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Kadokawa confirms Sony sent an acquisition letter

Apart for very lore specific things, they're the exact same game franchise. There's nothing in Dark Souls worth giving Bandai Namco publishing or licensing rights over just calling a game Demon's Souls and paying them nothing.

No, there are some mechanical differences aside from lore, like how Estus Flasks work vs. the healing grass from Demon's Souls. A lot of the difference (which ones are present) are small in nature but do present some points of divergence between Demon's Souls and Dark Souls.

There are videos like this which go into some of the not-strictly-lore differences between them. You should probably also check out places like this which go into differences as well.

It would be like Harmonix making a Guitar Hero game instead of Rockband just to pay Activision a cut.

But it's different if Activision (well, now MS Gaming) went to Harmonix and paid them to develop a Rock Band game, now is it?

Sony doesn't need Bandai Namco funding.

Yes, they don't need it. But if Bandai Namco were willing to offer them money to develop a game (or co-develop one) through one of their studios in return for Bandai Namco publishing it, I could see Sony or even SIE being okay with that, depending on the game and what studio.

You live in a fantasy world. It's not as if Bandai Namco hasn't worked with Sony's competitors in the past. Hell they made an arcade board around the Gamecube. They've actually developed quite a few titles for Nintendo directly. It's nothing personal. It's just business opportunities.

I didn't say anything different? Why are you so strongly against the idea that Sony & SIE might be okay with letting From Software develop a new Dark Souls that Bandai Namco goes on to publish? It's a publisher-to-publisher thing at that point and not much different than when SEGA lent Nintendo IP rights to Bayonetta.

Except here, it's not anyone lending IP rights to Dark Souls; it's SIE lending From Software to Bandai Namco for development (solely From, or co-development maybe with some Bandai Namco studio) of a new Dark Souls and Bandai Namco paying Sony & SIE money to allow it.

Like you said, just business opportunities.

You're not hurting relations by buying a company and focusing that company to make your games and not others.

Didn't say or imply that, either. I'm just saying, in the off-chance SIE and/or Sony decided to greenlight a new Dark Souls, if for example because Miyazaki & From Software wanted to make a new one, then they'd work out a deal with Bandai Namco since they're the ones who own the publishing rights (and full IP rights IIRC) to Dark Souls.

And that deal would likely be Bandai Namco paying SIE and/or Sony Corp to cover costs for From Software to make the game, while Bandai Namco retain publishing rights. If that means From Software making PC and Xbox versions, then Bandai Namco would pay the required amount for those versions, and they'd be the ones responsible for marketing the game (tho that is where I'd see SIE putting clauses to prevent, say, Microsoft, from doing a Game Pass deal or pushing Western marketing that omits PlayStation from being mentioned). SIE'd probably also get right to first refusal on any marketing deal with that Dark Souls game so should it get made, even if it's multiplatform.

On the other hand, IF From Software want to make a new Demon's Souls instead, well, Bandai Namco doesn't matter in that scenario since they don't own any of the IP rights. SIE and From Software could do whatever they want with a new Demon's Souls, including (and would be smart of them to do) make it exclusive to their console and (if it happens) their own PC launcher.

Insomniac made a few multiplatform games. 3 games appearing on Xbox. Based on your logic, they should let Insomniac keep working with EA.

A whopping 3 games out of their entire catalog of titles doesn't mean they were associated as a multiplatform studio. And the only one out of that stint anyone remembers is Sunset Overdrive. Fuse came and went; no one really remembers it. Edge of Nowhere? Slow Down, Bull?(?) No offense I had to look these up but not ashamed because 99.9% of everyone else doesn't remember those titles. Oddball early releases of theirs like Disruptor are much more well-known than all of multiplatform stuff they pushed, easily.

But as to your question, yes IF Insomniac showed an interest in working on some EA IP and SIE could afford a team to do it without sacrificing work capacity on some game they wanted Insomniac on like Spiderman...they yes, why not let them work with EA? But that's just the point: it'd have to be an IP EA own the rights to! You're not listening to that part. If it's a brand new IP, then EA has no place in the picture. That'd be 100% Insomniac & SIE. If it's an IP Insomniac have but EA don't have publishing rights ownership of...then EA is a non-factor. Again, that just becomes wholly an Insomniac & SIE thing.

