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Richard Leadbetter of Digital Foundry: Why the return of 30fps console games is inevitable
- Thread starter remember_spinal
- Start date
- Analysis Game Dev
GymWolf
Member
In horizon at the hardest difficulty you move around as much as spidey because multiple enemies attack you constantly, same for gow in the more busier arenas or against something like the valkirye, both games are way harder than spidey combat wise.
But sure during traversal spidey is the one that need more fluidity for the web slinging.
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And still looks better than 99% of anything this gen. You really believe 3rd party are going to push graphics to the next level? Look at Gotham Knights. The only gaming company that will push graphics is Playstation. Just look at history. Look at the PS4 gen. Whats better than the Last of us, Spiderman, and Gow? Playstation is the only company pushing the industry with their exclusives.
3rd party this gen will also be held back by the Series S (Mr. Potato). Its going to get worst.
It was bound to happen unless we want to stick forever with cross gen games and personally I don't want that.
But:
1) 40fps mode with VRR on 120Hz displays might be the best of both worlds and it's realistic.
2) The 60fps crowd can still look forward to mid gen hardware upgrades but even there there will be 30-40fps modes with ray tracing pushed like on PC.
But:
1) 40fps mode with VRR on 120Hz displays might be the best of both worlds and it's realistic.
2) The 60fps crowd can still look forward to mid gen hardware upgrades but even there there will be 30-40fps modes with ray tracing pushed like on PC.
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BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Big open world game in a city with a bunch of NPCs and cars is gonna be hard to pull off if they want to push the effects.
I never played spiderman on ps4 but people didn’t seem to mind that it was 30 fps.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Which hopefully they're not. It's a waste of resourced with such good reconstruction scaling techniques out there now.
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FACTS. All 4 with 60FPS options.
GymWolf
Member
I'm sure the game is gonna be a looker and even much improved from the first trailer, but i bet i still bet it's gonna have modes.
remember_spinal
Banned
So do we get angry at them for not giving us state of the art graphics, high resolution or 60fps first?
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Oh would you look at that, what I’ve e been preaching was right all along?
Ya don’t sayyyy.
Great news
Graphics>framerate.
Devs agree
Publishers agree
The people agree.
It’s just framenerds who don’t.
I KEEP SAYING THIS.
Someone tag me lol
Ya don’t sayyyy.
Great news
Graphics>framerate.
Devs agree
Publishers agree
The people agree.
It’s just framenerds who don’t.
I KEEP SAYING THIS.
Someone tag me lol
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Schmick
Member
I agree.
Not to mention that MS's first next gen game will be 60fps with RTX (Forza).
Markio128
Member
Have they actually confirmed 60fps with RTX? Pretty impressive if true.
darrylgorn
Member
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remember_spinal
Banned
3liteDragon
Member
Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
Well I don't care that much about the state of the art graphics or resolution.
Portugeezer
Member
If it bothered me I would be a PC gamer.
60fps options are nice and all, but I am not deluding myself that the abundance of 60fps options are not because most games are crossgen; it is.
60fps options are nice and all, but I am not deluding myself that the abundance of 60fps options are not because most games are crossgen; it is.
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Fbh
Member
I still think this gen will be more mixed. We'll definitely get more 30fps games as time goes on but I still think we'll get more 60fps games than it the last 2 gens.
Most games still don't look as good as Horizon Forbidden west, and that's a big open world that can still hit 60fps. Of course it benefits from the dev being able to optimize for a single hardware configuration, but it's still a good showing of the visual fidelity you can get on these new consoles without having to give up performance.
Though 40fps as a new performance mode isn't that bad either. It just has to be stable 40fps.
I think most people are already ok with that. I hardly see anyone demanding native 4K on consoles.
I have no idea why WB Montreal thought the average player wanted a game with performance that can drop to the low 20's just for the sake of Native 4K and ray traced reflections
Most games still don't look as good as Horizon Forbidden west, and that's a big open world that can still hit 60fps. Of course it benefits from the dev being able to optimize for a single hardware configuration, but it's still a good showing of the visual fidelity you can get on these new consoles without having to give up performance.
Though 40fps as a new performance mode isn't that bad either. It just has to be stable 40fps.
I think most people are already ok with that. I hardly see anyone demanding native 4K on consoles.
I have no idea why WB Montreal thought the average player wanted a game with performance that can drop to the low 20's just for the sake of Native 4K and ray traced reflections
Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
Not a single one of those pushed these machines. They were launch games, launch window games, and a ps3 remake lol
Oh you mean like Ghosts, Last of Us 2, Death Strandings, Days Gone, let me not even continue with the list. Games that push hardware near the end of the gen don’t run at 60. They never do.
You’ll get PS6 remakes at 60
darrylgorn
Member
It can certainly get you a 60 fps mode on every single game.
But if developers want to be lazy and publishers think they'll still make money, well...
