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[SigmasonicX]

Considering I just recently got done rewatching season 6, I'll give my opinions. The Impossible Astronaut and Day of the Moon had neat parts, but way too much time was spent on the entire "the Doctor is totally gonna die guys" and the mystery of the Silence for me to just view it as a stand-alone episode like Boem suggests, and my disappointment at how that all turned out brought down my enjoyment of the episode. I skipped "The Curse of the Black Spot". "The Doctor's Wife" is the highlight of the season. "The Rebel Flesh" and "The Almost People" were dragged out and rather dull, but not terrible. I made an entire post about why I don't like "A Good Man Goes to War" here, and "Let's Kill Hitler" wasn't good either.

"Night Terrors" was actually OK, I thought, but the dolls don't tie into the theme of the episode at all. I actually don't like "The Girl Who Waited", especially since they don't actually do anything with how this is the first time Rory and Amy see the Doctor do something so potentially immoral, and I generally thought it was dull. I'm also not a fan of "The God Complex", which I also thought was largely dull. "Closing Time" is sappy as hell, but the scenes of the Doctor talking to random people were amusing at least. "The Wedding of River Song" is bleh.

 

[CharminUltra]

Dem Series 5 days were THE days for me (NuWho). That was the one year the show went from "silly fun with some solid moments here and there but bogged down by a few horrid characters and the queasy romance" to something I could take (slightly) more seriously. Nothing before (again, as far as NuWho is concerned) or since has made me feel that way.

I hope Capaldi brings some of that S5 magic back.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

I agree, brother. I don't understand the hate for S6-other than maybe people hating the focus on River. The only true bad episode in my mind was Curse of the Black Spot. (Well yeah you're right-Closing Time is pretty bad. I like the last couple of minutes thought. But the cyberman plot is just ridiculous)

The Wedding of River Song was cringe inducing.

 

[Dalek]

The Wedding of River Song was cringe inducing.

I like it for how off the wall it was. I tend to love alternative universe stories so I had no problem with it.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

I like it for how off the wall it was. I tend to love alternative universe stories so I had no problem with it.

Give me Father's Day over this any day of the week.

 

[Boem]

Really? I honestly enjoyed it as well. All of history happening at once was a pretty neat idea, especially as a theme for the big River Song episode her story was leading to. Her story is all about a messed up timeline, so really the only way to do that justice is to go all out on that, and there are some great little moments and lines in it (like I mentioned earlier, the 'we seem to be defending ourselves'-line was just awesome. I really enjoy the occasional high concept episode, and I saw it as a sort of tribute to 'Volcano', the Pertwee episode. The story is nonsense of course, but it knows it is and they have fun with it.

I totally understand why some people don't like it, but I had fun with it. I don't even like the actress who plays River that much. Like I said earlier, I like it when they apply Douglas Addams-type ideas of how the Doctor Who universe works to the show. It's silly fun, it's very British, there are some good jokes in it, and it's probably the best way they could have told the story of how the Doctor ended up marrying River. Seriously, I share some of the criticisms of how her story was told over the episodes, but just thinking about how that entire plot fit together makes me laugh. The way the plot works is bonkers in the same way that Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy or Dirk Gently can be. Boring Doctor Who is the worst, let them take some risks every once in a while.

 

[iMax]

Give me Father's Day over this any day of the week.

Come on now, you don't mean that.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

Come on now, you don't mean that.

Check my history in the S7 OT. I've been on about this for a while.

 

[mclem]

I believe the repopulation of Cybermen throughtout the universe was driven primarily by Cybus Cybermen, after the Doctor throws them god knows where in The Next Doctor. Next time we see them, they're a full-on legion, with motherships and the lot, still rocking that Cybus look. They eventually ditched the logo and upgraded to the current OP version, but it all started with Pete's World.

Any Mondas or Telos Cyber forces would just be assimilated.

Now, the question is: How does a Cyberman ditch the logo? Someone has to do it first... and the one who does it first is acting as an individual, therefore not as a Cyberman.

Hence, they have to be from the original timeline Cybermen.

 

[teiresias]

They're from Pete's World. Step it up, casuals.

This is wrong.

 

[Dalek]

Give me Father's Day over this any day of the week.

 

[APZonerunner]

Come on now, you don't mean that.

