awwr999999
Member
The only legit way to play any of Rockstar's PS2 games is with a PS2.
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Games where the Original release was better than the Remake or Remaster
- Thread starter adamsapple
- Start date
Grizzled Ghost
Member
Weird example to start with, because it's first re-release, Subsistence, is definitely the best version of the game. And it includes that minigame iirc.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I can't fit all this into the topic title.Why is RE4 here if it was a port that came out 10 months later? It was not a remake or remaster
What are some examples of games where you preferred the original release to any remake / remaster / 'director's cut' or re-releases it got later with brief reasons why.
Fair enough, let's say all re-releases of MGS3 after the PS2.
i-e the X360/PS3 and the current Master Collection editions.
Imtjnotu
Member
Then I'll give it to ever switch version of ps4/ps5/Xbox games.
Harry potter
Doom
The Witcher 3
Alien isolation
Metro redux
Majoras Mask 3d.
Changed the bosses and the zora swimming for no fucking reason. The worst of it was the deku spin changes. In the og it had instant momentum that carried to skipping on water, but no 3d took out that out. even when at full speed, momentum didn't carry to water skips, so you'd hit water and lose that making some things impossible to do.
Changed the bosses and the zora swimming for no fucking reason. The worst of it was the deku spin changes. In the og it had instant momentum that carried to skipping on water, but no 3d took out that out. even when at full speed, momentum didn't carry to water skips, so you'd hit water and lose that making some things impossible to do.
It's not completely gone but they reduced it. I just played it back to back (N64 and DS version) within the last hour. I took a small body of water inside the clock tower as reference. In the DS version I need one jump less to cross the water when I'm going in with the deku spin, needing two water jumps instead of three. So there's momentum. However, in the N64 version it is possible to cross that water with one jump only, but it's not consistently possible and often requires two jumps as well.
But damn is the DS version improved in so many ways. You can save the game right after reaching the city. Text (skip) speed is drastically increased. In so many dialogues the N64 version become tedious when you read fast or know some dialogues by heart. Textures and geometry are drastically improved as well without altering the overall vibe of the game (as in they didn't recoloured the game or changed the doom's day tone of the game). And in the city being able to see through the tunnels to the different city parts also helps for orientation (for new players) and it just looks a bit more immersive. Having manual control over the camera besides the old Z button is also a nice QoL addition. Same goes for the ability to set timers for the journal quests. Oh, and while MM players and fans of course know how to get the journal, it was a great move for new comers to just give it to them. Back then when we had like three games to play per year and spent countless hours with one game, of course we found out that if you do the Bombers' quest AGAIN as Hylian Link you'll get the journal. But for newcomers it is easy to miss because why would you do the hide and seek game again unless you want the moon's tear again later on for other quests. So you probably get it eventually but it could be well several hours into the game.
Then there's one additional item slot allowing to prepare 4 instead of 3 items, which improves the flow of the gameplay (comes close to the change in OoT to equip the iron boots with the item button, really improving the gameplay in the water temple). The UI, except for one button and the small clock bar, is completely moved to the bottom screen, the N64 version feels more cluttered with these huge A and B and C buttons. And while the old clock at the bottom of the screen in the N64 version looks simply beautiful, it does take a lot of screen space; despite being semi-transparent while Link is moving and becoming non-transparent when he's standing still for two seconds. It just says that the N64 version is all around a brilliant game but I wouldn't ignore all the (positive) changes of the DS version.
Zora swimming is still not fundamentally different and is still fun but requires collecting mana bottles, so you really benefit from having your mana pool upgraded by then. Or putting your rupees to good use and buy Chateau Romani for unlimited mana. And let's not ignore that the ability to swim slower than in the N64 version improves handling in tight spaces and/or corridors. Still, Zora swimming is only a portion of the whole game while most changes of the DS version you'll notice over the course of the whole game from start to finish.
Anyways, I'm aware I won't convert anyone over who dislikes the DS version. But since I'm playing both versions right now I must say how great the DS version feels when playing.
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Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
It also played better because it was liberated from the shitty Gamecube controller.
DownLikeBCPowder
Member
Yeah, I love the RE2make, but the original pre-rendered games are magic, plus the real scenarios, etc.. I like both. I wish they would make new pre-rendered style RE games, though.
