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[MasterCornholio]

Probably, PC port beggers and Xbox fanboys.

Maybe or it could be the performance mode takes a huge hit to visuals. We will find out soon enough.

 

[Rea]

Maybe or it could be the performance mode takes a huge hit to visuals. We will find out soon enough.

Going by performance mode in Miles Morales, i don't think the difference will be this massive, like in this heavily tempered screenshot.

 

[Aenima]

Insomniac doing amazing work. Hopefully more studios start implementing the performance with RT modes as well. Not everyone has a 4k TV. Alot of ppl will be happy with a 1080p/ 60 fps with RT on mode.

 

[Dr Bass]

Going by performance mode in Miles Morales, i don't think the difference will be this massive, like in this heavily tempered screenshot.

Yeah but MM was also a cross gen game, and this one isn't. To ME it looks like this game is going way beyond what Spiderman MM was doing, so it would make sense the 60fps mode would take a bigger hit.

Again, just speculation, but it would not surprise me at all. In fact my personal thoughts were "This is going to look much worse in performance mode" after the state of play. It just seems logical, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that turning out to be the case.

 

[Hobbygaming]

Some pictures I've seen online, looks good tbh.

This looks unbelievable

 

[Kuranghi]

Oh man I forgot I preordered this, don't normally do that but this one looks ace beans.

I really hope it gives me A Crack in Time vibes, the Clank puzzles look good. I just need a nice analogue for the moons and I'll be happy as shit... oh wait and it would be perfect if they had the weapon upgrading system from 2: Going Commando, that was the BEST. The differences in the upgraded versions was really satisfying and then you got to upgrade the new version again in the NG+.

 

[Snowdonhoffen]

Yeah but MM was also a cross gen game, and this one isn't. To ME it looks like this game is going way beyond what Spiderman MM was doing, so it would make sense the 60fps mode would take a bigger hit.

Again, just speculation, but it would not surprise me at all. In fact my personal thoughts were "This is going to look much worse in performance mode" after the state of play. It just seems logical, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that turning out to be the case.

Yep, probably the Performance mode will take a bigger hit judging by the description: "This is an alternate version of the 60 frames per second "Performance RT" mode, additionally removing ray-tracing in favour of increased picture resolution."
And that mode already sacrifices some other stuff: "It presents a lower-resolution picture with adjusted lightning, VFX and scene density"

So in short, performance mode sacrifices RT, lightning, VFX (i.e. particles) and scene density (probably density in NPCs, and objects like plants and stuff like that). Wouldn't be surprised if people take that mode as "proof" of a downgrade.

 

[Kuranghi]

Yeah but MM was also a cross gen game, and this one isn't. To ME it looks like this game is going way beyond what Spiderman MM was doing, so it would make sense the 60fps mode would take a bigger hit.

Again, just speculation, but it would not surprise me at all. In fact my personal thoughts were "This is going to look much worse in performance mode" after the state of play. It just seems logical, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that turning out to be the case.

I'll definitely be playing in 30fps with RT unless the 60fps, non-RT mode is internally basically the same resolution without RT. I think it will still take a less than small hit to res though, unless the RT is a massive part of the render budget.

edit:

Yep, probably the Performance mode will take a bigger hit judging by the description: "This is an alternate version of the 60 frames per second "Performance RT" mode, additionally removing ray-tracing in favour of increased picture resolution."
And that mode already sacrifices some other stuff: "It presents a lower-resolution picture with adjusted lightning, VFX and scene density"

So in short, performance mode sacrifices RT, lightning, VFX (i.e. particles) and scene density (probably density in NPCs, and objects like plants and stuff like that). Wouldn't be surprised if people take that mode as "proof" of a downgrade.

Aha, well in that case I just won't even look at the 60fps mode, I just want to see the whole everything they created with no compromises on top of the general process of design, not into sacrificing any of that for 60fps. I'm not even going to "check just in case the 60 fps mode feels better", thats always a good one to me, of course its going to feel better haha. Well unless they fucked up, doubtful given the pedigree though.

Hopefully they will develop a custom sync solution for console (I'm probably way behind, maybe they already do this, I figured it was half-rate adaptive v-sync though to lower input lag) games running at 30fps thats similar to scanline-sync in RTSS. Its not perfect but its crazy amazing when it works, same input lag as v-sync off with no tearing or v-sync stutter and brilliant frametimes. If they can get that going on console people won't care as much about 30fps, input lag wise, I think 30fps scanline-syncd (33.33) actually has less lag than 60fps with triple buffering v-sync (16.67+16.67+16.67), but I'm not sure I have that right tbh.