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MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
These games would be possible on PS4 at 30 FPS, lower resolution and reduced graphical settings. Wait until we get PC ports of Returnal or TLOU Part I.
Coloress_Kafka
Member
Gamers should care most about the one that directly affects gameplay.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Always a goalpost, innit? What does PC have to do with this or my statement? Why do you sound so insecure for such confident PCMR?These games would be possible on PS4 at 30 FPS, lower resolution and reduced graphical settings. Wait until we get PC ports of Returnal or TLOU Part I.
'huur durrr, those games would be possible if you lower everything, hurr durr" - that's you.
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Represent.
Represent(ative) of bad opinions
They aren’t being lazy. They’re being smart.
They’re prioritizing graphics and fidelity over framerate.
If you want to play PS4 looking games forever then buy a goddamn PS4 and nothing else.
01011001
Banned
THE XBOX SERIES S EXISTS
IF THE XBOX SERIES S CAN PLAY A GAME AT 30FPS, THE PS5 AND SERIES X SHOULD NEVER HAVE ANY ISSUE PUSHING FOR 60FPS AT SIMILAR SETTINGS THAN THE SERIES S
and that's why I will not play games on console this gen that don't offer a 60fps mode.
30fps is no longer excusable on these consoles, especially due to the existence of the Series S, and so fuck developers that don't optimise for 60fps!
IF THE XBOX SERIES S CAN PLAY A GAME AT 30FPS, THE PS5 AND SERIES X SHOULD NEVER HAVE ANY ISSUE PUSHING FOR 60FPS AT SIMILAR SETTINGS THAN THE SERIES S
and that's why I will not play games on console this gen that don't offer a 60fps mode.
30fps is no longer excusable on these consoles, especially due to the existence of the Series S, and so fuck developers that don't optimise for 60fps!
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ProtoByte
Weeb Underling
I wouldn't be so sure. I think there's a good chance, but it's not a guarantee on base PS5.
I'm hoping and honestly expecting Spider-Man 2 to be quite the advancement. I'm talking crazy swing speeds, crazy amounts of contextual animations, higher NPC counts in both the city's population/traffic and enemies, destructibility and other physics based interactions with levels/world, hopefully smarter AI, etc.
I'm not sure all of that, plus significantly enhanced visuals, plus near 4K or even 1440p resolution can be done with 60fps on PS5.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
I only mentioned PC because once these games are ported you’ll see that they can run just fine on old gen hardware.
But stay angry, buddy. I feed of that energy.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
FunkMiller
Banned
Plague Tale is absolutely fine at 40fps, so no worries here.
darrylgorn
Member
From Richard, on Requiem:
This idea that a 60fps mode compromises the high fidelity mode (let's just call it the theory of high infidelity) is utter nonsense.
It's just lazy development practice and lazy PR, because the publishers only want to show you screenshots of the game.
This idea that a 60fps mode compromises the high fidelity mode (let's just call it the theory of high infidelity) is utter nonsense.
It's just lazy development practice and lazy PR, because the publishers only want to show you screenshots of the game.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It's a 45 man team with their own in-house engine. Give them the resources larger studios have had, and that game would have been 60.From Richard, on Requiem:
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
You can bet I'll be staying on PC then. Enjoy your cinematic frame rate.
MidGenRefresh
*Refreshes biennially
01011001
Banned
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Well, this is for all the goons who kept bitching about a lack of next-gen game graphics.
You can't have your cake and eat it. If you want next-gen graphics, you have to sacrifice something.
You can't have your cake and eat it. If you want next-gen graphics, you have to sacrifice something.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
That doesn't help the topic at hand.give them a slightly edited .ini file and it could also run at 60fps
01011001
Banned
it does, the game could most likely run at 60fps for most of the game's duration by simply editing their settings file...
that's the issue.
the Series X already is a pretty steady 40fps without any Graphics changes to the standard 30fps mode
Magic Carpet
Gold Member
Valve gonna save us all with a cheap console version of the Steam Deck with super high tech specs for only twice the price of a PS5 Pro. Upgraded every year.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
01011001
Banned
oh we can, on a modded system, maybe...
the PS5 is somewhat jailbroken now, only a matter of time until people can legit edit the ini file and see how it runs.
and your argument was that they are a small team so we should cut them som slack... but all they need to do is run the game at lower settings, that already exist
jufonuk
not tag worthy
Incoming PCMR soon
Topher
Identifies as young
Exactly. To me, this is a step backwards for consoles. I'm hoping that first party will be the heroes here and deliver 60fps gaming like was promised.
" "The feel of the games was definitely something that we wanted to have more focus on, not just throwing more pixels up on the screen," says Spencer."
Phil Spencer Really, Really Wants to Push Frame Rates With the Xbox Series X
He's not hot on "just throwing more pixels up on the screen."
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
No... that was not my argument.
My argument was that DF should not be using them as a litmus for what
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darrylgorn
Member
Except that we're sacrificing something for subpar graphics as well.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
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