It's the exact same here with From Software hence why I've been stressing IP like Demon's Souls, King's Field, Echo Night, Evergrace etc. Bandai Namco have no ownership over any of those IP and what's more, none of them really have any history outside of PlayStation systems. So they'd be 100% between Sony/SIE & From Software and, ideally, exclusive to PlayStation consoles and some hypothetical PS PC launcher if that ever happens.

However something like Dark Souls is different because Bandai Namco own the publishing rights, and there's a chance From Software might want to keep it and Demon's Souls divergent or even more divergent in the future from a mechanics & lore POV. So either Sony buys out the publishing rights for Dark Souls, or they partner with Bandai Namco and let them publish future Dark Souls games. The only way I see Sony buying the publishing rights for Dark Souls is both if From Software don't want to return to Demon's Souls AND SIE want to make future Dark Souls games exclusive to their console & (hypothetical) launcher. The likelihood SIE drop Steam for future Elden Ring games is 0%; those are going to be on Steam Day 1 just like the first game. Likelihood they drop Xbox versions of future Elden Ring games is 50% but I still think they might keep them there, just maybe they aren't Day 1 releases on Xbox anymore and come a year later? Who knows.

That all said I don't think SIE would want to deal with the messiness of making Dark Souls exclusive in any way to their console, so they'll probably let Bandai Namco retain publishing rights to it so if From Software decide they want to make a new Dark Souls, Bandai Namco pays SIE to have From develop it in a co-funding partnership, From develop the different versions, and Bandai Namco publishes them. I could see SIE agreeing to co-fund or fully fund the PlayStation version of a future Dark Souls game in return for getting publishing rights to the PlayStation version of that game, while Bandai Namco retain publishing rights to the Xbox & Steam versions and, again, stipulating that Bandai Namco can't do a Game Pass deal with Microsoft on it (both console & PC) or worm around with other loopholes.

Dark Souls is a dead franchise that Miyazaki moved on from. There is no new lore or story to write there, and no specific game idea exclusive to that series. There is a reason From bought Elden Ring from Bamco and not Dark Souls. They don't have any use for it since for all practical purposes, Elden Ring is the new Dark Souls (which itself was just a Demons Souls ripoff due to the Sony copyright). What would From Software make in Dark Souls 4 that they couldn't make in Elden Ring 2?

I agree in concept, which would also suggest that Bandai Namco would have nowhere near a problem with Sony buying Kadokawa as some people are trying to say. After all, if that were such an issue for them...why sell the Elden Ring IP rights back to From Software to begin with?

Even if From Software were going to go fully independent, it'd mean them acting as their own publisher with that IP, so Bandai Namco are still out of the loop going forward with Elden Ring. They had to of foreseen the likelihood of Kadokawa & From Software getting acquired down the line, but choosing to sell the ER IP rights anyway indicates to me that they were fine with that possibility.
 
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It did.

We all enjoyed playing it on PS4. 8 million of us.

Should have bought one. Cheaper than a basic PC.

It kinda did. Sold 8m copies.

Dark Souls as a whole including the remasters sold 30m in comparison.

Sure, I also enjoyed it when it came out.

But today, I would like to re-experience it with better fidelity and no framerate issues, that everyone complained even back then, natively without resorting to emulation.

If you are fine with games being stuck in past hardware where they wouldn't run as good as they, in my opinion, should, fine by me. But I'm not and unfortunately the list just keeps growing ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Muddy

Member
Sure, I also enjoyed it when it came out.

But today, I would like to re-experience it with better fidelity and no framerate issues, that everyone complained even back then, natively without resorting to emulation.

If you are fine with games being stuck in past hardware where they wouldn't run as good as they, in my opinion, should, fine by me. But I'm not and unfortunately the list just keeps growing ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Why blame exclusivity or Sony for that?

Didn’t Sony remake Demons Souls?

Patience.

Bloodborne remake will also come in the future.
 

Mibu no ookami

Demoted Member® Pro™
Why blame exclusivity or Sony for that?

Didn’t Sony remake Demons Souls?

Patience.

Bloodborne remake will also come in the future.

It's so interesting to see the animosity people have for Sony and remasters/remakes but for so many online to be beginning for Bloodborne on PS5 and PC.

Bloodborne came out in 2015, it sold 8 million units. Sony will get to remastering or remaking Bloodborne, but games aren't made via magic. It requires people.

