Support NeoGAF

[Three]

Your comparison with GT's replay mode is inaccurate. FH's Quality mode you actually play, GT's replay mode is just canned playback.

That's not a valid comparison at all. If you wanna compare both's photo mode or replays that's a different thing. But you're literally comparing real time game play in one versus replays in another.

And I'm telling you there isn't a difference to LOD budget with "canned playback" and any 30fps gameplay because it isn't a CPU thing but a GPU rendering budget thing. The replays could be gameplay at 30fps. It would make no difference to triangle count or shaders. You're still doing those things in realtime in "canned playback". If you want to compare go 60fps mode in FH and you'll see it's not equivalent to ultra settings.

 

[adamsapple]

And I'm telling you there isn't a difference to LOD budget with "canned playback" and any 30fps gameplay because it isn't a CPU thing but a GPU rendering budget thing. The replays could be gameplay at 30fps. It would make no difference to triangle count or shaders. You're still doing those things in realtime in "canned playback". If you want to compare go 60fps mode in FH and you'll see it's not equivalent to ultra settings.

Right, I acknowledge there is a drop in environmental detail in Performance mode in FH5 but the car detail and LoD is still the same for what it's worth.

-

Anyway, in terms of sheer detail irrespective of mode, FH5's Vista mode (which also adds RT reflections) is also pretty damn insane:

 

[Honey Bunny]

Oh I don't know, when you're in-game the pictures posted by @Turk1993 seem to show the opposite.

GT probably replaces with a muuuuch higher detail model in the garage views.


Left: FH5, Right: GT7

Does FH5 run at 60? Because theres no comparison here, FH5 looks way better

 

[adamsapple]

Does FH5 run at 60? Because theres no comparison here, FH5 looks way better

FH has one mode that runs at 30 at native 4K and better environment effects and one mode that runs at 60 with dynamic 4K, lower environment effects but same car LoDs.

 

[TrebleShot]

Guys actually play the games on your 4K TV and you will notice that GT7 is much cleaner and visually stunning compared to FH5.

FH5 is a very nice looking game but it’s also an arcade experience. Let’s not forget the simulation handling and weather simulation going on in GT7.

Things like tyre simulation, turbo, physics etc all being handled in real time at 60fps 4k.

GT7 still looks more impressive and pleasing to the eye.

 

[RoyBatty]

Guys actually play the games on your 4K TV and you will notice that GT7 is much cleaner and visually stunning compared to FH5.

FH5 is a very nice looking game but it’s also an arcade experience. Let’s not forget the simulation handling and weather simulation going on in GT7.

Things like tyre simulation, turbo, physics etc all being handled in real time at 60fps 4k.

GT7 still looks more impressive and pleasing to the eye.

GT simulation has nothing to do compared to AC as well...

 

[BigLee74]

Guys actually play the games on your 4K TV and you will notice that GT7 is much cleaner and visually stunning compared to FH5.

FH5 is a very nice looking game but it’s also an arcade experience. Let’s not forget the simulation handling and weather simulation going on in GT7.

Things like tyre simulation, turbo, physics etc all being handled in real time at 60fps 4k.

GT7 still looks more impressive and pleasing to the eye.

Even if you ignore the fact that this is a graphics face-off, you’re wrong. Opinions, huh?

 

[Three]

Right, I acknowledge there is a drop in environmental detail in Performance mode in FH5 but the car detail and LoD is still the same for what it's worth.

The car reflections/specular are also different between quality and performance mode in FH5. It's even higher on PC which is what gives it that crisp look on that zoomed in shot along with the higher resolution you can get on a PC. XSX and PC Ultra settings are not equivalent or 'higher on xbox' as you said earlier.

If you look at the lexus on a XSX in performance mode resolution and reflection detail it's really not that staggeringly different to GT7. This is FH5 on a XSX in performance mode:

Interior LOD is far more aggressive on chase cam in GT though especially on some cars like the RC F but I suspect that is because most of the rendering budget goes towards the 20 cars on the track which is what stresses GT7 the most and that's where they can gain back some performance.

 

[skyfinch]

Guys actually play the games on your 4K TV and you will notice that GT7 is much cleaner and visually stunning compared to FH5.

FH5 is a very nice looking game but it’s also an arcade experience. Let’s not forget the simulation handling and weather simulation going on in GT7.

Things like tyre simulation, turbo, physics etc all being handled in real time at 60fps 4k.

GT7 still looks more impressive and pleasing to the eye.

Doesn't the horizon games takes the same physic model as Motorsport?
And Forza Horizon has real time weather simulations as well. Puddles form and affect the car's handling.

 

[ethomaz]

And Forza Horizon has real time weather simulations as well. Puddles form and affect the car's handling.

Same for GT7.

