movie is ultra cringe, absolute terrible. Falcon isn't actually bad but I don't think he is actually a main hero material.
 
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lachesis

Member
I saw it on Saturday. I didn't know William Hurt has passed, hence they replaced him with Harrison Ford. RIP.
Harrison Ford had several moments of his humor and awkwardness, which only he could carry out. (like that peloton bicycle scene etc)
It was nice to see those moments, and gave some humanity to the character, Ross, but more of Harrison Ford way. In the end, I think it was a good choice.

But I had issues with old Power-ranger level of set design and artwork for that main villain brain guy. Also it felt really weird to see Sam thinking he's just a human - yet doing impossible super-hero stuff with his gears. Does his gears and suit give him that much power or how one's body can take so much G w/o hinch?

Then again, it's just a super hero movie, not meant to be scientifically accurate... so I decided not to give a thought about whole logic and just enjoy the movie... which, basically was my stance since Phase 4. So as a popcorn flick movie, it was okay.
Felt so bad when Red Hulk went back to human form, and the old, aging Harrison's body really made me feel bad - that he was my idol since 80s is so old. With that bias, I think of it as a 6 to 7 movie for me, but definitely not up to the point of Winter Soldier, which is my favorite Marvel movie so far.
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
.
Felt so bad when Red Hulk went back to human form, and the old, aging Harrison's body really made me feel bad - that he was my idol since 80s is so old. With that bias, I think of it as a 6 to 7 movie for me, but definitely not up to the point of Winter Soldier, which is my favorite Marvel movie so far.
That got me as well. I don't recall him looking so frail in Indy and that wasn't filmed far apart I dont think.
 

tamago84

Member
movie was ok, not something i would watch ever again. this was made more as a bridge of what superheroes we can expect in the next films

good point made on the humanity aspect- when the two (cap and the guest hero) were chatting near end of the end of scene, felt a bit chill
 
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jason10mm

Gold Member
They were a year apart. Ford didn’t work out.
Mail that guy some T!!

I'm watching Tulsa King and theres a great scene where some 40sish MILF thought Stallone was 'only' a well kept 55 and she loses her shit when he says he's 75. Dude(ette), Sly ain't looking 55 with all the hair dye in the world, but he's still in decent shape.
 

Alebrije

Member
Saw it yesterday , there were 3 good things :

1) The hod dog was great , theater changed the brand to a one similar to Oscar Mayers
2) The pop corn was crispy, recently done.
3) Harrison Ford was good but Lean Nelson is a better actor for this role.

The rest is for the trash can. Marvel is dead inside, there are more dangerous villians on the Smurfs movie than This one. No memorable side characters , Falcon guy is forgettable and the Breaking bad, Farcry actor basically has been doing that role the last 10 years.

Do not know the budget for this movie but basically is a Concord case again. Tons of money wasted.
 
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Trilobit

Absolutely Cozy
You guys spending a lot of time and energy arguing over superheroes and the worst rated Captain America movie since a shitty 1990 movie with Ned Beatty.

It's like picking apart every nuance in a SW movie. It might be high budget films, but it's sci fi fun flicks meant for kids.

Fandoms care about stuff and aren't chronically depressed and uninterested in fiction.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Saw it yesterday , there were 3 good things :

1) The hod dog was great , theater changed the brand to a one similar to Oscar Mayers
2) The pop corn was crispy, recently done.
3) Harrison Ford was good but Lean Nelson is a better actor for this role.

The rest is for the trash can. Marvel is dead inside, there are more dangerous villians on the Smurfs movie than This one. No memorable side characters , Falcon guy is forgettable and the Breaking bad, Farcry actor basically has been doing that role the last 10 years.

Do not know the budget for this movie but basically is a Concord case again. Tons of money wasted.
I dont go to theatres much anymore, but I'll fully admit the snack bar food is usually pretty good. Totally overpriced, but the dogs, popcorn and pump your own butter jugs can sometimes be better than the movie!
 

GateofD

Member
Let us know what you honestly think.

I actually liked most of it, definitely things to nitpick, but there plenty enough action and fights. I liked when the random mobs constantly took away Sam's shield and threw it aside, he doesn't really care since its just a side-accessory to him and he just uses his other burrowed tech. He's pretty much Black Iron Captain Falcon. (the black from black panther, Ironman helmet, Captain Shield and Falcon Wings). Which is okay I guess, he's obviously not as good at the shield throwing as Chris Evans Captain America, so it worked for me. I'm surprised he didn't start throwing some ant-man tech shrink/enlarge discs. They did try to explain that he's been sparring with a retired super soldier to explain his sudden CQC skills, so they tried for that at least.

