-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
The Assassin's Creed Shadows team has a message for our Japanese community
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
- Start date
- Community Game Dev
For all the ppl who dont understand why its super racists to put black guy in japanese AC as samurai protagonist, lets do lil analogy here, lets take this trailer of marvels Luke Cage:
Its supposedly all fictional since its marvel superhero story, but its set in harlem, so predonominaly black neighbourhood, now imagine Luke Cage is not ur black bro build like a mountain but they decided he is white, or asian(and yup, not 6'5 but say 5'8 japanese looking scrawny/normal guy instead)- wouldnt black ppl and overall every1 be pretty pissed? i know i would be, and im white af eastern european here.
Bonus bit- when that white or asian Luke Cage guy fights we dont get hip hop/rnb/rap music but some country songs, its all fictional so it makes it allright, no?
speaking as an actual factual black guy, i wouldnt freak out about it. Remember when in that best selling movie franchise where the white hero goes to the hood with the N word written on a board draped over his torso? or better yet one that you people commenting probably dont know, an old movie called Trick Baby about a white pimp who rules the hood and the pimp game tricking the cops and other pimps in order to succeed.
you guys just invent imaginary stuff to be upset about, then project it on to black people.
PeteBull
Member
U are then exception, bro, and its fine, i know i would be pissed af if they made geralt(the witcher) non white, it was already cringy af when they made tris(supposedly sexy af mage, looking like this
) look like this in the netflix series
she just looks dirtier and with a different hair color lol. but anyway sure i suppose this imaginary army of black people would be super pissed to see a white guy in a not entirely appropriate role.U are then exception, bro, and its fine, i know i would be pissed af if they made geralt(the witcher) non white, it was already cringy af when they made tris(supposedly sexy af mage, looking like this
) look like this in the netflix series
PeteBull
Member
No bro, she looks mid and black, as proven by her wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Shaffer
2 more pics of her straight from the wiki:
She was never sexy mage material but ofc DEI had to ruin stuff like they always do.
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
If you can't see the systemic racism towards Eastern Asian males in media then I don't know what to say. But the resistance against having a Japanese male lead in feudal Japan speaks volumes of this issue.
Last edited:
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
They could have at least dyed her hair. Triss’ red mane is her signature.No bro, she looks mid and black, as proven by her wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Shaffer
2 more pics of her straight from the wiki:
She was never sexy mage material but ofc DEI had to ruin stuff like they always do.
lmfao she looks like a white chick and that 2nd picture is super baked to make her look darker. a lot of SA people are of german or dutch aswell.No bro, she looks mid and black, as proven by her wiki https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Shaffer
2 more pics of her straight from the wiki:
She was never sexy mage material but ofc DEI had to ruin stuff like they always do.
Ive never seen the show because i dont watch tv cashgrabs from videogame ips, but is she any good in it?
Last edited:
PeteBull
Member
Yup but that would mean not enough "inclusion" anymore
PeteBull
Member
She is mid in it, i watched all the episodes, since im big witcher fan, so top acting skills definitely dont come to the resque there either
Last edited:
Topher
Identifies as young
What? Read what I said again my man. I didn't make any comment about racism in media. I'm talking about the arguments being made about this game. Someone being ok with the character being black doesn't mean they would be opposed to the character being Japanese. If that were the case then Ghost of Tsushima would have been met with a shitton of resistance and we all know that was not the case.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Don’t even know how you could stomach that slop. I watched Season 1 and stopped.She is mid in it, i watched all the episodes, since im big witcher fan, so top acting skills definitely dont come to the resque there either
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
Then why do so many accuse others of racism when they say they wanted a Japanese as the lead?
PeteBull
Member
Im a deeply flawed man
Topher
Identifies as young
Ask the person(s) who said that. I don't know who you are referring to.
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
My point in my original comment was that the racism towards East Asian males is so pervasive and perhaps unsconsious that some people don't even think there's anything wrong in not having a Japanese male as the lead in a game taking place in feudal Japan. So instead they lash out at people criticizing the choice as being racists, which is whack.
But the bias against Eastern Asian males runs like a current through Western media with GoT being a wonderful exception.
Last edited:
genesisblock
Member
So, ok. Then that would mean making the main character as the Asian male lead would be the least controversial option and one that should've been pushed through if this was the common conception which we know it isn't.
Topher
Identifies as young
Who is saying that?
Where are all the people here saying they would have been opposed to the main character being an Asian male?
genesisblock
Member
I never said that. The fact that we can agree on this meant Yasuke didn't have to be the main character in this game and there wouldn't be any issue... IF that were to be the case.
Topher
Identifies as young
Yeah....I agree that there is no reason Yasuke had to be the main character and there would be no issue at all if the character were Japanese instead. That's exactly the point I'm making here.