24 hours cycle (you can change how much a hour take in actual real life) and real-time weather simulation.

And yes it affect the car’s handling.

 

[RoyBatty]

Same for GT7.

24 hours cycle (you can change how much a hour take in actual real life) and real-time weather simulation.

But one is an open world with even dust storms and the other is a closed circuit with low detailed environment. BTW I don't think FH really cares about simulation too much.

 

[ethomaz]

But one is an open world with even dust storms and the other is a closed circuit with low detailed environment. BTW I don't think FH really cares about simulation too much.

Yes but his reply was for comparing GT7 to FH5 as if one have that features and others not lol

Like something FH5 has and GT7 not.

At least hat is what I understand when something says “and x has y feature” in a comparison discussion.

 

[RoyBatty]

Oh I see, Horizon can't compete in simulation with GT IMO.

 

[adamsapple]

Oh I see, Horizon can't compete in simulation with GT IMO.

No, Horizon is meant to be a more acrade friendly game.

Motorsport's reboot (hopefully) later this year will fill that void.

 

[Captain Toad]

Gran Turismo clearly wins graphically, but Horizon is more suited for me. I don't want to invest enough to get into a simulation racer.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

If you look at the lexus on a XSX in performance mode resolution and reflection detail it's really not that staggeringly different to GT7. This is FH5 on a XSX in performance mode:

Lol, no. This is Lexus in performance mode during gameplay. I think XBOX is ruining these images enough with its compression, you don't need to add anything extra.

Edit: Different picture, this time from OneDrive.

 

[Honey Bunny]

FH has one mode that runs at 30 at native 4K and better environment effects and one mode that runs at 60 with dynamic 4K, lower environment effects but same car LoDs.

Do we know if it's running at 60 in that pic?

 

[Three]

Lol, no. This is Lexus in performance mode during gameplay. I think XBOX is ruining these images enough with its compression, you don't need to add anything extra.

Compression with the captures probably doesn't help but switch to the chase cam just before cockpit view then crop the image like the ones before. that is the chase cam that's closest between the games and images people have been posting. Make sure you're in performance mode, you're not braking/reversing and it's not raining

Do we know if it's running at 60 in that pic?

It's the PC version being posted there. It could be running at any framerate possible on that persons PC.

 

[sncvsrtoip]

Doesn't the horizon games takes the same physic model as Motorsport?
And Forza Horizon has real time weather simulations as well. Puddles form and affect the car's handling.

In terms if dynamic rain gt7 is now leader, weather radar, dry lines, different wet level on different track part, they nailed it

 

[THE DUCK]

I'm not sure how anyone can say gt7 looks better than horizon 5. I mean gt7 practically looks the same at a glance on ps4 pro and ps5, where as forza 5 had an an immediate, wow that looks next gen.

I understand that gt7 looks more "real" in.some rare situations but many, many times that illusion is shattered and it just looks cartoony. To me it's similar to nba2k, the replays and close ups look amazing, but there's something overall that just shatters the illusion in the regular views.

Both are amazing games overall.

 

[adamsapple]

Lol, no. This is Lexus in performance mode during gameplay. I think XBOX is ruining these images enough with its compression, you don't need to add anything extra.

I just captured these on the same car same spot. unfortunately you have to restart the game to change setting so cloud coverage was a little bit varied between the two.

But based on what I can eye ball, reflection quality and even the car LoD looks give or take exactly the same.

The screen with more foliage is Quality, the other one is Performance.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

I just captured these on the same car same spot. unfortunately you have to restart the game to change setting so cloud coverage was a little bit varied between the two.

What's the best way to share screenshots from Xbox? Sharing to Twitter kills picture quality completly.

 

[adamsapple]

What's the best way to share screenshots from Xbox? Sharing to Twitter kills picture quality completly.

Upload to One Drive. It comes out as a 12 MB .PNG file, probably the best we can hope to get.

Real fucking sad there's no simple 'plug in USB and copy pictures' option like PS4 had.

 

[ethomaz]

I'm not sure how anyone can say gt7 looks better than horizon 5. I mean gt7 practically looks the same at a glance on ps4 pro and ps5, where as forza 5 had an an immediate, wow that looks next gen.

I understand that gt7 looks more "real" in.some rare situations but many, many times that illusion is shattered and it just looks cartoony. To me it's similar to nba2k, the replays and close ups look amazing, but there's something overall that just shatters the illusion in the regular views.

Both are amazing games overall.

I have the game and it doesn’t look anything close running the PS5 version and PS4 Pro version.

Anybody saying that clearly not played the game.

 

[MidGenRefresh]

Upload to One Drive. It comes out as a 12 MB .PNG file, probably the best we can hope to get.

Real fucking sad there's no simple 'plug in USB and copy pictures' option like PS4 had.