 

[Rea]

Yeah but MM was also a cross gen game, and this one isn't. To ME it looks like this game is going way beyond what Spiderman MM was doing, so it would make sense the 60fps mode would take a bigger hit.

Again, just speculation, but it would not surprise me at all. In fact my personal thoughts were "This is going to look much worse in performance mode" after the state of play. It just seems logical, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that turning out to be the case.

I don't think that this game is much different to Miles Morales, arguably Miles Morales is more taxing due to an open world game design nature, this game is more linear game design. And I'm quite confident that Insomniac are using the same game engine as Miles Morale, just that this game has higher polygons models and higher quality post processing and whatnot.

 

[Dr Bass]

I don't think that this game is much different to Miles Morales, arguably Miles Morales is more taxing due to an open world game design nature, this game is more linear game design. And I'm quite confident that Insomniac are using the same game engine as Miles Morale, just that this game has higher polygons models and higher quality post processing and whatnot.

My guess could definitely be wrong. We will find out in a few days. I've already got mine pre-loaded and it's ready to go, so I am looking forward to it regardless of how performance mode turns out.

 

[Rea]

My guess could definitely be wrong. We will find out in a few days. I've already got mine pre-loaded and it's ready to go, so I am looking forward to it regardless of how performance mode turns out.

Me too, can't wait to enjoy this game. Gonna take it all in with the fidelity mode for 1st play through, then Rt performance mode for NG+.

 

[THEAP99]

 

[DeepEnigma]

Love it when they troll back at the drama queens.

 

[VFXVeteran]

The traffic and NPC density took a big hit in the performance RT version. the resolution didnt bother me that much, but you could tell there was a downgrade in visuals. I have no idea why things cant scale down 1:1 on the PS5 for a game that runs at native 4k 30 fps. Thats how it works on PCs. You reduce the resolution by half, you double your framerate. why do they have to reduce lighting, detail and NPCs just to hit 60 fps in RT mode? I dont know.

PC game settings for resolution/FPS aren't directly linear either. Some games depend more on resolution and some games depend on rendering techniques in 3D space for increased FPS. One of the things that makes games so resolution dependent is because a lot of rendering techniques are done in 2D screenspace - which directly depends on resolution. Every single deferred lighting technique depends on the depth buffer - which is a 2D buffer of z-values. From this, all lighting, texturing and shading happens. Then you have motionblur, bloom and post-FX that all happen in 2D space as well.

I would guess that R&C's GPU limits probably have to deal with 3D assets. RT is also not done in 2D space, so lowering the rays cast gives a performance boost. I'll know more when I get the game.

 

[VFXVeteran]

in-game cut scenes use the same exact assets and quality as gameplay dude. only difference is the lighting is more controlled obviously as it's a cut scene.

That's not true. Things like hair and skin are completely different shaders with more heavy approximation solutions - they happen to be the most expensive shaders. Furthermore, the lighting is the most expensive aspect of any rendering technique as it applies to every asset in the scene so it's changes are significant.

 

[Rea]

PC game settings for resolution/FPS aren't directly linear either. Some games depend more on resolution and some games depend on rendering techniques in 3D space for increased FPS. One of the things that makes games so resolution dependent is because a lot of rendering techniques are done in 2D screenspace - which directly depends on resolution. Every single deferred lighting technique depends on the depth buffer - which is a 2D buffer of z-values. From this, all lighting, texturing and shading happens. Then you have motionblur, bloom and post-FX that all happen in 2D space as well.

I would guess that R&C's GPU limits probably have to deal with 3D assets. RT is also not done in 2D space, so lowering the rays cast gives a performance boost. I'll know more when I get the game.

That's not true. Things like hair and skin are completely different shaders with more heavy approximation solutions - they happen to be the most expensive shaders. Furthermore, the lighting is the most expensive aspect of any rendering technique as it applies to every asset in the scene so it's changes are significant.

Thanks you for sharing your knowledge.