Father's Day is one of the best stories in the post-2005 run, so... Yeah, it's got a shit CGI monster. So what? It's one of the best emotionally charged stories the show has ever done.

I maintain, really, that Moffat overall does better stories and RTD does better characters. My problem with RTD's run often sits with the overall story (Subwave Network = Jesus Doctor, Human Dalek etc), while my problem with Moffat's has always been characters (Paper thin companions, River getting progressively more awesome, etc) and I think a Who written by both of them together would be god-tier.

I think the one thing I miss from the RTD era was actually the hands-on approach RTD took. RTD would take chances with lesser-known writers - it didn't always work out - and would rewrite every single episode, big or small, himself. In addition to rewrites by the writers. I think that resulted in an overall more consistent quality. Fear Her is the example I can think of where it downright failed, but that's notable because it was one RTD didn't really have the time to rewrite because it was written in about a fortnight mid-production to replace Stephen Fry's episode, which they couldn't afford.

Moffat prefers to take established writers and while he gives them notes he doesn't rewrite them, and that leads to weird tonal problems, like Amy and Rory's complete flippancy in 6b about essentially having lost the chance to raise their child, and things like that. The notes tend to be more bullet pointy things, like his notes to Gaiman for the Cyberman episode were that he wanted them to detach their limbs, which led to the headless body, the hands attacking people on their own, etc. I think the no rewrites thing also means some general quality and character things that get missed as well. So, I miss that.

I believe the repopulation of Cybermen throughtout the universe was driven primarily by Cybus Cybermen, after the Doctor throws them god knows where in The Next Doctor. Next time we see them, they're a full-on legion, with motherships and the lot, still rocking that Cybus look. They eventually ditched the logo and upgraded to the current OP version, but it all started with Pete's World.

Any Mondas or Telos Cyber forces would just be assimilated.

While the Pandorica/Closing Time ones are debatable and likely forever will be due to the lack of the Cybus logo, the ones in Series 7 are specifically designed to depict a Cybermen far in the future where the Pete's World Cybermen and Mondasian Cybermen met, realized their similar ideals, and merged to create a race with the strength of both. That's why they're weak to Gold, that's a trait they got from the Mondasians, but the steel-like design was from Cybus, etc. They're also still "brains in suits" ala Cybus, while the Mondas ones were more full organic bodies heavily, heavily augmented, more like cyborgs.

The whole point of the episode in a sense is to say "they merged, they're one race now." This has been printed in a lot of interviews with Gaiman and Moffat both, but it's not been on-screen. I bet some extended universe will fill it in somewhere.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

Yeah the CG is shit but the episode was interestingly written with clearly defined stakes and an earned emotional payoff.

The same reason The Impossible Planet towers over any season 6 or 7 episode.

 

[Bluth54]

Davies did exactly the same thing.

After reading the Writer's Tale I think Davies may of been worse the Moffat, he would constantly put off writing scripts until the very last minute. I imagine so many of RTD's stories would of been so better if he didn't put off writing the scripts and was able to go through a couple more revisions.

 

[Toxi]

Can't wait, it's fun seeing a new actor play the doctor.

And oh my god people are seriously still arguing rtd vs moffat four years later. it never ends.

 

[KuwabaraTheMan]

After reading the Writer's Tale I think Davies may of been worse the Moffat, he would constantly put off writing scripts until the very last minute. I imagine so many of RTD's stories would of been so better if he didn't put off writing the scripts and was able to go through a couple more revisions.

Midnight was pretty much written in a manner of days though, and that was an out of this world script. I think based on reading The Writer's Tale that it's pretty much the way his brain was wired.

 

[Dalek]

Midnight was pretty much written in a manner of days though, and that was an out of this world script. I think based on reading The Writer's Tale that it's pretty much the way his brain was wired.

Oh God. Midnight? I recently rewatched Series 4 with my daughter - and I couldn't get through it a second time. Half the script is just people repeating each other's words. Who wrote this-Brian Michael Bendis? That shtick gets old and annoying really quick (as any parent will tell you).

 

[Loke13]

Oh God. Midnight? I recently rewatched Series 4 with my daughter - and I couldn't get through it a second time. Half the script is just people repeating each other's words. Who wrote this-Brian Michael Bendis? That shtick gets old and annoying really quick (as any parent will tell you).