The last 20 minutes were so close, but I couldn't buy it.
They tried to tap some of the Winter Soldier political conspiracy thing, but it fell flat because its just oh its mind control! And somehow it went from specific flashes that induced a seizure-zombie like state that was suppose to be specific to a person's brainwaves to a singe music track for everyone else.

The build up I think was done well even if everyone knew what was going to happen, the buildup of stress on Harrison Ford was good and the dorky nerd that keeps messing up his plans.
Most of the fight was fine, having Falcon just get smacked around like a bouncy ball the whole time is what should happen. Him surviving with just a cracked rib after 2 of those is another thing. And then him getting pummeled in the ground, nah, he would be squashed. They tried to explain it because it had black panther tech, but its just like one layer of whatever on his wings. Even Black Panther's full suit lined with the stuff wouldn't be able to hand Hulk smashes.

Don't get why the Secret Service started shooting at Red Hulk after he transformed...you know its still the president...why are you all sending all these things after him, and you think they already know from past experience on how to handle a hulk. Bullets don't work...
And why did they put him in jail afterwards again?

Better than most of the post endgame movies like Endgame stuff. Thunderbolts is going to be total garbage. So this is definitely better than that just from seeing the trailer before. Noticed this and Thunderbolts is now under a Marvel Studios label, and they didn't think this was worthy to have that MCU title crawl of all the past movies. Are they just gonna throw that away now because they don't want people to remember the good old days. Harrison really helped carry half the movie, I was more interested in his old man struggles than what Sam's conflict was...which was just to save his friend. While Fords had all the attempts at redemption and regrets of life's mistakes that you think a main character would have.
Loved the new short 4foot tall black window. I actually liked the new falcon sidekick. The limitation of just his wings and regular pilot suit made him more fun to watch cause you felt he could get swatted at anytime. Sam Wilson has like 5-6 layers of failsafes and defenses.

what's the deal with the subtitle. What Brave New World? what New World Order? Thought it would touch on the skrulls at least a bit. Just because of the adamantium? weak...
Overall, I give it a 6.5/10. Compared to Marvel's other recent movies.

Rankings of post-endgame movies:

Spider-man: No Way Home
Spider-man: Far From Home
Guardians 3
Shang Chi
Captain America: Brave New World
Dr. Strange
Ant-man and Wasp
Thor 4
Eternals
Black Panther 2
Black Widow
 
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Miyazaki’s Slave

Gold Member
I actually liked most of it, definitely things to nitpick, but there plenty enough action and fights. I liked when the random mobs constantly took away Sam's shield and threw it aside, he doesn't really care since its just a side-accessory to him and he just uses his other burrowed tech. He's pretty much Black Iron Captain Falcon. (the black from black panther, Ironman helmet, Captain Shield and Falcon Wings). Which is okay I guess, he's obviously not as good at the shield throwing as Chris Evans Captain America, so it worked for me. I'm surprised he didn't start throwing some ant-man tech shrink/enlarge discs. They did try to explain that he's been sparring with a retired super soldier to explain his sudden CQC skills, so they tried for that at least.

The last 20 minutes were so close, but I couldn't buy it.
They tried to tap some of the Winter Soldier political conspiracy thing, but it fell flat because its just oh its mind control! And somehow it went from specific flashes that induced a seizure-zombie like state that was suppose to be specific to a person's brainwaves to a singe music track for everyone else.

The build up I think was done well even if everyone knew what was going to happen, the buildup of stress on Harrison Ford was good and the dorky nerd that keeps messing up his plans.
Most of the fight was fine, having Falcon just get smacked around like a bouncy ball the whole time is what should happen. Him surviving with just a cracked rib after 2 of those is another thing. And then him getting pummeled in the ground, nah, he would be squashed. They tried to explain it because it had black panther tech, but its just like one layer of whatever on his wings. Even Black Panther's full suit lined with the stuff wouldn't be able to hand Hulk smashes.

Don't get why the Secret Service started shooting at Red Hulk after he transformed...you know its still the president...why are you all sending all these things after him, and you think they already know from past experience on how to handle a hulk. Bullets don't work...
And why did they put him in jail afterwards again?