Holy shit, forget my previous picture. Quality difference between OneDrive and Twitter is insane.

T Three , there you go:

 

[Markio128]

Driving my beloved Mini Cooper

 

[BigLee74]

Yes but his reply was for comparing GT7 to FH5 as if one have that features and others not lol

Like something FH5 has and GT7 not.

At least hat is what I understand when something says “and x has y feature” in a comparison discussion.

Well you’re wrong. Trebleshot was the one that started going on about how GT7 had the weather and physics simulation as if FH5 did not. Skyfinch was just correcting him.

Do keep up.

 

[THE DUCK]

I have the game and it doesn’t look anything close running the PS5 version and PS4 Pro version.

Anybody saying that clearly not played the game.

So your playing it on both the ps4 pro and ps5 at the same time?

 

[ethomaz]

So your playing it on both the ps4 pro and ps5 at the same time?

Yes… PS5 allow that.
You can download both version and test it… anybody with a PS5 can do that.

But I did for curiosity… I play most the PS5 version… not too many hours too… I played just a bit over 10 hours finished the A license yesterday night (missed 2 Gold… needs to redo these today… the Rally one is being weird… I’m doing something very wrong because I miss 300ms).

 

[Honey Bunny]

Compression with the captures probably doesn't help but switch to the chase cam just before cockpit view then crop the image like the ones before. that is the chase cam that's closest between the games and images people have been posting. Make sure you're in performance mode, you're not braking/reversing and it's not raining



It's the PC version being posted there. It could be running at any framerate possible on that persons PC.

Oh well that's useless

 

[Snake29]

I'm not sure how anyone can say gt7 looks better than horizon 5. I mean gt7 practically looks the same at a glance on ps4 pro and ps5, where as forza 5 had an an immediate, wow that looks next gen.

I understand that gt7 looks more "real" in.some rare situations but many, many times that illusion is shattered and it just looks cartoony. To me it's similar to nba2k, the replays and close ups look amazing, but there's something overall that just shatters the illusion in the regular views.

Both are amazing games overall.

People that have the game and play it can say that. So i don't know why you think people "can't" say that? GT7 to me looks more impressive and i have much more fun with this game i have had with horizon 5. Open world doesn't make it more enjoyable for me.

 

[sendit]

People that have the game and play it can say that. So i don't know why you think people "can't" say that? GT7 to me looks more impressive and i have much more fun with this game i have had with horizon 5. Open world doesn't make it more enjoyable for me.

Agreed. FH5's open world is beautiful. However, driving to a race event becomes a chore. It made me stop playing the game, I just wanted to race.

 

[Con_Z_ǝdʇ]

GT7 ° PS5 ° photo mode

 

[adamsapple]

Oh well that's useless

^ Multiple examples of Performance mode pictures a few post above yours, from myself and from MidGenRefresh .

They look indistinguishable from the Quality mode to my eyes.

 

[nemiroff]

Agreed. FH5's open world is beautiful. However, driving to a race event becomes a chore. It made me stop playing the game, I just wanted to race.

Wait, you don't know that you don't have to drive between races..? Are you for real? And races are like around every fucking corner anyway..

Doesn't the horizon games takes the same physic model as Motorsport?
And Forza Horizon has real time weather simulations as well. Puddles form and affect the car's handling.

Yeah; ForzaTech. It's a shared and updated T10 codebase between FM and FH. You have to understand that some people are just parroting what they've heard other people say, they don't care if it's true or not. Meaning; The "arcade" part isn't really about the physics simulation per se, it's all about the forgiveness in the experience, letting people go off-road in a Lambo so-to-speak.. The Forza simulation engine is still there, updated with most bells and whistles from the FM engine and you can really feel its dynamics in road racing, it's definitely not an arcade engine.. albeit not all the way deep as some of the hardcore PC sim racers like iRacing (and neither is GT7 btw).

And yes FH5 also has the more diverse weather system despite what some people would like the narrative to go. WITH THAT SAID, specifically GT7's dynamic rain system and how it affects the road surfaces (both the shaders and the simulation itself) is unmatched.

 

[adamsapple]

Agreed. FH5's open world is beautiful. However, driving to a race event becomes a chore. It made me stop playing the game, I just wanted to race.

You can just fast travel to the events directly .. it costs a bit of credit but you make a shit ton doing anything.

 

[Snake29]

Agreed. FH5's open world is beautiful. However, driving to a race event becomes a chore. It made me stop playing the game, I just wanted to race.

Exactly the problem i have had on PC. Playing it on my pc in ultra wide looks gorgeous, but i had the same problem with the mission structure. It doesn't make the game more fun. Also the menu structure is a complete mess. In GT, when I'm in a race, I really feel like I'm competing for something and winning the race or getting into the top 3 (both in single and multi), just gives me a satisfied feeling and i want more of it.