 

[StateofMajora]

They care about selling games, whether it's digital or physical, yes Sony would love if everyone only bought digital, no one can deny that. That said, it extremely unlikely a game developer would withhold the day1 patch in order to lessen the value of a the disk release as anyone with the disc can download the patch at any moment for the foreseeable future. The only case where the disc is losing it's value as you say is sometimes during a future gen (PS6~7) when they might stop providing the ability to download the patch but which is high unlikely part of their equation and reason for not including the patch on disc in the first place. Looking to lessen the disks value 7-10 years down the line sound like ridiculous scheme.

How ever I agree they should ideally release a finished game even on disk with all the modes and no bugs etc but most people have access to internet to download the patch and it's available day one. The only reason for this is project planing and release dates etc.

First off, Apologies for my rudeness.

Whether or not they held it back is besides the point and this is the same issue that's always been here with these day one patches ; why finish the game when we can print it now and sell copies much sooner. It was a bullshit practice at the start of this gen, and still is now. Besides that how come a launch game can have both modes on the disc and Ratchet can't? It all comes down to money of course, but if I had my way I would limit patches to how they were on Xbox 360 ; just a few megs for bug fixes. Obviously it would need to be more than 3 megs nowadays but yeah. I loved that system. I'm sure some publishers didn't, but it was good for us.

Eh, it is what it is I suppose, not going to stop me from playing the game. Still looks amazing, still Ratchet, still addictive.

 

[Dr Bass]

First off, Apologies for my rudeness.

Whether or not they held it back is besides the point and this is the same issue that's always been here with these day one patches ; why finish the game when we can print it now and sell copies much sooner. It was a bullshit practice at the start of this gen, and still is now. Besides that how come a launch game can have both modes on the disc and Ratchet can't? It all comes down to money of course, but if I had my way I would limit patches to how they were on Xbox 360 ; just a few megs for bug fixes. Obviously it would need to be more than 3 megs nowadays but yeah. I loved that system. I'm sure some publishers didn't, but it was good for us.

Eh, it is what it is I suppose, not going to stop me from playing the game. Still looks amazing, still Ratchet, still addictive.

Performance RT was added well after the launch of MM I believe.

A day 1 patch isn't shady at all ... it's literally day 1. All this talk of greed, developer laziness, etc, etc., belies such a huge amount of ignorance of what it takes to get this stuff done in a timely manner ... it's frankly insulting to the developers. They are busting their rears for you.

Also, the fact you can even buy these things on disc is still a miracle. Software is basically not delivered on disc anymore. In fact games is the only area that still does this off the top of my head. Any kind of desktop software, be it large or small is ALL delivered electronically, and most software (that earns money) is in a continual state of growth and development.

They had a gold/ship date they planned to meet, and the game is done and playable on disc. There is also a supplemental update to download. Just think of the disc as your re-sellable license, a luxury you do not have if you buy digital (like me). Being connected and up to date via the internet is an extremely simple feature that is a low bar to get over.

I honestly cannot understand the outrage. It is completely misplaced and misguided.

 

[nowhat]

Looking at some of the respondes some are claiming there's a massive downgrade.

I'm sure people will be comparing puddles with a magnifying glass soon enough.

 

[Hunnybun]

After playing Spiderman Miles in native 4k 30 fps, and in their performance RT mode at 1440p 60 fps version, I would not recommend the 60 fps version on the first playthrough.

The traffic and NPC density took a big hit in the performance RT version. the resolution didnt bother me that much, but you could tell there was a downgrade in visuals. I have no idea why things cant scale down 1:1 on the PS5 for a game that runs at native 4k 30 fps. Thats how it works on PCs. You reduce the resolution by half, you double your framerate. why do they have to reduce lighting, detail and NPCs just to hit 60 fps in RT mode? I dont know.

the regular 60 fps version is actually the version i'd recommend on NG+ or platinum playthroughs. Yes, it doesnt have RT but frankly the increased resolution and detail in Miles made it look much better than the Performance RT mode.

You're lucky if you can play Miles and think there's even a possibility that the fidelity mode is the way to play.

To my eyes it looks fucking atrocious, like some kind of seizure-inducing slideshow. The performance modes look fucking glorious in comparison.

I expect I'll find the same with Ratchet.

 

[Hunnybun]

Yeah but MM was also a cross gen game, and this one isn't. To ME it looks like this game is going way beyond what Spiderman MM was doing, so it would make sense the 60fps mode would take a bigger hit.