You have two active candidates to do this work; Bluepoint or Nixxes, both have been pretty busy. For all we know Bluepoint has been working on remastering Bloodborne or maybe its their next project.

There's really not a game that Nixxes has focused on that sold significantly worse than Bloodborne. You could make argue Rift Apart, but you can see why they would do Rift Apart rather than Bloodborne. Rift Apart was a simple port job on tech they'd already become acquainted with by doing the other Insomniac games.

We know that Nixxes is finalizing Spider-Man 2's release on PC for January and then likely their focus would be on TLOUP2 for PC. After that who knows they could be involved in a God of War 2018 remaster, but outside of that there is really only Day's Gone (for remasters) that might get prioritized over Bloodborne. They could also focus on porting Demon's Souls or Gran Turismo 7 to PC before Ghost of Yotei.

You can tell just based off of what's available for them to work on how jampacked their schedule probably is.


I will say, if Bluepoint is working on an original game, it's likely a mistake.
 
nkHVOX0.jpeg


this is why (if you look at my post history in the ABK thread) i have always support acquisitions because they make my favorite company better than the other.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
nkHVOX0.jpeg


this is why (if you look at my post history in the ABK thread) i have always support acquisitions because they make my favorite company better than the other.
Arrowhead is a given considering you get the 'PlayStation Studios' intro in the game like they do in all their first party studio titles.
 

nial

Member
I haven't yet seen any convincing argument against SIE owning From Software outside of the obvious exclusivity aspect.
There's probably already a PlayStation Studios × From Software collab in the works, and it wouldn't surprise me to see Saito Edward acting as a producer just like he did with Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade (and he was involved in Demon's Souls 2020 to boot).
 
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Mr Moose

Member
that's is what a lot of people are praying right now.

"pleas be fake, please be fake, please be fake"

Kodokawa make sense beyond FromSoftware.

Arrowhead will eventually be acquired. 100% guarantee.
They are pretending to be ex-Sony, I've found no proof of it. They also live in two different places and can't spell Smith.
Pic matches this user from 2010:
No Alex Smith listed under the credits of Syphon Filter or Kena: Bridge of Spirits.
Guy is a fraud.

I do agree with the second half of your comment though.
 
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They are pretending to be ex-Sony, I've found no proof of it. They also live in two different places and can't spell Smith.

I do agree with the second half of your comment though.
It's similar to when Xbox influencers where saying that Helldivers 2 was in talks to release on Xbox and there will be an announcement soon:

an "educated" guess based (hopium), and the ongoing events but framed as a leak.
 

Varteras

Member
nkHVOX0.jpeg


this is why (if you look at my post history in the ABK thread) i have always support acquisitions because they make my favorite company better than the other.

I don't believe this guy knows anything. That being said, an Arrowhead acquisition shouldn't surprise anyone. That's a long running relationship with a studio that knows how to make multiplayer games and made a big hit with their recent one. Plus, Sony owns the IP that put them on the map.
 

Ebrietas

Member
There was that riddle tweet from years ago that hasn't revealed anything yetbut people assumed had a clue about bloodborne
No riddle. Hulst blatantly confirmed it in an interview. And even if he didn’t mention it there is this:

PS3 demons souls
PS4 bloodborne
PSVR deracine
PS5 ???

Seems to be tradition with every new platform.
 
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Perrott

Member
I haven't yet seen any convincing argument against SIE owning From Software outside of the obvious exclusivity aspect.
There's probably already a PlayStation Studios × From Software collab in the works, and it wouldn't surprise me to see Saito Edward acting as a producer just like he did with Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade (and he was involved in Demon's Souls 2020 to boot).
And even then, the idea of a FromSoftware fan who doesn't already own a PlayStation console is an absurd, borderline non-existent concept. How could there be a hardcore enjoyer of Dark Souls, Sekiro or Elden Ring that hasn't even bothered in getting a Sony console to enjoy Bloodborne or Demon's Souls over the past ten and fifteen years, respectively?

That's like being an Xbox 360 owner in the mid 2000s and bitching about Metal Gear Solid 4 being a PS3 exclusive. Like, what the fuck was anyone doing with an Xbox 360 back then if they claimed to care about historically PlayStation-adjacent series such as Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, Yakuza or Persona? Do Nintendo enthusiasts really get their Switch consoles in hopes of playing the latest Rockstar Games releases? No? Then going by that same logic, anyone even remotely interested in FromSoftware's modern output should do themselves a favor a get a PS5 now that they're on sale.
 

