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[digdug2]

LOL.

Now I've triggered a Sony snowflake who took the opposite meaning of what I was saying?

Is today the day of lets get twisted meaning from Nonehxc letters and go dumbly against him for soiling the virtue of my favourite whatever?



Look spinerino friend.

Lets see, so far I have one unhinged person from the From Software Einsaztgruppen, and another one from the Sony Pony Autodefense.

Since my message also mentions Xbox and PC, I guess the next ones will be the Xbox Zealots of the Cult of the Fail and the soiled neck beard PC Masterracers(not seen on frame is my PC to the right with all Dark Souls series on Steam) twisting my words to conform to their prejudices.

Goddamm, I love it. Offending everyone everywhere at the same time without even pretending it.

Or, you know, you both could just come clear and accept you took the wrong meaning out of my words, each one of you for different retarded reasons and prejudices, and we could all be friends.

Your words are nothing more than nonsensical bullshit. You're either a shitty troll or just stupid. Either one makes perfect sense based on your responses.

 

[StueyDuck]

How is that the result of lazyness specifically?

You can't even offer a relevant analogy because your argument is so weak!

It's not an argument. Mate unless you work there, you need to get their dick out your mouth.

They should either have someone who can implement or fix these issues or train staff to do so, so either management is lazy or the leads or whoever, the fact is when you earn that much money there is no excuse. There is no such thing as impossible.

The fact you even think this is an "argument" says alot .

 

[mckmas8808]

Their artistic vision and design might be great, but holy shit at the backend. This shouldn't surprise anyone, but it's still disappointing to see in such an acclaimed title.

It's shocking to be honest. I feel like this is the issue of cross-gen development.

 

[K2D]

Probably the Series S holding them back, right?

How green ARE your boxers?

 

[ChoosableOne]

When you are compiling binary, you have the option to include flags in the compilation process, which will introduce optimization from compiler/Sony, by itself. Many features, like AVX and so on, are only enabled when there are proper flags. Outside of that optimization works by scanning code and finding out patters, which could be replaced, by heavily optimize version to that platform.

Depending on the quality of provided code, it could have 1% advantage with quality engineered code, who knows what they are doing, but with shit code you are in 10ths of % better running code. Granted these things are to everything outside of GPU, but it could speed up even rendering process, because there are ton of loaders for everything on the screen less waiting = faster running code.

 

[M1chl]

Was it written too difficult to understand, I really tried : (

 

[ChoosableOne]

Was it written too difficult to understand, I really tried : (

You did your best, my friend. The topic turned out to be more complicated than I expected. When I saw that 11 people liked it, I tried to understand, but it was beyond my grasp

 

[Trunx81]

How green ARE your boxers?

They are red. Nintendo-Red. Always have been. <3

 

[Nonehxc]

Your words are nothing more than nonsensical bullshit. You're either a shitty troll or just stupid. Either one makes perfect sense based on your responses.

Blablabla insult insult whatever insult

Guess what, little one? No matter how much hate you get out for me, how angrily you defend them, how much seed you offer to Miyazaki, From Software will keep exciting you, and I will keep regarding them as retarded programmers for as long as they can't release 60fps with perfect framepacing. Which will be the day your emaciated triggerino drops that Elden Ring you got there, Zebbo.

So, we stop derailing the thread with your spits and your drool or should we go for bingo til you pop that forehead vein?

 

[Solarstrike]

"reverse engineered"...

 

[Pedro Motta]

This is not lazyness, it's incompetence.

 

[Ronin_7]

My goodness

 

[KillaJamm]

I agree, the only engine out there from Japan that looks half decent is the Re-Engine but even new releases on that have some performance issues.

 

[Killer8]

You call it defending, I call it contextualizing and explaining that things in development are never that black and white. A position I hold due to many years of experience in the field.

Its a complex undertaking to make a large scale game requiring hundreds of man-years worth of coordinated effort from talented, dedicated professionals. This is why the complaint of "Lazy devs" is so offensive to me. No number of lazy people would or will ever make a title as good as Elden Ring or any other highly rated title for that matter.

Such a simplistic diagnosis flies in the face of reason.

Does everything that's imperfect in you and your life boil down to lazyness?

There are frequently baffling technical decisions made by development teams of hundreds.

The Pokemon Company, for example, theoretically has virtually unlimited supplies of cash and yet still has not been able to implement an anti-aliasing solution into its rendering pipeline as of 2023. Not even a basic post-AA solution like FXAA. If it's because no one knows how, it would surely be reasonable to hire someone who does. If it's because it would impact performance - first of all, that's unlikely to any significant degree. Second, the performance of the latest Pokemon is already such a cesspit to even care about one less frame per second. And third, not having the forethought to factor in the performance impact of AA into the rendering should prompt the team to re-evaluate and modernize its processes. This is one example of how a huge team can have a blind spot.