Again, just speculation, but it would not surprise me at all. In fact my personal thoughts were "This is going to look much worse in performance mode" after the state of play. It just seems logical, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that turning out to be the case.

I think any kind of significant downgrade is extremely unlikely after the developers themselves specifically stated that the adjustments are very minor and only in the most hectic scenes. It's one thing to stay silent and kind of lie by omission, but I seriously doubt they'd just tell outright lies a week away from launch. It wouldn't be worth it.

The downgrade will be to resolution and RT.

As an aside, are we now to assume, from the descriptions in the game, that fidelity mode basically runs in native 4k (maybe with minimal scaling)? That's what I've wanted to know for months.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Really wanting to pre order, but will keep my strong nerve and wait until we have feedback on the 60 FPS mode and reviews. That £70 RRP got me questioning every purchase now lol.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

After playing Spiderman Miles in native 4k 30 fps, and in their performance RT mode at 1440p 60 fps version, I would not recommend the 60 fps version on the first playthrough.

The traffic and NPC density took a big hit in the performance RT version. the resolution didnt bother me that much, but you could tell there was a downgrade in visuals. I have no idea why things cant scale down 1:1 on the PS5 for a game that runs at native 4k 30 fps. Thats how it works on PCs. You reduce the resolution by half, you double your framerate. why do they have to reduce lighting, detail and NPCs just to hit 60 fps in RT mode? I dont know.

the regular 60 fps version is actually the version i'd recommend on NG+ or platinum playthroughs. Yes, it doesnt have RT but frankly the increased resolution and detail in Miles made it look much better than the Performance RT mode.

disagree that 60 mode without rt looks better than 60 rt mode but agree that crowd lowered density is visible, I will probably play ratchet as miles in 30 rt mode, about scaling with resolution, still cpu usage is same, geometry is same and also rt on has some constant performance drop so that why decresing number of pixel by 2 will not increase fps 2x

 

[GymWolf]

Do we know what resolution the game use for the performance mode without rtx?! Is it 1440 checkboard? Or some dynamic shit?

 

[StateofMajora]

Performance RT was added well after the launch of MM I believe.

A day 1 patch isn't shady at all ... it's literally day 1. All this talk of greed, developer laziness, etc, etc., belies such a huge amount of ignorance of what it takes to get this stuff done in a timely manner ... it's frankly insulting to the developers. They are busting their rears for you.

Also, the fact you can even buy these things on disc is still a miracle. Software is basically not delivered on disc anymore. In fact games is the only area that still does this off the top of my head. Any kind of desktop software, be it large or small is ALL delivered electronically, and most software (that earns money) is in a continual state of growth and development.

They had a gold/ship date they planned to meet, and the game is done and playable on disc. There is also a supplemental update to download. Just think of the disc as your re-sellable license, a luxury you do not have if you buy digital (like me). Being connected and up to date via the internet is an extremely simple feature that is a low bar to get over.

I honestly cannot understand the outrage. It is completely misplaced and misguided.

Lol. They are selling a product, not doing charity work. It's not laziness but it is greed. We used to get more for our money and things were far better without having huge patches as an out. Your post is absolutely corporate apology.

Just bullshit. If they're still selling a product over the counter and not over the Internet, having Internet should never be a requirement unless it involves online play.

And I honestly cannot understand the corporate defense forces, but keep it coming I guess. Why worry about what you're buying when the poor publisher worked so hard for you LOL

Next you'll be telling me to be thankful they're not storming my house to reclaim their license...

 

[TrebleShot]

Lol. They are selling a product, not doing charity work. It's not laziness but it is greed. We used to get more for our money and things were far better without having huge patches as an out. Your post is absolutely corporate apology.

Just bullshit. If they're still selling a product over the counter and not over the Internet, having Internet should never be a requirement unless it involves online play.

And I honestly cannot understand the corporate defense forces, but keep it coming I guess. Why worry about what you're buying when the poor publisher worked so hard for you LOL

Next you'll be telling me to be thankful they're not storming my house to reclaim their license...

Strange this kind of thinking belongs in 1985.

We absolutely did not used to get more for our money. Higher fidelity means more work for any kind of production. Attention to detail is amplified as is time to deliver said products and services.

The cost of development doesn’t go down neither does the time to do it, it only goes UP.