FrankWza

Gold Member
No riddle. Hulst blatantly confirmed it in an interview. And even if he didn’t mention it there is this:

PS3 demons souls
PS4 bloodborne
PSVR deracine
PS5 ???

Seems to be tradition with every new platform.
Yeah but there was an actual riddle tweet from I think BluePoint and the speculation was they were doing something related to Bloodborne or From
 

Orbital2060

Member
I haven't yet seen any convincing argument against SIE owning From Software outside of the obvious exclusivity aspect.
There's probably already a PlayStation Studios × From Software collab in the works, and it wouldn't surprise me to see Saito Edward acting as a producer just like he did with Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade (and he was involved in Demon's Souls 2020 to boot).
This is nightmare fuel. A Sony guy acting as producer for a From Software game.

Sketch Omg GIF by Diane
 

nial

Member
This is nightmare fuel. A Sony guy acting as producer for a From Software game.

Sketch Omg GIF by Diane
Just like Takeshi Kajii (rest in peace) with Demon's Souls 2009, and Kentaro Motomura, Masaaki Yamagiwa and Teruyuki Toriyama with Bloodborne and Déraciné.
You guys need to learn more about the basic shit of video game production. ""Nightmare fuel"" 😂
 
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Orbital2060

Member
Just like Takeshi Kajii (rest in peace) with Demon's Souls 2009, and Kentaro Motomura, Masaaki Yamagiwa and Teruyuki Toriyama with Bloodborne and Déraciné.
You guys need to learn more about the basic shit of video game production. ""Nightmare fuel"" 😂
You guys?

Steve Harvey Wow GIF by NBC


Sony had no influence on Demons Souls, and thought the game was crap. Lord knows where From Software would be now without Bamco signing them up for Dark Souls after Sony completely failed to support them.


"For my personal experience with Demon's Souls, when it was close to final I spent close to two hours playing it and after two hours I was still standing at the beginning at the game. I said, 'This is crap. This is an unbelievably bad game.' So I put it aside.

From Software and Miyazaki have come a long way since then, and sound happy with being able to self-publish now. But lets bring in a Sony rep to tell them what do now. Make us Bloodborne 2! And 3! And 4! Im sure Miyazaki would love to be told what to do, by some random mid-game producer guy.
 
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nial

Member
You guys?

Steve Harvey Wow GIF by NBC


Sony had no influence on Demons Souls, and thought the game was crap.
Shuhei Yoshida is Sony, right. Also, LOL at ""publisher had no influence on the game they funded and produced!!!!"", you're coping.
Demon's Souls literally exists because SIE producer, Takeshi Kajii (who was an actual From Software fan) asked Miyazaki about a new King's Field game, and then both agreed to work together on a SIE × From Software collab project.
Kajii: Actually, I've always loved From's games, such as King's Field and Armored Core. When I happened to have a chance to talk to From about King's Field, I asked them, "Aren't you going to make the latest King's Field game?" That's when they asked me, "If that's the case, why don't we make it together?"
Im sure Miyazaki would love to be told what to do, by some random mid-game producer guy.
He loved that in the development of Demon's Souls, then Bloodborne after Dark Souls 1-2, AND THEN Déraciné after Dark Souls 3 and around the same time as Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice.
People in the biz don't hold such a childish mindset as that, and going "la la la" won't change the fact that it happened three whole times.
 
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NonPhixion

Member
You guys?

Steve Harvey Wow GIF by NBC


Sony had no influence on Demons Souls, and thought the game was crap. Lord knows where From Software would be now without Bamco signing them up for Dark Souls after Sony completely failed to support them.




From Software and Miyazaki have come a long way since then, and sound happy with being able to self-publish now. But lets bring in a Sony rep to tell them what do now. Make us Bloodborne 2! And 3! And 4! Im sure Miyazaki would love to be told what to do, by some random mid-game producer guy.
Ignores the fact the SIE were producers on Demon’s Souls and Miyazaki’s favorite game Bloodborne. Thinks it’s “nightmare fuel”

breakfast noise GIF
 

Mayar

Member
Nu-From Software fans are really the dumbest people out there, they always get mad when you talk about Sony and From, completely ignoring who published the first fucking souls game.
I'll even dig deeper, they seem to have forgotten who started this company back in 1994. When Sony decided to include King's Field as a launch title when selling PlayStation, and then Armored Core. The studios have actually been cooperating for a long time, have good relations and have actually known each other since their foundation =)
 

kingfish

Member
You guys?