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
I don't know if you're obtuse or willfully ignorant, but I was being called racist by a gaffer just yesterday. That epithet was thrown around generously. Even 'misogynist' somehow made it into the discussion.
Edit: For clarification the racist label was thrown at those thinking that a male Japanese character would have suited the setting of the game better.
Last edited:
Kokoloko85
Member
Pirates of England
Tales of swashbuckling pirates have been around for centuries, but beyond the thrills and spills of fiction, who were the real pirates? In this article, English Heritage's Senior Historian Paul Pattison reveals the unexpected faces of England's notorious pirates.
www.english-heritage.org.uk
Piracy in the Caribbean - Wikipedia
Bartholomew Roberts - Wikipedia
Golden Age of Piracy - Wikipedia
Not sure if your trolling. Where do people think pirates from that era and region came from?
They were a mixture of people around that region, europeans and people from all over. Many of them from Wales. During the golden age of pirates, they could of been from europe, uk, or run away slaves. Or else where. So thats why it could be anyone, pirates in the carribean were from all kind of backgrounds.
I said Pirate world and Viking land because Im not sure the exact location those games were in.
The original natives of the carribean arent exactly your typical go to for pirates and arent the same people as the majority of carribean people now
Last edited:
Aguero9320
Member
Anyone else tired of the endless outrage from both sides of everything about everything?
Play it, or don't. I'm going to play it I imagine, once it goes on sale (or maybe through a brief sub to +) - looks really nice, and Odyssey is one of my all time favourites...
Play it, or don't. I'm going to play it I imagine, once it goes on sale (or maybe through a brief sub to +) - looks really nice, and Odyssey is one of my all time favourites...
Topher
Identifies as young
Neither. I wasn't aware of that, obviously, since I just asked the question. If you were referring to that one "gaffer" in your previous comments then that is fine. It came across as a more generalized description of the arguments being made and I don't see that as the case.
https://www.britannica.com/place/CuracaoPirates of England
Tales of swashbuckling pirates have been around for centuries, but beyond the thrills and spills of fiction, who were the real pirates? In this article, English Heritage's Senior Historian Paul Pattison reveals the unexpected faces of England's notorious pirates.www.english-heritage.org.uk
Piracy in the Caribbean - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Bartholomew Roberts - Wikipedia
Not sure if your trolling. Where do people think pirates from that era and region came from?
They were a mixture of people around that region, europeans and people from all over. Many of them from Wales
stop reaching, the main ethnicity was not Welsh at all.
Team Andromeda
Member
Anyone else tired of the endless outrage from both sides of everything about everything?
Play it, or don't. I'm going to play it I imagine, once it goes on sale (or maybe through a brief sub to +) - looks really nice, and Odyssey is one of my all time favourites...
Well said. It's a bloody video game at the end of the day and I bet there's 20 odd Japanese people that are really upset, while most Japanese gamers couldn't give a toss
Majormaxxx
Member
Easy way to fix it. Add a third character - a real Japanese samurai. Make it a 3 protagonist game. Make Yasuke even more fake and over the top. So everyone is happy. Easy peasy.
Kokoloko85
Member
So who was the main ethnicity of pirates?
Golden Age of Piracy - Wikipedia
Most pirates in this era were of Welsh, English, Dutch, Irish, and French origin. Many pirates came from poorer urban areas in search of a way to make money and of reprieve. London in particular was known for high unemployment, crowding, and poverty which drove people to piracy.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Most pirates were European. There's even a point in the game where Edward offers Adewalé the position of first mate but Adewalé declines, stating that a crew of mostly white guys wouldn't be on board with a black man in a position of authority over them or something along those lines. There were also African and indigenous pirates, but Europeans were the majority and a black pirate captain (such as Black Caesar) would have been rare but not unheard of.
Edward Kenway being Welsh (or white which is what the main argument is about) does represent the majority of pirates at the time or at the very least a significant portion of them.
Last edited:
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
Controversy aside, Yasuke feels like the most token of token black guys. And depending on how the story goes he could step into the realm of the "magical negro". Just, you know, for the Japanese.
Magical Negro - Wikipedia
This is my primary gripe.
Even outside of the game's depiction, Yasuke as a historical figure is a real-life example of a token black guy; i.e. he was essentially Oda Nobunaga's pet whom he paraded around for his enjoyment for the sole reason of him being dark-skinned.
Literally, the only reason we know about him, and the only reason he is notable in history is because he was a black guy found in a region where he did not belong. Literally the definition of a token.... i.e. tokenized black character.
The mere fact that Ubisoft can't see the irony of this is infuriating. As a black man myself, I'm baffled by the way middle-class liberal white people insist on using tokenized black characters as ammunition in their shitty puerile culture war. Black people really don't give a fuck about black representation as much as these white liberals do, but at least when attempts are made to do black representation in games, they should at least do their best to create interesting, well developed, relatable black characters, and not just tokenized or shitty caricatures who existence is purely designed to pander to misdirected liberal white guilt.