To balance this the prices have admittedly gone up now but also the technology allows the process to continue far beyond what used to happen with traditional development and a master being printed to disc weeks if not a month in advance to allow distribution to take effect.
Technology has allowed for the dev process to happen all the way up until launch hour and the product can be improved beyond that.

None of these practises exist to screw you over nor does it provide more finances to the development team or production company.

You can still buy your game on disc until your hearts content and resell as much as you want. If you are upset about connecting your console to the internet to gain updates, don’t do it but your only missing out.

I’d also question why you are buying a gaming console that has a heavy online focus in the first place. That’s not changing any time soon so may as well get used to it.

 

[StateofMajora]

Strange this kind of thinking belongs in 1985.

We absolutely did not used to get more for our money. Higher fidelity means more work for any kind of production. Attention to detail is amplified as is time to deliver said products and services.

The cost of development doesn’t go down neither does the time to do it, it only goes UP.

To balance this the prices have admittedly gone up now but also the technology allows the process to continue far beyond what used to happen with traditional development and a master being printed to disc weeks if not a month in advance to allow distribution to take effect.
Technology has allowed for the dev process to happen all the way up until launch hour and the product can be improved beyond that.

None of these practises exist to screw you over nor does it provide more finances to the development team or production company.

You can still buy your game on disc until your hearts content and resell as much as you want. If you are upset about connecting your console to the internet to gain updates, don’t do it but your only missing out.

I’d also question why you are buying a gaming console that has a heavy online focus in the first place. That’s not changing any time soon so may as well get used to it.

Sigh. Bet you love them tv firmware updates huh? Great that they can release hardware with issues and fix them later. We should be thankful!

Shinier graphics is not getting more for your money and tools have only gotten easier and more robust. The amount of chapped rears in this thread is astonishing. I get it people, you fight for corporations for free.

Yeah man, expecting a physical good to work day 1 is so 1985. I'm out of here.

 

[TrebleShot]

Sigh. Bet you love them tv firmware updates huh? Great that they can release hardware with issues and fix them later. We should be thankful!

Shinier graphics is not getting more for your money and tools have only gotten easier and more robust. The amount of chapped rears in this thread is astonishing. I get it people, you fight for corporations for free.

Yeah man, expecting a physical good to work day 1 is so 1985. I'm out of here.

So your points are...

- Being able to improve a product post release is a bad thing.
- Shinier graphics doesn't require any more effort, just plug it in and off we go.
- Software is a physical good.

Got it bro.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Haters stay hating, they will always find something to hate.

 

[Hunnybun]

Do we know what resolution the game use for the performance mode without rtx?! Is it 1440 checkboard? Or some dynamic shit?

If it's the same as Miles then it'll be around 1600p reconstructed to 4k.

But Miles was native 4k30, and we still don't know for sure that Ratchet is also that.

My bet going from the visual quality is on something like this:

Fidelity: 1800p
Performance: 1440p
Performance RT: 1200p or so

 

[SafeOrAlone]

I'll never buy a launch-day game on disc again.

I mean, I know that isn't rare. And I hardly buy physical anymore anyway, but the point is, I want the things I buy to last a damn long time. I want to know that if I insert that disc into a console, a decade from now, it's going to be in tip-top form.

So now, if a game does well enough to release a "Game of the Year" edition, with all the patches on disc, I will potentially pick that up for the collection. Bums me out though.

 

[mejin]

Reviews tomorrow. Can't wait for all the impressions. All the options available day one is a huge improvement for the series.

MS well paid journalist Jeff Grudge convinced his boss to review the game. Just FYI.

Haters stay hating, they will always find something to hate.

If you build it, they will come.

 

[SlimySnake]

You're lucky if you can play Miles and think there's even a possibility that the fidelity mode is the way to play.

To my eyes it looks fucking atrocious, like some kind of seizure-inducing slideshow. The performance modes look fucking glorious in comparison.

I expect I'll find the same with Ratchet.

TBH, the key is to NEVER switch. Miles also felt like a slideshow the moment I played around with the settings especially when it was snowing. I was like wtf. But after 15-20 minutes it felt playable and after an hour or so I didnt even notice.