Better than most of the post endgame movies like Endgame stuff. Thunderbolts is going to be total garbage. So this is definitely better than that just from seeing the trailer before. Noticed this and Thunderbolts is now under a Marvel Studios label, and they didn't think this was worthy to have that MCU title crawl of all the past movies. Are they just gonna throw that away now because they don't want people to remember the good old days. Harrison really helped carry half the movie, I was more interested in his old man struggles than what Sam's conflict was...which was just to save his friend. While Fords had all the attempts at redemption and regrets of life's mistakes that you think a main character would have.
Loved the new short 4foot tall black window. I actually liked the new falcon sidekick. The limitation of just his wings and regular pilot suit made him more fun to watch cause you felt he could get swatted at anytime. Sam Wilson has like 5-6 layers of failsafes and defenses.

what's the deal with the subtitle. What Brave New World? what New World Order? Thought it would touch on the skrulls at least a bit. Just because of the adamantium? weak...
Overall, I give it a 6.5/10. Compared to Marvel's other recent movies.

Rankings of post-endgame movies:

Spider-man: No Way Home
Spider-man: Far From Home
Guardians 3
Shang Chi
Captain America: Brave New World
Dr. Strange
Ant-man and Wasp
Thor 4
Eternals
Black Panther 2
Black Widow
I cannot actually believe you place Eternals above....any move in any series....EVER.

Different strokes/Different folks sure I get that...but Eternals? Why did you like it more than Black Widow for example?
 
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GateofD

Member
oh
Hello my friend Bucky that I spent a whole season with, nice to drop by. While your here, how about helping me out of this pickle I'm in. No? You only got paid for a cameo? bye.
 

GateofD

Member
I cannot actually believe you place Eternals above....any move in any series....EVER.

Different strokes/Different folks sure I get that...but Eternals? Why did you like it more than Black Widow for example?

The Flash in it cause I like watching speedsters, and the Indian actor, and at least for this era, the thing that happens at the end is or was suppose to be important...at least they finally addressed it in this film. and we still hanging on The Rings resonating with the emergence...but I think they forgot about that.

I didn't watch The Marvels, but going still put Eternals above The Marvels regardless.
 
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Does his gears and suit give him that much power or how one's body can take so much G w/o hinch?
Yes and no, there's a bit of suspension of disbelief needed even for the iron man suit, just because you have a layer of metal around you, doesn't mean kinetic energy impacting it just stops, it will go through it and turn you into mush.
Like the first iron man movie where tony gets shot out of the sky by the tank, it was said it wasn't an actual tank shell that hit him, but some kind of secondary barrel, but even then his skull should've been fractured because he took it on the face and he lost no forward momentum, and then he crashed hard enough to leave a crater...
If it was an actual tank shell it should've gone straight through the helmet or at least turned tony into paste inside.

But there is where they use the standard sci-fi trope of "inertial dampers", these use vibrations to offset/disperse the energy so that the final effect would is minimised on the person, this is also the argument used for why rhodes broke his back when he crashed war machine; the power supply was damaged so the "dampers" were offline too.

Enter vibranium, this fantastical material is wholly an inertial damper by itself, and an extremely effective one at that. There's a scene in civil war or black panther that shows this where black panther gets shot by regular caliber bullets, and instead of bouncing or ricocheting they drop straight down having lost all kinetic energy on impact.
And remember this?:
658fe641d28d5e1800674f5ba750df1e.gif


Instead of turning cap into paste, or at the very least pulverised his arm, all the energy was dispersed at the point of impact instead of heading forward, causing the blowback leveling the surrounding area.
Or this:
6895448-8160444498-giphy.gif

Instead of breaking every bone in his body and possibly dying on the spot, the vibranium made it a minor inconvenience, remember he casually takes down a quinjet with all kinds of flips right after this.

Sam has the shield + the upgraded vibranium that absorbs the energy instead of dispersing it, and the suit itself probably has, either woven vibranium, or like the scale mail vibranium steve wore in endgame; unless you're thor or hulk level you're not getting through, which the movie showed pretty well imo, Sam gets hit, gets pushed back quite a bit and the wings are immediately at energy capacity while vibrating violently, followed by sam saying "oh god".