What? Midnight night was an incredible episode. The atmosphere was top notch and the way the tension never lifts and slowly climbs right up until the moment there about to throw the Doctor out the airlock is godly.

I was honestly surprised that Davies such a damn good/original piece.

 

[equippedwithtowel]

Oh God. Midnight? I recently rewatched Series 4 with my daughter - and I couldn't get through it a second time. Half the script is just people repeating each other's words. Who wrote this-Brian Michael Bendis? That shtick gets old and annoying really quick (as any parent will tell you).

Midnight is a brilliant script, it captures mob psychology excellently and allows itself to keep the tension in repeat views by not giving every answer.

 

[Alcoremortis]

Yeah... I think if anything Midnight gets better with re-watches since it's just inherently creepy how quickly a bunch of normal people could turn into potential murderers over essentially nothing.

I mean, Blink was pretty creepy the first time, but after you get the catch, it loses it's sting with repeat viewings. Midnight never fails to be eery in how it handles the descent into madness.

 

[Blader]

Father's Day is great. It's one of the only S1 episodes that's actually good.

Oh God. Midnight? I recently rewatched Series 4 with my daughter - and I couldn't get through it a second time. Half the script is just people repeating each other's words. Who wrote this-Brian Michael Bendis? That shtick gets old and annoying really quick (as any parent will tell you).

a) that's, like, part of the plot
b) that's completely different from Bendis-speak, who only writes that way because he doesn't know how to write

 

[A-V-B]

Come on now, you don't mean that.

You givin' Father's Day shit yo? That's messed up, dog. That episode's whack.

(it's really good)

 

[Quick]

Yeah the CG is shit but the episode was interestingly written with clearly defined stakes and an earned emotional payoff.

The same reason The Impossible Planet towers over any season 6 or 7 episode.

This opinion is sound.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Can't wait, it's fun seeing a new actor play the doctor.

And oh my god people are seriously still arguing rtd vs moffat four years later. it never ends.

For me, it's only 6 months later.

Re: Midnight: One of my favorite episodes. And not just the mob mentality, but the fact that it's one of the few times on the show you really feel like you're on an alien, hostile world as opposed to Earth with weird people.

Re: Season 6: It has The Girl Who Waited which is hands down my favorite Smith episode, but it also has Let's Kill Hitler which had me wondering if I should keep watching. The Doctor's Wife is pretty great but also overrated, IMHO. Very Gaiman, which has good and bad aspects, but mostly good.

Father's Day is a plain awesome episode, and if people really are judging the show by its effects and not its story or character, no wonder so many people prefer the Moffat years. Big upgrade in incidentals, big downgrade in writing.

 

[Dalek]

For me, it's only 6 months later.

Re: Midnight: One of my favorite episodes. And not just the mob mentality, but the fact that it's one of the few times on the show you really feel like you're on an alien, hostile world as opposed to Earth with weird people.

Re: Season 6: It has The Girl Who Waited which is hands down my favorite Smith episode, but it also has Let's Kill Hitler which had me wondering if I should keep watching. The Doctor's Wife is pretty great but also overrated, IMHO. Very Gaiman, which has good and bad aspects, but mostly good.

Father's Day is a plain awesome episode, and if people really are judging the show by its effects and not its story or character, no wonder so many people prefer the Moffat years. Big upgrade in incidentals, big downgrade in writing.

I don't really judge Fathers Day on the effects but rather the dumb idea of The Reapers. There's a reason they're never mentioned again. I do like how angry The Doctor treated Rose though.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I've just gone over all the New Who episode lists, and I find that I quite like a lot of Moffatt-era episodes, just that I really hate his overarching arcs. For instance, I really liked the Ganger story too, and I'm a fan of Cold War. But he really lost me on all the effort spent on the long plots which made no sense and were often rebooted anyway.

 

[Vibranium]

I loved Midnight because of how relatively low (For DW) the stakes were, and with the Doctor on his own. The episode kept building until 10 finally snapped and it was great. And the mystery was very intriguing without a clear answer. In short, it's an episode more writers should take some inspiration from. I hope Moff looks back at some of the bigger highlights from the less conventional eps and plays with the formula in in the next two series.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

I don't really judge Fathers Day on the effects but rather the dumb idea of The Reapers. There's a reason they're never mentioned again. I do like how angry The Doctor treated Rose though.