I feel like these folks have some sexual fetish; like they're Blacked.com addicts who fantasize about being cucked by a BBC (or two).
Last edited:
you guys do have a point here, although the choice of welsh is a stretch.
my reference was from the argument that the ethnicity should be based on the setting but even so upon researching it i learned that much of the population was african, indigenous, and the european popluation was significantly spanish, and as far as the most common ethnicity to commit piracy it would've been the french, as they legalized it to try and disrupt the spanish trade taking place there.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Last edited:
Per a historian, he did.
Translated tweet:
The guy is a communist, just because a person is Japanese does not make them correct. If you want the truth just find the sources, there are so few you could cover everything we know about yasuke in a couple minutes.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Per a historian, he did.
Translated tweet:
He means the super warrior shown in the game. Yasuke is known to have taken part in one battle and would have not been versed in traditional Japanese style combat. It's not known whether or not he was a samurai and there's no record of him donning the armor or using katanas in battle. As such, the game version is a highly romanticized one.
ReyBrujo
Member
For all the ppl who dont understand why its super racists to put black guy in japanese AC as samurai protagonist, lets do lil analogy here, lets take this trailer of marvels Luke Cage:
Its supposedly all fictional since its marvel superhero story, but its set in harlem, so predonominaly black neighbourhood, now imagine Luke Cage is not ur black bro build like a mountain but they decided he is white, or asian(and yup, not 6'5 but say 5'8 japanese looking scrawny/normal guy instead)- wouldnt black ppl and overall every1 be pretty pissed? i know i would be, and im white af eastern european here.
Bonus bit- when that white or asian Luke Cage guy fights we dont get hip hop/rnb/rap music but some country songs, its all fictional so it makes it allright, no?
For Japanese gamers it's also a nation matter. I think a better analogy would be making Captain America or Spider-Man Asian (like, Chinese).
RoboFu
One of the green rats
well that is pretty much the reason he is in this game.. soooo HISTORICALLY ACCURATE!!
Hypnotoad
Member
Henry Morgan and Bartholomew Roberts, two of the most famous pirates (and the latter being the most successful one by prize and ships captured among all pirates of the Golden Age) were both Welsh.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
It's a matter concerning Japanese history, Japanese historians would generally be the best source of knowledge on a matter like this, no?
Well, yeah, cause it's a video game. I doubt the real ancient group(s) of Assassins that inspired the first game were jumping in hay-bales from the top of towers either.
Last edited:
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Who are the crybullies?
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
ReyBrujo
Member
Somehow Google Translate converts a presumption into a certainty. まちがいなかろう is not "there's no doubt" but "it's probably right (lit. not wrong)". Note that with 上記の①～③により、彼の意思によって「侍」分になったのだろう Google Translate uses the presumption "due to the above ① to ③ , he probably became a "samurai" of his own volition" (or, "he probably considered himself a samurai").
Last edited:
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Last edited:
SCB3
Member
uh...
Sorry I shoulda clarified, as in William Adams was a real guy but they used him and took creative liberties with to tell a story. It was always portrayed as that, hell if they used Yasuke here instead, it'd be better, the issue for me is AC tries to have it both ways, Realistic to history but taking liberties at the same time.
Yeah, and there are conservative Japanese historians who disagree. Its historical interpretations between far left political activists associated with the Japanese communist party and conservatives, the same as you would get in any country. What a historian even means these days is up in the air since Thomas lockley was considered one despite being an english teacher who writes fanfic in his spare time. As far as I'm aware this Japanese historian works at a medical school which doesnt have a history course, so you'll have to forgive me if I dont trust this communists interpretation of history.
The fact that Ubisoft themselves admitted yasukes status as a samurai was debatable should tell you that there is no definitive proof and there never will be. far left historians will say he was a samurai and everyone else will disagree, this isn't surprising.
Last edited:
Lokaum D+
Member
also, lets be clear here, Willian at least makes sense since he is part of Japanese history and he is even buried in Japan where he lived his entire life, Yasuke was just a nobody that Nobunaga liked cause the color of his skin, he accompanied Nobunaga till his death and that's it, he has 0Zero importance in Japanese history.
Edit: and Adams was actually granted the title of samurai by Ieyasu "In 1605 Ieyasu further granted Adams the status of samurai,[35] and the name Miura Anjin to Addams.[c] Ieyasu also appoint Adams as jikatatori hatamoto, or a direct advisor in the court of shogun."
Last edited:
GymWolf
Member
He probably like tits.
Bernardougf
Member
Per a historian, he did.
Translated tweet:
He was not a samurai my man.... I didnt say the person didnt exist.. I said the black samurai. As much as the black queen of Egypt