"Lazy devs" may be offensive to you but on the flip-side it's also far too easy to impart undue praise or understanding to obvious issues. A company of hundreds may be filled with talented people, yes, but companies also naturally have incompetent people who make mistakes or need more training. A weak link in the chain can produce subpar quality in specific areas of an otherwise stellar product. 'Contextualizing and explaining' shouldn't be a shield against criticism - why a trainwreck happened could be explained quite easily, but doesn't say anything about why it still shouldn't have occurred.

 

[K2D]

They are red. Nintendo-Red. Always have been. <3

Sorry for assuming you alignments

I would be annoyed being mistaken for a green rat or snoy boy in your place /s

 

[Esca]

Not surprised at all. This is from soft who released a piss poor copy of dark souls and a player had to fix it and far at I know from never bothered to fix it still.

 

[MikeM]

I feel sorry for PS5 owners that only own the PS5 version of Elden Ring. The PS4 version on PS5 runs beautifully.

Physical version?

 

[MikeM]

It still blows my mind that these games don’t have a vrr/uncapped mode. Come on devs!

 

[CamHostage]

Lol there's No point here these companies earn big money, these performance issues shouldn't be happening at such a silly level.

I take it you've never worked under the budget of a company in a publicly-traded conglomeration which earns "big money"?

 

[Pelta88]

Must have been a creative decision.

If I had neogaf gold I'd give it to you.

 

[vkbest]

This is not lazyness, it's incompetence.

Probably both. I mean that is automatic, the one reason they are not enabling at compiling it's probably they have old code can be broken with those automatic optimizations.

 

[LazyParrot]

Not surprised at all. This is from soft who released a piss poor copy of dark souls and a player had to fix it and far at I know from never bothered to fix it still.

I bought the PC version at launch, so I definitely remember how bad it was, but it worked just fine the last time I installed and played it, so they must have done something to fix it.

 

[ZehDon]

Difference is this was in 1995 when 3d graphics were relatively new,now they are the standard,from soft is just incompetent

If you’re not going to bother watching the video, or reading my post, please don’t respond to me. Thanks.

 

[alucard0712_rus]

When you are compiling binary, you have the option to include flags in the compilation process, which will introduce optimization from compiler/Sony, by itself. Many features, like AVX and so on, are only enabled when there are proper flags. Outside of that optimization works by scanning code and finding out patters, which could be replaced, by heavily optimize version to that platform.

Depending on the quality of provided code, it could have 1% advantage with quality engineered code, who knows what they are doing, but with shit code you are in 10ths of % better running code. Granted these things are to everything outside of GPU, but it could speed up even rendering process, because there are ton of loaders for everything on the screen less waiting = faster running code.

The tech side of the code must be so poor that even optimization could break it, lol.

 

[StueyDuck]

I take it you've never worked under the budget of a company in a publicly-traded conglomeration which earns "big money"?

hahaha yeah totally have never done that before , companies never hire staff or train staff to fix problems or create new projects in there organisations, no siree bob

 

[bender]

From Soft are kinda shit at tech, aren't they ?

The average person's understanding of tech is shit.

 

[hemo memo]

From and GF don’t surprise anymore.

 

[hemo memo]

From Soft are kinda shit at tech, aren't they ?

good thing their games are received so well on the basis of their content alone.

No, not kinda. They are shit.

 

[Bernardougf]

Yeah fuck them.. played the ps4 version of ER on my ps5... fuck some pretty lights and grass.. it was smooth locked 60 fps

And only because of this kind of shit I wished they were bought by sony ... From creativity + sony engineers.. oooof good shit would come from there

 

[docchicken]

I knew from software were not great with optimization, but this just seems so egregious. So disappointing to hear

 

[T-0800]

Physical version?

I assume it works for both. I only have the physical PS4 version.

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

This really pisses me off holy shit

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

1. Release shit
2. See shit selling
3. Conclusion: shit sells, no need for compilers

And that is unacceptable bullshit. The game still runs like shit on ps5 despite some blind morons who say otherwise

 

[Sub_Level]

Played like 40 hours of Elden Ring on PS5 and had no issues? Wtf are people talking about lmao

 

[reinking]

Lets see, so far I have one unhinged person from the From Software Einsaztgruppen, and another one from the Sony Pony Autodefense.