Steve Harvey Wow GIF by NBC


Sony had no influence on Demons Souls, and thought the game was crap. Lord knows where From Software would be now without Bamco signing them up for Dark Souls after Sony completely failed to support them.




From Software and Miyazaki have come a long way since then, and sound happy with being able to self-publish now. But lets bring in a Sony rep to tell them what do now. Make us Bloodborne 2! And 3! And 4! Im sure Miyazaki would love to be told what to do, by some random mid-game producer guy.
Delete this nephew.
 

Ebrietas

Member
Shuhei Yoshida is Sony, right. Also, LOL at ""publisher had no influence on the game they funded and produced!!!!"", you're coping.
Demon's Souls literally exists because SIE producer, Takeshi Kajii (who was an actual From Software fan) asked Miyazaki about a new King's Field game, and then both agreed to work together on a SIE × From Software collab project.


He loved that in the development of Demon's Souls, then Bloodborne after Dark Souls 1-2, AND THEN Déraciné after Dark Souls 3 and around the same time as Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice.
People in the biz don't hold such a childish mindset as that, and going "la la la" won't change the fact that it happened three whole times.
I honestly have no idea where people got the idea that Miyazaki gives a crap about making PS exclusives and that he will quit if he isn't allowed to develop on xbox or PC. It's completely divorced from the actual history lol.
 

GigaBowser

The bear of bad news
I haven't yet seen any convincing argument against SIE owning From Software outside of the obvious exclusivity aspect.
There's probably already a PlayStation Studios × From Software collab in the works, and it wouldn't surprise me to see Saito Edward acting as a producer just like he did with Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade (and he was involved in Demon's Souls 2020 to boot).
miyrazeki will leave start new studio i am known for my predictions i'm sorry my friends
 
This is nightmare fuel. A Sony guy acting as producer for a From Software game.

Sketch Omg GIF by Diane

You guys?

Steve Harvey Wow GIF by NBC


Sony had no influence on Demons Souls, and thought the game was crap. Lord knows where From Software would be now without Bamco signing them up for Dark Souls after Sony completely failed to support them.




From Software and Miyazaki have come a long way since then, and sound happy with being able to self-publish now. But lets bring in a Sony rep to tell them what do now. Make us Bloodborne 2! And 3! And 4! Im sure Miyazaki would love to be told what to do, by some random mid-game producer guy.

confused jim carey GIF
 

elhav

Member
Just a question: Was there ever a case where a giant conglomerate swallowed game studios and/or smaller videogame related conglomerates and it turned out well?

Because I can't think of one. Most of the examples I have belong to Microsoft and EA, and we all know how great those acquisitions were...
 

Mayar

Member
Just a question: Was there ever a case where a giant conglomerate swallowed game studios and/or smaller videogame related conglomerates and it turned out well?

Because I can't think of one. Most of the examples I have belong to Microsoft and EA, and we all know how great those acquisitions were...
You'll laugh, but as an example, Tencent - Warframe and POE, which gave them the opportunity to significantly increase the budgets of games.
 

Thick Thighs Save Lives

NeoGAF's Physical Games Advocate Extraordinaire
Some more interesting tidbits regarding this potential acquisition via Automaton West

Hence, if Sony and Kadokawa were to merge, they would become a massive powerhouse in terms of anime, combining Sony’s strong global network and Kadokawa’s content creation expertise. “If we were to integrate with Sony, we could do everything from publishing the source material to worldwide distribution of anime. It feels too dynamic to be real,” Toyo Keizai quotes a Kadokawa employee.
In addition, a top executive of an anime company (not affiliated with Sony or Kadokawa) commented, “An M&A on the scale of 600 billion would be undoable for us. Sony has us beat,” which only goes to show how big of a deal this is for other players in the industry.
 
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CyberCali

Moderator
Staff Member
👀

Folks, please dial back the culture war drive by bait. It's getting tiring seeing this in almost every single thread on here.

Here's this thread for the pros and cons to your heart's content:
Reminder, folks: Stop interacting with culture war drive-by posts from the first few pages of this thread. Thanks!
 
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