So no obviously something exotic like inertial dampers don't exist and all the heroes relying on some metal shielding should've been turned to paste on numerous occasions, but because it does exist in this fictional world, sam surviving while running away/avoiding a direct fight checks out.
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
Enter vibranium, this fantastical material is wholly an inertial damper by itself, and an extremely effective one at that. There's a scene in civil war or black panther that shows this where black panther gets shot by regular caliber bullets, and instead of bouncing or ricocheting they drop straight down having lost all kinetic energy on impact.
And remember this?:
658fe641d28d5e1800674f5ba750df1e.gif


Instead of turning cap into paste, or at the very least pulverised his arm, all the energy was dispersed at the point of impact instead of heading forward, causing the blowback leveling the surrounding area.
Or this:
6895448-8160444498-giphy.gif

Instead of breaking every bone in his body and possibly dying on the spot, the vibranium made it a minor inconvenience, remember he casually takes down a quinjet with all kinds of flips right after this.
See, in these two scenes the directors make sure to try to maintain suspension of disbelief but A. showing that Thors strike is at least partially non-kinetic energy, and B. Cap goes through a window that (sorta) slows him. Obviously neither of these things would really matter, hell, a 15 pound sledgehammer swung by a 230 pound guy hitting a metal shield would likely still break the arm of the shieldwearer, no Asgardian magic necessary. Buuuut, it helps the viewer to BELIEVE, and keeps some sense of internal consistency that Cap can do SOME wonderful things but not just casually brush off EVERYTHING.

And that fall was sorta set up with his dive into the ocean in the beginning. Proper foreshadowing of enhanced capabilities is important. BNW did this as well with the reshot intro (maybe someone realized this was a necessary part missed in the initial draft), but it's a BIG step to go from bullets charging the wings to 2 minutes of full rage Hulk pounding, something that doesn't fit with the rest of the film tonally, IMHO. Heck, even the "we are in DC and now we are in the Indian Ocean" bit was jarring as fuck, but that stuff happens all the time in these films so I'll just assume they took a SWORD concord or whatever, not that he actually flew there at supersonic speeds in a wingsuit, accompanied by Kid Falcon. If THAT'S what they did, shit, make a 1000 of those suits! Get Hammertech on the case!
 

GateofD

Member
i agree with the shock absorption didn't pass the suspension disbelief test cause bullets and 20+ hulk punches is nowhere in the same scale. and nothing leads us to belief its that infinite.

heck in the infinity wars, Black Panther gets decked and KO'ed with a full suit that ends up dissipating the shock as he's on the ground cause it couldn't handle a punch from Thanos
 

Shouta

Member
Just got back from this. It's a pretty solid film but nothing spectacular. It's in the upper part of the post-Endgame Marvel films, which isn't hard, but I'd put it in the middle-ish with everything on the table?

I think the biggest problem is that the plot of the film is just really simple despite the tone they're going. There isn't a lot of them trying to figure it out and uncover the person that's behind this. The reveal was kind of just kind of plain. It's a bit of a shame too because I actually like the story of the film but it needed better plotting. I really dig the characters though. Anthony Mackie was pretty great and I really like his scenes with everyone. Sam's development in the film felt like a pretty natural extension of Falcon and the Winter Soldier too, which was nice. I liked the action too since it seemed to be choreographed with Sam being a normal person in mind. The set piece in the Indian Ocean was great too. Red Hulk sequence at the end was nice but it also kind of felt a little tacked on. It would have been cool to see it revealed in the film but marketing and leaks kinda ruined that.

If I had to give it a number score, it'd be about a 6-7?
 
i agree with the shock absorption didn't pass the suspension disbelief test cause bullets and 20+ hulk punches is nowhere in the same scale. and nothing leads us to belief its that infinite.
It's not infinite, which is why the wings were violently shaking and fully charged after a single punch from red hulk and sam was pushed back, if it was infinite sam wouldn't even move no matter what, but aside from that vibranium itself doesn't absorb energy, it disperses it, the absorption happens after the dispersion and is secondary tech Shuri invented, the first black panther suit we see didn't have it either.
And as shown prior Thor's swing, which is far above "bullets" as well, did nothing to steve, instead it destroyed the area around him. Sam has that shield and the wings, he basically has 3 shields for energy dispersion/absorption.

heck in the infinity wars, Black Panther gets decked and KO'ed with a full suit that ends up dissipating the shock as he's on the ground cause it couldn't handle a punch from Thanos
There are a few liberties that are taken just for getting a nice action set piece, steve also gets tossed around a couple times in winter soldier and avengers even though the shield should prevent that and has shown to prevent that on other occasions, heck when steve fights thanos in endgame there's a scene where he throws mjolnir at the shield behind thanos, and the impact has such blowback that all the kinetic energy hits thanos and makes him stumble and drop his weapon, and then moves in the opposite direction perfectly back to steve.