What I did notice were those amazing ray traced reflections in every story mission in the game. Not so much in the open world.

disagree that 60 mode without rt looks better than 60 rt mode but agree that crowd lowered density is visible, I will probably play ratchet as miles in 30 rt mode, about scaling with resolution, still cpu usage is same, geometry is same and also rt on has some constant performance drop so that why decresing number of pixel by 2 will not increase fps 2x

Right, but on my 2080, decreasing resolution by half always gives me 2x the framerate even in rt heavy games like control and metro. I think there is a bottleneck in the PS5 when it comes to rt hardware. It is not scaling down properly even if they change the resolution of rt reflections from 1080p to 720p which is a 2x downgrade in rt reflection resolution. They shouldnt have to change lighting, crowd density and other vfx.

 

[Synless]

Switching from 60 to 30 is the worst thing you can ever do. When Last of Us Remastered came out I played on 30 for a bit with no issues, switched to 60 for a while to give it a shot and then switched back to 30. I couldn’t believe my eyes, it felt worse than the PS3 version for about 10-15 minutes, then I adjusted to it again. Nothing like when I started it in 30 and played it that way. Miles Morales was the same way.

 

[MasterCornholio]

Reviews tomorrow. Can't wait for all the impressions. All the options available day one is a huge improvement for the series.

MS well paid journalist Jeff Grudge convinced his boss to review the game. Just FYI.



If you build it, they will come.

I hope the hands off previews doesn't indicate any nasty surprises. That seemed a little weird to me but I'm sure it will be fine.

As for Grubb there's no way to fix that.

 

[JeloSWE]

Sigh. Bet you love them tv firmware updates huh? Great that they can release hardware with issues and fix them later. We should be thankful!

Shinier graphics is not getting more for your money and tools have only gotten easier and more robust. The amount of chapped rears in this thread is astonishing. I get it people, you fight for corporations for free.

Yeah man, expecting a physical good to work day 1 is so 1985. I'm out of here.

I work with games, I make graphics and effects for a living and I make a huge effort to deliver the best kind of experience possible within the allotted time of the project. If I have a chance to further improve the product after is considered release ready I'll do it. Rarely is it possible to do everything you whish, I bet ALL games have cut content and made compromises due to time and man power constraints. Being given a bit of extra time is ALWAYS welcome. It's not that I don't agree with you that a final product should be in a great state and that the ability to patch things later allows some developers and publishers to push out unfinished products, but at least it's possible to fix their sh*t later rather than not at all.

Your accusations come of very conspiratorial with a hint of persecution mania . Yes there are corrupt greedy lying companies, at least the business side of it can be but most actual developers are really honest hard working people that love their craft and care about their creation like their own baby. Most companies aren't out to get you, most actual developers aren't greedy, that's not why they got into the field and the practice of patches are mostly a great thing.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

TBH, the key is to NEVER switch. Miles also felt like a slideshow the moment I played around with the settings especially when it was snowing. I was like wtf. But after 15-20 minutes it felt playable and after an hour or so I didnt even notice.

What I did notice were those amazing ray traced reflections in every story mission in the game. Not so much in the open world.

Right, but on my 2080, decreasing resolution by half always gives me 2x the framerate even in rt heavy games like control and metro. I think there is a bottleneck in the PS5 when it comes to rt hardware. It is not scaling down properly even if they change the resolution of rt reflections from 1080p to 720p which is a 2x downgrade in rt reflection resolution. They shouldnt have to change lighting, crowd density and other vfx.

I vastly prefer Performdmce RT in miles

the crowd density and extra pop in is not a big deal at all, I hardly notice it

 

[Hunnybun]

TBH, the key is to NEVER switch. Miles also felt like a slideshow the moment I played around with the settings especially when it was snowing. I was like wtf. But after 15-20 minutes it felt playable and after an hour or so I didnt even notice.

What I did notice were those amazing ray traced reflections in every story mission in the game. Not so much in the open world.

Right, but on my 2080, decreasing resolution by half always gives me 2x the framerate even in rt heavy games like control and metro. I think there is a bottleneck in the PS5 when it comes to rt hardware. It is not scaling down properly even if they change the resolution of rt reflections from 1080p to 720p which is a 2x downgrade in rt reflection resolution. They shouldnt have to change lighting, crowd density and other vfx.

The same was true in Demon's Souls as well tbf, and that had zero RT. They cut they resolution by more than half AND reduced some graphics settings just to get 60fps. It's a bit weird.