I quite liked them. But at the time I was completely new to Who metaphysics, and seems like they don't foot with what came before or after. As a standalone story though, it's great.

The other thing I noticed looking over the list was how much of S1 I really like. I keep recalling WWIII/Aliens of London but on the whole, most of the S1 stories are good.

 

[APZonerunner]

I quite liked them. But at the time I was completely new to Who metaphysics, and seems like they don't foot with what came before or after. As a standalone story though, it's great.

The other thing I noticed looking over the list was how much of S1 I really like. I keep recalling WWIII/Aliens of London but on the whole, most of the S1 stories are good.

I think if they'd been directed in a different way it'd be up there as one of the best two-parters, to be honest. The scripts were good. The Director just had no clue.

 

[maharg]

A big problem with the reapers, especially in combination with the completely sketchy CG used to render them, is that it brings up a memory of this travesty for anyone who's seen it:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112040/

 

[Alcoremortis]

The whole Aliens of London was where I couldn't get my dad to continue watching the show. He just kept on bringing up how stupid the farting aliens were from then on and there was nothing I could do to convince him the rest of the show wasn't like that.

 

[Kevin]

Not sure if this has been posted yet but Best Buy seems to be having a rather nice Doctor Who sale going on. Several of the Blu-Ray season sets have been discounted. Finally grabbed Series 7 for $30.

 

[Dalek]

The whole Aliens of London was where I couldn't get my dad to continue watching the show. He just kept on bringing up how stupid the farting aliens were from then on and there was nothing I could do to convince him the rest of the show wasn't like that.

Yeah again this is the problem with trying to get skeptical people into the show with Season One. It's front loaded with bad, sadly.

 

[A-V-B]

The whole Aliens of London was where I couldn't get my dad to continue watching the show. He just kept on bringing up how stupid the farting aliens were from then on and there was nothing I could do to convince him the rest of the show wasn't like that.

Just skip Aliens of London. And the sequel in Season 2 (or 3 or whatever.) I recommend this to all human beings.

 

[Exterminieren]

Just skip Aliens of London. And the sequel in Season 2 (or 3 or whatever.) I recommend this to all human beings.

Skip Boom Town? A monstrous travesty. Don't you try and take dinner in bondage away from me.

 

[paradox121]

Since we seem to have hit the cyclical portion of this thread where we either have Moffat vs RTD discussions or decide where you need to start watching the show, how about some Rani talk!

Siobhan Redmond's been cast as the Rani!....for Big Finish

http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/meet-the-new-rani-64032.htm

Kinda puts doubt to all those Keeley Hawes = Rani suggestions. Not that they held much water to begin with but hey.

 

[Blader]

I've just gone over all the New Who episode lists, and I find that I quite like a lot of Moffatt-era episodes, just that I really hate his overarching arcs. For instance, I really liked the Ganger story too, and I'm a fan of Cold War. But he really lost me on all the effort spent on the long plots which made no sense and were often rebooted anyway.

I actually really liked Cold War too. It's the only Gatiss episode I've enjoyed.

Funny how big the gap in quality is between most of Gatiss' Who work and An Adventure in Space and Time.

 

[The Elite]

I think if they'd been directed in a different way it'd be up there as one of the best two-parters, to be honest. The scripts were good. The Director just had no clue.

I think WWIII/Aliens of London is a big reason people recommend Season 5 first. Season 1 is great but these two are real stinkers and can be roadblocks for new viewers. It's a shame because you need to watch these to set up Boom Town, which I thought was excellent.

I think the backbone of the scripts was solid but the alien design and the whole farting gimmick completely buried everything else. Even as a huge fan of the the Doctor going into those episodes, I still cringed.

The Wedding of River Song was cringe inducing.

It's a great concept for a two parter.

 

[Magwik]

All of these bumps makes me think there's trailer.

 

[The Elite]

All of these bumps makes me think there's trailer.

I keep checking this thread daily for a trailer.

I expect July 15th. (pulled out of my ass)

 

[obin_gam]

Siobhan Redmond's been cast as the Rani!

COOL!

for Big Finish

oh for fuck sake -_-

 

[Team Filler]

Still no trailer? Bah!

Even after all this time I'm still somewhat shocked that Capaldi is going to be The Doctor. I will be very disappointed if there isn't a line somewhere in this season about downloading rice.

