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Batman v. Superman RT Thread: like standing ovations in rain

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B33

Banned
I'm guessing you're young or just not that familiar with the comics.

Denny O'Neil and Neal Adams successfully ditched the camp a decade earlier than DKR. Miller's work on that mini-series, Batman: Year One, DD, and Wolverine is some of the best ever in terms of mainstream heroes (not to mention Sin City, Washington, etc.).

But when it comes to movies?

The dude's output has pretty consistently been shit. I think that's what he was getting at there. Totally fair.

Well said.

Frank Miller didn't "save" Batman.
 

Sephzilla

Member
I think you're probably exaggerating the weight his later work holds compared to the influence his earlier stuff still has.

Probably, but I really don't like a lot of his post-TDKR stuff. ASBAR was awful. I'm also a little salty with Miller because "Frank Millers RoboCop" was the absolute drizzling shits.
 

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
nope, because we'll see people jump all over them again for Civil War regardless of whether the film is good or not.

Lest Civil was is coming off a series that has been mostly well received.

Batman vs Superman is coming off a poorly received Superman film, and is rebooting Batman shortly after a very popular film series concluded.
 
Marvel first impressions are right tho

Age of Ultron was glowing wasn't it?

Fans are too high on the hype of these things

And fuck no I hope Disney never gets their hands on dc. I'd settle for a one time justice League and avengers movie tho years down the line but that's about it
 

Screaming Meat

Unconfirmed Member
Probably, but I really don't like a lot of his post-TDKR stuff. ASBAR was awful. I'm also a little salty with Miller because "Frank Millers RoboCop" was the absolute drizzling shits.

I ain't gonna argue with that. :)

...though I thought ASBAR was pretty funny.

If anything he ruined him, since now Batman is expected to be Omniscient and capable of beating God if he has enough "Prep Time."

That isn't squarely on Miller. That's more a side effect of Morrison's 'Bat-God'. Miller's lasting legacy is the grit.

Well said.

Frank Miller didn't "save" Batman.

He certainly changed mainstream perception of the character which was tied to Adam West's camp portrayal for two decades.
 

Flavius

Member
You would be incorrect on both fronts (a little bit rude/presumptuous too, if I may say). I was referring to mainstream perception of the character. Denny and Neal didn't have that wide an appeal outside of comics.

Sorry that you feel I was being rude. You seemed slighted by his comments, but seemingly ignorant of Miller's history in Hollywood.

It hasn't been good.
 

Rooster12

Member
Is that the same Frank Miller who pretty much saved Batman from forever being associated with the camp 60s show and wrote what many consider to be two of the defining comics - not only about that particular character - but of the medium itself? That Frank Miller? ;)

Pre-crisis Batman is one of the best comic characters ever created (and no, I'm not talking about the Adam West crap).
 
Marvel at least seems to take feedback to heart even if they don't always stick the landing. IM2 was too samey and concerned with set up so they got Shane Black to create a independent Tony Stark movie. Thor TDW is mediocre and they recognize that and have said they want Ragnarok to do for the character what Winter Soldier did for Cap. Avengers was too fluffy so AoU had more serious character moments and dramatic/philosophical beats. The end of the world story is overdone so they made Ant-Man a compact story about fathers and their daughters. I'm not saying they always fix their problems or ignoring the fact that they frequently create new issues for themselves but at least they're clearly trying.

BvS sounds like they doubled down on the MoS criticisms as well as creating brand new problems.
8FxEa.gif


The only character moment that you could give 2 shits about was the one the director fought tooth and nail to add, and then had to include random Thor scene because that was the ultimatum set on the movie. Marvel has its shtick and it works well but all those movies follow almost the exact same formula. All look like they were made from a suit checklist on things that worked on Ironman 1. Other than Winter Solider, but that movie was amazing. Don't try to sell me this bridge shit with Marvel being new evolving and different, c'mon now :\ But one thing I can rely on Marvel is that their worst movie won't make me wish I hadn't went to the theater, they're always at least a fun 1 time watch. Always. DC I fear everything they do. -_-

WB picked Snyder who isn't living up to the man to lead that they expected since the guy knows how to direct action and visually speaking is a monster. Problem is pacing and storytelling, which he isn't good at. I haven't seen BvS yet but this seems to be the problem. MoS also had poor mistakes in the writing room. If they picked a different director and writing team before MoS, we might be having a different talk. Snyder who I already said is not a good storyteller since he's the leader, he might be the one pulling everything together from all the movies in the WB world.. and fans of CMB are fucked if that's the case.. at least the ones that want to see great DC movies.
 

guek

Banned
Age of Ultron was glowing wasn't it?