NeoIkaruGAF
Gold Member
Resident Evil 1. Fight me.
Yes, the REmake is a great game, but it… didn’t get it. It’s pretty clear from the FOUR classic RE games that came before it that REmake definitely is NOT what Mikami would have wanted to make originally, but couldn’t. The craptacular VA of OG RE1 could have been a consequence of tight dev time and money, but when the VA is like that in all of the following games, then the B-movie vibe of the games must be intentional. But REmake suddenly did away with all that with Hollywood-like production values. It also diluted playing time with questionable ideas like doorknobs that break if you go through a door too many times, additional puzzles requiring more tedious fetch quests and inventory management, and Crimson Heads. Not to mention, the colors of the original are completely gone.
I never played MGS The Twin Snakes, but from all the GIFs I’ve seen of it, it seems the polar opposite of REmake. When you’ve played the sequels, it’s really hard to NOT think that Kojima would have done all of that and more on PS1 if he could have.
About the Zelda remasters, they took some steps backwards, but they are all clear improvements on the originals overall. Ocarina of Time 3D is mostly the same game. The Wind Waker HD introduces so many QoL features that even thinking of going back to the GC version is out of the question. I even struggled to beat the OG a second time because it’s such a chore to play.
As for MM, it’s the one they needlessly tinkered with the most, and almost never in the ideal way. But gyro aiming, free camera, and the changes to the boss in Stone Tower Temple are great improvements over the N64 version.
Yes, the REmake is a great game, but it… didn’t get it. It’s pretty clear from the FOUR classic RE games that came before it that REmake definitely is NOT what Mikami would have wanted to make originally, but couldn’t. The craptacular VA of OG RE1 could have been a consequence of tight dev time and money, but when the VA is like that in all of the following games, then the B-movie vibe of the games must be intentional. But REmake suddenly did away with all that with Hollywood-like production values. It also diluted playing time with questionable ideas like doorknobs that break if you go through a door too many times, additional puzzles requiring more tedious fetch quests and inventory management, and Crimson Heads. Not to mention, the colors of the original are completely gone.
I never played MGS The Twin Snakes, but from all the GIFs I’ve seen of it, it seems the polar opposite of REmake. When you’ve played the sequels, it’s really hard to NOT think that Kojima would have done all of that and more on PS1 if he could have.
About the Zelda remasters, they took some steps backwards, but they are all clear improvements on the originals overall. Ocarina of Time 3D is mostly the same game. The Wind Waker HD introduces so many QoL features that even thinking of going back to the GC version is out of the question. I even struggled to beat the OG a second time because it’s such a chore to play.
As for MM, it’s the one they needlessly tinkered with the most, and almost never in the ideal way. But gyro aiming, free camera, and the changes to the boss in Stone Tower Temple are great improvements over the N64 version.
moniker
Member
But ... Mikami directed REmake.
Instead of the bleak color palette and grungy textures that accomponied themes such as industrialism and slavery they made the game look all giddy and happy. Similar to demon souls imo. On top of that they switched a fixed camera to a following one that often reveals all of the hidden secrets.
DownLikeBCPowder
Member
Yeah, I think both of these are excellent games for different reasons. REMake is much more polished, beautiful, etc, but the original is something special! You can't recreate that sort of experience and keep it all in tact, lol! Another case where I love both of them.
Sadly I'm sure that's right, but doubtful people would want to hear that. But it was developed by Silicon Knights of all people - with creative oversight by Konami, so I'm not sure how much involvement Kojima actually had, though I do believe he was personally pushing for more cutscene insanity. MGS4 had me nope out of the whole series though, lol.
Wait a sec, isn't Tales of Symphonia originally a Gamecube game or do you mean the re-release on the PS3?Tales of Symphonia, gamecube version
JohnSpartanLee
Member
Symphony of the Night
sncvsrtoip
Member
re4 on ps2 is not remaster lol, gamecube was just more powerful hw and ps2 version is port
Artstyle, music and atmosphere were completely ruined in the remake and its the soul game with the best atmosphere...