Horizon 5 is beautiful but feels boring at the same time.

 

[leo-j]

I am super interested in buying GT7 especially with the SSD loading and the dual sense features on ps5 . Just the game came out right around D2, ER, and others so I’ll prob get it when it’s on sale.

 

[Negotiator101]

Forza lighting just looks off, overly shiny doesn't look realistic, I don't think you can get car paint that reflective lol.

GT7 looks more 'real' for sure.

You absolutely can get paint as reflective

 

[Negotiator101]

Guys actually play the games on your 4K TV and you will notice that GT7 is much cleaner and visually stunning compared to FH5.

FH5 is a very nice looking game but it’s also an arcade experience. Let’s not forget the simulation handling and weather simulation going on in GT7.

Things like tyre simulation, turbo, physics etc all being handled in real time at 60fps 4k.

GT7 still looks more impressive and pleasing to the eye.

Not to my eyes.

 

[ethomaz]

Wait, you don't know that you don't have to drive between races..? Are you for real? And races are like around every fucking corner anyway..



Yeah; ForzaTech. It's a shared and updated T10 codebase between FM and FH. You have to understand that some people are just parroting what they've heard other people say, they don't care if it's true or not. Meaning; The "arcade" part isn't really about the physics simulation per se, it's all about the forgiveness in the experience, letting people go off-road in a Lambo so-to-speak.. The Forza simulation engine is still there, updated with most bells and whistles from the FM engine and you can really feel its dynamics in road racing, it's definitely not an arcade engine.. albeit not all the way deep as some of the hardcore PC sim racers like iRacing (and neither is GT7 btw).

And yes FH5 also has the more diverse weather system despite what some people would like the narrative to go. WITH THAT SAID, specifically GT7's dynamic rain system and how it affects the road surfaces (both the shaders and the simulation itself) is unmatched.

Forza Motorsport and Forza Horizon has different physics… it is not even up to debate because anybody that played the two games knows the driving physics are different.

The only Forza Horizon that used the Forza Motorsport driving physics was FH1 and that are with a tuned grip that makes it feel completely different.

After that FH uses it own driving physics.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Series X Quality mode is equivalent to PC Ultra settings and in some areas exceeds PC Ultra settings as per DF.

Native 4K, 4XMSAA on top of that. No need to use PC version at all.

Time stamped in video below:

What areas? And PC has some Extreme settings...

 

[adamsapple]

What areas? And PC has some Extreme settings...

 

[rodrigolfp]

What is higher there? The settings "with differences"?

 

[adamsapple]

What is higher there? The settings "with differences"?

Dunno probably means it may change dynamically depending on load. I didn't watch the full 20+ min PC video from DF, just skimmed to that part.

 

[ethomaz]

What is higher there? The settings "with differences"?

I think he talks about some being Extreme that is higher than Ultra.

Not that it can go higher than PC.

The “Ultra with differences” means it is not exactly Ultra and it is not High either… it is probably something in the middle that can’t be simulated on PC.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Dunno probably means it may change dynamically depending on load. I didn't watch the full 20+ min PC video from DF, just skimmed to that part.

Some settings being higher than ultra don't mean that the XSX version of FH5 has the same quality so "No need to use PC version at all" is not right.

 

[adamsapple]

Some settings being higher than ultra don't mean that the XSX version of FH5 has the same quality so "No need to use PC version at all" is not right.

You're conflating the two different points unnecessarily. The 'don't need to use PC version' comment was in reply tom someone saying why PC version screens were being used to show car detail and/or reflections as if that gave it any extra advantage. Not stating that there is no need for PC version.

The "World Car Detail" preset (if that's the preset that defines all car LoDs, again I'm not sure) is Ultra in both Performance and Quality mode, and multiple users including myself have posted shots featuring either mode showing game play cars above, which still seemingly show the same or higher detail in the in-game car models, not the photo-mode or garage models.

 

[rodrigolfp]

You're conflating the two different points unnecessarily. The 'don't need to use PC version' comment was in reply tom someone saying why PC version screens were being used to show car detail as if that gave it any extra advantage. Not stating that there is no need for PC version.

The "World Car Detail" preset (if that's the preset that defines all car LoDs, again I'm not sure) is Ultra in both Performance and Quality mode, and multiple users including myself have posted shots featuring either mode showing game play cars above, which still seemingly show the same or higher detail in the in-game car models, not the photo-mode or garage models.

I don't see in the post you quoted the point being only about car details.

 

[adamsapple]

I don't see in the post you quoted the point being only about car details.

Ok. Well anyway, the original point was that FH5 in-game cars seem to have higher reflective detail compared to GT7 using PC screens, which is now reaffirmed using SX screens in Quality and Performance pics on this page above by MidGenRefresh .