Fans are too high on the hype of these things

And fuck no I hope Disney never gets their hands on dc. I'd settle for a one time justice League and avengers movie tho years down the line but that's about it
The first Twitter reactions were positive but also hinted at some of the movie's problems.
 

Briarios

Member
I'm baffled by people that are cancelling their plans to see a movie based on reviews.

The same people who thought AoU was going to be great and bought tickets ended up hating it after seeing it. How is this any different?

If you were wanting to see it before yesterday, you shouldn't change your plans. See it for yourself. If anything, you may like it more because of the expectations being in check instead of expecting the movie of the year.

There are a lot of entertainment options out there. If I take my wife to a movie and dinner, we're talking $80 or so. For those of us with a budget, that's a big deal. So, yeah, reviews matter. I'd rather take her to a night she will definitely enjoy and rent the movie in a few months then chance a waste of an evening.
 

Ahasverus

Member
8FxEa.gif


The only character moment that you could give 2 shits about was the one the director fought tooth and nail to add, and then had to include random Thor scene because that was the ultimatum set on the movie. Marvel has its shtick and it works well but all those movies follow almost the exact same formula. .
To be fair, with Perlmutter and his design comitee out, the MCU is probably going to be amazing from CW on.
 

Playsage

Member
You guys really want George Miller to direct Justice League? Seriously? What did he do to you?
Let the man work on his own franchise, FFS.
.
 

trikster40

Member
All are bad. They are way to cheesy for me.
Flash is superb. Arrow started strong, faltered a little in season 3, but 4 is great.

Supergirl IS super cheesy. It's weird. I think Flash and Arrow are more suited for CBS while Supergirl is definitely a CW type of show. Ugh, so cheesy.
 

inky

Member
Age of Ultron was glowing wasn't it?

Fans are too high on the hype of these things

And fuck no I hope Disney never gets their hands on dc. I'd settle for a one time justice League and avengers movie tho years down the line but that's about it

Too high on the hype and too quick to call something shit too.
 
We have different opinions on what's good or bad. That's been established plenty. Personally I think ultron is pretty bad in its own way. My worst theater experience last year (that doesn't mean worst movie of the year so calm down before anybody bites. But the worst I saw last year? Yah)

I'd rank it below man of Steel personally
 

GreekWolf

Member
Disney: On second thought, we'll take Superman and Batman (plus villains) off your hands. You can keep Cyborg. Thx.

Actually, I'd be genuinely excited to see what they could do with Batman/Superman. I have a sneaky suspicion it would be more like Tim Burton's Gotham but dialed back a few notches.
 

Sephzilla

Member
8FxEa.gif


The only character moment that you could give 2 shits about was the one the director fought tooth and nail to add, and then had to include random Thor scene because that was the ultimatum set on the movie. Marvel has its shtick and it works well but all those movies follow almost the exact same formula. All look like they were made from a suit checklist on things that worked on Ironman 1. Other than Winter Solider, but that movie was amazing.

I'm not sure I could agree with this, entirely. Iron Man 1, Winter Soldier, and Guardians of the Galaxy feel like three fairly different movies to me. I feel like a bunch of them follow a similar checklist to Iron Man 1 but are tonally more like Iron Man 2. The original Iron Man, at least to me, still feels a bit different from the rest of the MCU.
 

jwick

Unconfirmed Member
I'm baffled by people that are cancelling their plans to see a movie based on reviews.

The same people who thought AoU was going to be great and bought tickets ended up hating it after seeing it. How is this any different?

If you were wanting to see it before yesterday, you shouldn't change your plans. See it for yourself. If anything, you may like it more because of the expectations being in check instead of expecting the movie of the year.

Been waiting 3 years for this, and had IMAX/3D tickets pre-purchased. It just doesn't justify the time/cost given the general consensus in the majority of reviews. I'll see it down the line, probably as a matinee or on HV but to me it clearly isn't worth my initial hype. There are other options for entertainment and they all seem better than spending ~3 hours on opening night watching this.
 

Ahasverus

Member
Can you elaborate mate, I'm ignorant on whose who on the management front.
Isaac Perlmutter is the cheap, mega cheap, ultra cheap CEO of Marvel comics, who, along with his design comitee, was responsible for the vanillization of the MCU due to his profit ambitions. He and his comitee are gone since Marvel studios was separated from Marvel Comics.
Doctor Strange could be a steaming pile of shit for all we know. We'll have to wait to see how their next three films are before we can jump with joy.
With such cast? That's unpossible.
 
It never ceases to amaze me that, even with hundreds of millions of dollars at play, they can't find a way to manufacture a satisfying, functional story in so many of these blockbuster movies. These massive projects, and yet they can't find the right words in the right order.

It's especially strange when you're dealing with characters that have such long histories. There are literally thousands of stories with these characters to work from.
 
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