 

[PaintTinJr]

In the Mario 64 video about the US version not getting the main executable compiled with optimisation. I think that might have been for the purpose of expecting different(larger) RAM chips in later models of the console and wanting to avoid issues with struct data types being unpadded (packed tightly) on compilation resulting in lost performance on a later hardware revisions with bigger ram chips that wanted padded structs to align on Dword boundaries

As for Elden Ring, like Demon's souls it uses Sony's old multiplatform PhyreEngine which was discontinued prior to the PS5, so it hasn't been official ported to PS5 to provide an optimal upgrade. Like with Mario 64 the sdk libraries used to do the heavy processing will still have been compiled with optimisation, so the difference between the main executable without an -O2 flag will be minimal.

IIRC the two main auto compiler optimisation pitfalls that typically break code are recursive calling depth limit being bypassed, and struct alignment (classes in PhyreEngine) breaking bitwise specific code.

One other major reason this might have been a good decision might be that without optimisation on the executable the Elden Ring binary might still be able to benefit more from later console firmware revisions that free up more of the 16GBs of GDDR6 of the PS5 for games - so might even be recommended for early years PS5 executables, or that without optimising the the binary the PS5 firmware performance improvements(from enhancements to the SDK) can further eliminate wasted cycles easier or....maybe the rumour Xbox had Elden Ring marketing rights was true, and a lack of binary optimisation on PS5 was for the parity clause.

If I had to guess I think it is more related to PhyreEngine not getting a proper PS5 update and getting a potential small improvement - because PhyreEngine is OOP C++ and optimisations for OOP data are less reliable than for a structural data like standard C.- isn't worth all the extra testing for one version which had the 3rd largest platform size, after PS4 and PC, at the time..

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

And still made the GOAT.

If this is true...can they fix it?

 

[Gideon]

Fromsoft earned quite a bit of money (50M iirc) can't they use that to acquire a japanese game studio that is focused on technical aspects and optimization?

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

Pffftt!!!

I don't got compiler optimizations either... but I don't have a 90+ metacritic. So From must have done something right.

 

[Johnny Concrete]

Played like 40 hours of Elden Ring on PS5 and had no issues? Wtf are people talking about lmao

Play 40 more and you’ll see

 

[saintjules]

If I had neogaf gold I'd give it to you.

Only $4.99 you peasant

 

[Barakov]

 

[Yoboman]

From Software are far from lazy

Their games are absolutely packed with content, come out almost yearly and always feel fresh. Huge output of asset and art production

I'd venture there might be a few senior people on their tech/engine side who have been coasting for awhile though. Blueprint showed you can basically replicate their engine with signicant upgrades

 

[mhirano]

They better not fuck this up with Armored Core VI

I have some bad news for you my dude

(The tweets in the OP were about his)

 

[dotnotbot]

From software is so much more efficient compared to most other AAA devs out there that it shouldn't surprise anyone they are cutting some corners to achieve their ambitious deadlines. I certainly prefer putting more focus on games content than technical side. Patch for Elden Ring isn't coming cause they're probably already working full speed on next souls game.

 

[digdug2]

Blablabla insult insult whatever insult

Guess what, little one? No matter how much hate you get out for me, how angrily you defend them, how much seed you offer to Miyazaki, From Software will keep exciting you, and I will keep regarding them as retarded programmers for as long as they can't release 60fps with perfect framepacing. Which will be the day your emaciated triggerino drops that Elden Ring you got there, Zebbo.

So, we stop derailing the thread with your spits and your drool or should we go for bingo til you pop that forehead vein?

Yeah, I like From Soft games. You sure cut me to the bone there, champ. Triggerino? LOL what kind of dumb fuck actually uses language like this? Oh, and WTF is a Zebbo?

 

[Elysium44]

ITT a team that's released an unbroken string of highly rated and popular games is now "incompetent", not because their product tends to be unstable or bug-ridden, but because of alleged compiler config options of all things...

Either way, if its such a critical, but easily fixable issue, it'll get fixed quickly and completely. But if it doesn't... maybe there are actual reasons why that's the case.

Not necessarily, there are many examples in the games industry of things which COULD be easily fixed but never are. There are definitely some developers who are very lazy or arrogant and don't care.

 

[digdug2]

I believe that you have summed up Nonehxc in one perfect gif.

 

[Bernardougf]

I guess lazyness and/or incompetence now really are "creative visions" worth of defending ... thanks for this legacy Phil ... who said that xbox never gave anything of worth to this industry

Big Fromsoft fan here... but this piss poor dated engine in 2023 after all the money they made is inexcusable

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Lower resolution, less grass and forestry density, worse lighting, no RT from the top of my mind compared to the PS5 version. Just to be clear, PS4 version on PS4 Pro runs better than the PS5 'native' version, and much better when played on PS5. Put a slow donkey on a Ferrari, it goes fast.

PS5 is around ten times more capable than a PS4. More grass and some light weight RT should not be what makes the PS5 have problems in a game like this. Not at all.