 

[iMax]

You givin' Father's Day shit yo? That's messed up, dog. That episode's whack.

(it's really good)

It's pretty good. I mean, it's not 'Fear Her' levels of good, but it's getting there.

Spoiler

jk

 

[Team Filler]

Father's Day is fantastic scifi with shit effects. I can't believe people are bagging on it when one of the shows biggest villains attacks with a toilet plunger appendage.

 

[SpacePirate Ridley]

Father's Day is great. It's one of the only S1 episodes that's actually good.

Yep, ive watched again passed christmas with my cousing, and now again with a friend the whole season 1 and father's day is great, with dalek, the empty child/the doctor dances and the ending. The rest is pretty bad, although ive had always fun with the second epsiode becuase it was the first time I personally saw an out of this world episode and an indication of some of some of the places doctor who could go.
I have to say after repeats the final moments of world world 3 are the best part of those two flatulent episodes. Boom Town's dinner is also the only good scene in that episode.

As I always say, boring doctor who episodes are the worst episodes.

 

[Quick]

Father's Day had the emotional punch, and the other aspects of time travel (not the reapers) were great. The car that was constantly swerving in front of the church waiting to hit Pete, time damaging stuff in general, and some of the effects of disobeying RTD's established rules coming into play. It was a good episode overall.

I also appreciated the modification of the continuity with Jackie telling young Rose about a woman who stayed with Pete until he died, later revealed to her as Rose herself in the finale.

 

[8bit]

Since we seem to have hit the cyclical portion of this thread where we either have Moffat vs RTD discussions or decide where you need to start watching the show, how about some Rani talk!

Siobhan Redmond's been cast as the Rani!....for Big Finish

http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/meet-the-new-rani-64032.htm

Kinda puts doubt to all those Keeley Hawes = Rani suggestions. Not that they held much water to begin with but hey.

Not really, the Big Finish stuff isn't quite the same Canon (brrrr) as the TV stuff is it? Keeley Hawes is obviously the Master though.

 

[Scooter155]

Yeah the CG is shit but the episode was interestingly written with clearly defined stakes and an earned emotional payoff.

The same reason The Impossible Planet towers over any season 6 or 7 episode.

Yeah, Father's Day is a fantastic (heh) episode with some hard to ignore CG. I especially love how the Doctor is removed from the story and it's entirely up to the people he's inspired to set things right.

I love Impossible Planet and Satan Pit, but I"m kind of a sucker for that sort of thing, Satan, Lovecraftian horrors outside of our universe. 42 is a really similar episode that's also super great.

And the execution of the idea of all of history happening at the same time was just poorly done. It's an interesting idea, but it wouldn't just be that clocks stopped, you know? Every person who'd ever lived or would ever lived would be currently existing, and every second of their life would also be existing concurrently.

It would be impossible to represent that onscreen, but they shouldn't have explained it in that way if they couldn't make it happen. Just say "different time periods are colliding" as a result of River's meddling instead of "all of time has collapsed to this one moment"...

 

[Vinci]

Father's Day and Midnight are great episodes, with Midnight being one of the best in history. Truly a genius piece of work. I'm not generally a Davies fan but that script is fantastic.

 

[Hot Coldman]

While the Pandorica/Closing Time ones are debatable and likely forever will be due to the lack of the Cybus logo, the ones in Series 7 are specifically designed to depict a Cybermen far in the future where the Pete's World Cybermen and Mondasian Cybermen met, realized their similar ideals, and merged to create a race with the strength of both. That's why they're weak to Gold, that's a trait they got from the Mondasians, but the steel-like design was from Cybus, etc. They're also still "brains in suits" ala Cybus, while the Mondas ones were more full organic bodies heavily, heavily augmented, more like cyborgs.

The whole point of the episode in a sense is to say "they merged, they're one race now." This has been printed in a lot of interviews with Gaiman and Moffat both, but it's not been on-screen. I bet some extended universe will fill it in somewhere.

Ohhhh, the gold thing is a good point. I always forget the Cybus ones weren't weak to gold: I always kept thinking that the Tardis "cell" that the Doctor blasts them with in Age of Steel was a Glitter Gun. And "Nightmare in Silver" was shitty enough for me to forget most of the intricacies unrelated to Mr Clever.

Either way, I still maintain everything before Nightmare In Silver was Pete's World.