As for not switching to 60 in the first place, it wouldn't really solve the problem because if I'm used to 30 then the wonderful benefit of 60 is all the more apparent.

Whichever way I cut it, I just seem to find the visual benefit of 60 WAAAY bigger than RT or 4k.

 

[THEAP99]

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah it's almost DRM without saying DRM

Not even close.

 

[Gordon Freeman]

I hope Digital Foundry’s tech review goes up when the embargo lifts tomorrow!

 

[Gordon Freeman]

Not even close.

It definitely isn’t intended to be DRM but has some of the same side effects.

The bigger issue is that we are paying $10 more for games from Sony but still we are getting unfinished builds on disc, day one patches and all that.

None of that should be the case if we are paying $10 more for development costs going up. Oh wait it’s because of greed…



We should not be seeing Tweets like this from developers at Insomniac begging us to patch due to bugs and such when paying $10 more for games. On disc build is more buggy, doesn’t perform as well, is missing performance options, missing a neat thing they added content wise and more. Once again proving the $10 increase is just for greed.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

The same was true in Demon's Souls as well tbf, and that had zero RT. They cut they resolution by more than half AND reduced some graphics settings just to get 60fps. It's a bit weird.

As for not switching to 60 in the first place, it wouldn't really solve the problem because if I'm used to 30 then the wonderful benefit of 60 is all the more apparent.

Whichever way I cut it, I just seem to find the visual benefit of 60 WAAAY bigger than RT or 4k.

is DS really half the resolution at 60fps?

I have a 65 inch TV and can’t tell a difference in resolution at all

the 60fps over 30fps is immediately apparent

 

[mckmas8808]

It definitely isn’t intended to be DRM but has some of the same side effects.

The bigger issue is that we are paying $10 more for games from Sony but still we are getting unfinished builds on disc, day one patches and all that.

None of that should be the case if we are paying $10 more for development costs going up. Oh wait it’s because of greed…



We should not be seeing Tweets like this from developers at Insomniac begging us to patch due to bugs and such when paying $10 more for games. On disc build is more buggy, doesn’t perform as well, is missing performance options, missing a neat thing they added content wise and more. Once again proving the $10 increase is just for greed.

We aren't getting unfinished builds. There's no way to get around day one patches. It's not humanly possible.

 

[SlimySnake]

The same was true in Demon's Souls as well tbf, and that had zero RT. They cut they resolution by more than half AND reduced some graphics settings just to get 60fps. It's a bit weird.

As for not switching to 60 in the first place, it wouldn't really solve the problem because if I'm used to 30 then the wonderful benefit of 60 is all the more apparent.

Whichever way I cut it, I just seem to find the visual benefit of 60 WAAAY bigger than RT or 4k.

Nah, Demon Souls was fairly identical. 1440p vs native 4k is basically considered half. Yes, it's a little less than the 4.1 million pixels but its basically half. Just like how 720p is considered half of 1080p even though in reality, it's a little less than half. (900k vs 1,050k pixels which would be half of the 2.1 million pixels of 1080p)

You got some better tesselation but thats about it. Everything from the lighting quality to screen density remained the same. You never felt like you were getting a downgraded version.

adjusted lightning, VFX and scene density.

I can see VFX like tessellation being downgraded a bit but lighting and scene density?? That is way too big of a downgrade.

 

[elliot5]

is DS really half the resolution at 60fps?

I have a 65 inch TV and can’t tell a difference in resolution at all

the 60fps over 30fps is immediately apparent

its 1440p upscaled to 4k at 60 fps mode on DeS. It was designed for 60 fps first and foremost. The graphical effects for the 4k30 mode are hardly noticable. Definitely not worth the tradeoff

 

[Gordon Freeman]

We aren't getting unfinished builds. There's no way to get around day one patches. It's not humanly possible.

If the only basis is greed over finishing a game first then sure. Otherwise it is absolutely humanly possible to have a finished on disc build that isn’t missing content and performance modes. They just choose not to. Just delay the game to July and have it done.

The notion that disc builds shouldn’t be and can’t be complete is egregious.

 

[hoplie]

Just delay the game to July and have it done.

So you expect this to be the last patch of the game?

 

[GymWolf]

Finally people are starting to understand that 60 fps are a much bigger deal than any rtx effect, better late than never.

 

[Salz01]

I’m kind of wondering how big, the game is. How much replay it’ll have.