7p1flDs.gif
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
It's not infinite, which is why the wings were violently shaking and fully charged after a single punch from red hulk and sam was pushed back, if it was infinite sam wouldn't even move no matter what, but aside from that vibranium itself doesn't absorb energy, it disperses it, the absorption happens after the dispersion and is secondary tech Shuri invented, the first black panther suit we see didn't have it either.
And as shown prior Thor's swing, which is far above "bullets" as well, did nothing to steve, instead it destroyed the area around him. Sam has that shield and the wings, he basically has 3 shields for energy dispersion/absorption.


There are a few liberties that are taken just for getting a nice action set piece, steve also gets tossed around a couple times in winter soldier and avengers even though the shield should prevent that and has shown to prevent that on other occasions, heck when steve fights thanos in endgame there's a scene where he throws mjolnir at the shield behind thanos, and the impact has such blowback that all the kinetic energy hits thanos and makes him stumble and drop his weapon, and then moves in the opposite direction perfectly back to steve.

7p1flDs.gif
IIRC at some point they have a magnetic "Recall" function for the shield, right? Obviously more comic book tech but I think some of the shield tricks later in the series are using that capability.
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
He has this in Civil war I believe, but then he loses the shield and tech, I don't believe he has it in endgame.
I forget which one has Steve cinching the shield straps tighter over his broken arm but for most of the later films he just kind of snaps the shield on and off as needed. BNW def has a scene where Sam kicks it up to his arm and 'holds' it somehow and another scene where it sort of just pops up and snaps to his arm, so whether "the lore", such as it is for that film, has that specific tool (makes sense it would be there, it's already been developed and is handy) the FX guys are showing it working in that fashion.

I kinda agree with GateofD GateofD that the shield feels so superfluous for Sam with all his gear (seems like he can just ALWAYS have the wings and suit as it just materialized around him as needed) that it just seems odd that "passing the shield" is some sort of requirement. It would be like some Air Force flying ace having to use a P-51 instead of Sabres, Phantoms, Falcons, or Raptors just because its the WW2 era P-51 that the american public recognized. Sam is waaaaaay past needing the shield with his tech.

I do kinda want a D+ show about some enterprising young kids that gather up all that vibranium scattered across DC and become a militia force. Maybe adapt Mark Bernardin's Genius as the basis :p
 

Miyazaki’s Slave

Gold Member
The Flash in it cause I like watching speedsters, and the Indian actor, and at least for this era, the thing that happens at the end is or was suppose to be important...at least they finally addressed it in this film. and we still hanging on The Rings resonating with the emergence...but I think they forgot about that.

I didn't watch The Marvels, but going still put Eternals above The Marvels regardless.
I haven’t seen the marvels either, outside of black widow being a sort of dead end for the character, I found it watchable.
 

RagnarokIV

Battlebus imprisoning me \m/ >.< \m/

Bridget Jones: Mad About The Boy stormed to the number one spot, with an opening weekend in the UK of £10.2m.
Marvel’s latest juggernaut meanwhile, Captain America: Brave New World, had to content itself with £6.4m over the weekend, hardly a shabby number, but comfortably in second place.
 

Redneckerz

Those long posts don't cover that red neck boy
Just saw this. Came in mixed knowing it opened pretty well but that critics scored it quite low.

The critics were right. Ford really saves the day with his presence and Mackie's performance was alright, but not stellar.

Story wise its an absolute slog. This could be written by ChatGPT and it would be a better movie if it did.

Visuals were brutal. Red Hulk mostly passes, but the backdrops are legit cringe to look at. You could film this in Unreal Engine 5's movie setup and you would have better visuals. Its not The Flash levels of horrid, but it is very obvious what is greenscreen.

It feels like films visually do a Benjamin Button and just look more and more outdated to the point that games themselves actually look better.

Want to see an actual good movie that isn't without A-list actors, was shot entirely on IPhone and as such has tons of suspence? Try Inheritance.
 

ProtoByte

Weeb Underling


Interesting review from a guy who normally loves all the marvel movies.

He still doesn't get it.

First, the problem isn't that people expect every MCU project to be as good as Endgame. In fact, I think Endgame was not very good at all and was actually where the cracks started. But what people expect is coherent storytelling.

Rob's suggested fixes are just comic book easter egg slop that have no bearing. Basing the story around a the Weapons program would just be rehashing plot beats from Winter Soldier, Civil War AND FATWS and also an asspull. Yet another set of experimental superbeings. Wow. A story that wouldn't be personal to Sam since he refuses to take the serum.

Rob still pretends to like the nonsense they pass off as comics today, so he either cannot admit that the problem here comes down to Sam Wilson as Cap. If the comics of it were so good, you would think they wouldn't try to dredge up Ed Norton Hulk stuff long forgotten and disregarded.
 
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