Dr. Wilkinson
Member
I’d have to say it’s a close call for me with some original games vs remakes, such as like TTYD. The new lighting, music reworked/rerecorded, new high res assets, new secret bosses, making TEC a red light to reflect the original Japanese release, all the hundreds of little touches that only hardcore fans would even notice, like adding back sprites to all the characters, etc made the remake an amazing thing that i’m very glad exists. TTYD is in my Top 5 all time games ever. But TTYD was partially so great because it was simplistic visually but super snappy and satisfying to play on GameCube. Losing the snappy 60fps in the Switch remake was really a bummer. More of a bummer than I thought it would be til I finally got to play it and see the difference for myself. I really hope any Switch 2 update can resolve this. Then I would concede it would make it superior in every way to the original.
But then some originals are clearly better, like the original Super Monkey Balls on GameCube/ PS2. The remakes/ new ones just have horrible physics and I hate the new art style. The originals are far, far superior in every way. For whatever reason the developers are unwilling/unable to replicate the extremely satisfying handling and physics from the originals. So until that happens, the new ones are trash.
And then there’s remakes like Wind Waker HD which is imho clearly superior in every possible way to the original. Down to the redone/ orchestrated music. The amazing-looking cel shaded HD asset updates, the redone character models, the controls, etc. it’s impossible to go back to the GameCube version after the Wii U version, because something is just lost. The Wii U version is just quite literally… perfect. As long as you map the bow to the right trigger. Otherwise the controls require you to somehow grow a third thumb.
But then some originals are clearly better, like the original Super Monkey Balls on GameCube/ PS2. The remakes/ new ones just have horrible physics and I hate the new art style. The originals are far, far superior in every way. For whatever reason the developers are unwilling/unable to replicate the extremely satisfying handling and physics from the originals. So until that happens, the new ones are trash.
And then there’s remakes like Wind Waker HD which is imho clearly superior in every possible way to the original. Down to the redone/ orchestrated music. The amazing-looking cel shaded HD asset updates, the redone character models, the controls, etc. it’s impossible to go back to the GameCube version after the Wii U version, because something is just lost. The Wii U version is just quite literally… perfect. As long as you map the bow to the right trigger. Otherwise the controls require you to somehow grow a third thumb.
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TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
This runs at high framerate on the latest patch on PS5 & Pro
But PS2 version is a straight port - there's no remake or remaster in-sight. If we count these, the list gets... a LOT longer (like hundreds of titles longer).
I think more interesting comparison would be RE4:R, though I don't have an opinion on where it lands.
Anyway... On topic.
Dead Space
DS:R mild visual upgrades aren't nearly enough to make up for sweeping downgrades from mechanics (zero-G sections have been deflated of any tension original had) to narrative/characters (voice acting, chatterbox Isaac, and characters that no longer fit their narrative at all - like Nicole), to some of the main character designs (Isaac and Nicole most notably).
And no - the Asteroid section isn't actually better either - it actually exposes the worst weaknesses in enemy encounter design.
If DS:R is the only way you can experience the game - sure it's not the worst thing that could happen, but it is, ultimately just a pale imitation of the original.
Silent Hill HD Collection (All of them)
Enough said.
Silent Hill Shattered Memories
It's not technically a bad game, but for some reason it was branded as reimagining of SH1, and well... yea through that lens it just isn't very good. Again, on any platform.
Siren
This may be somewhat controversial - but PS3 remake was such a complete mess I don't know why it was even released. It literally runs at 10fps for large sections of the early game (with load times to match). I just couldn't figure out how that got past any QA, let alone on the shelves. I also couldn't stomach it long enough to actually compare more than intro sections of the game - but it's... really really bad.
Looking up - it's all horror games for some reason... huh what do you know.
If we include sequels - the list gets longer yet, but for high-profile recent releases, AW2 stands tall as going the wrong way (yea still on the horror bandwagon).
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Please read past the bullet point guys, y'all are making me legit sad now
Ok I missed that bit - but like I said, then the list really gets excessively long - as ports with 'enhancements' are so often broken/downgraded it's not even funny.Please read past the bullet point guys, y'all are making me legit sad now
Frankly it's probably better to ask which of those 'weren't' worse than original - as that list is much shorter.