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[onQ123]

Man STOP playin! This kinda pisses me off. Why MS stay messing stuff up?

Funny someone bumped the other thread a few minutes ago & I seen the comment I made saying that MS might jump to a new generation in 2025 /26

Xbox FY23 Q4 gaming revenue increased 1% year-over-year (HW down 13%)

Revenue being stable with their only release being Redfall seems fine? Hardware's not doing great, but i mean they haven't released a big game in almost 2 years?

www.neogaf.com

 

[mckmas8808]

Funny someone bumped the other thread a few minutes ago & I seen the comment I made saying that MS might jump to a new generation in 2025 /26

Xbox FY23 Q4 gaming revenue increased 1% year-over-year (HW down 13%)

Revenue being stable with their only release being Redfall seems fine? Hardware's not doing great, but i mean they haven't released a big game in almost 2 years?

www.neogaf.com

If this happens MS needs to fire Phil immediately. I'd fire him if he even suggested something this stupid in a meeting.

 

[damidu]

The X360 also launched at $399, whereas the PS3 launched at $599!!! HUGE difference.

not to mention ps3 was actually performing quite a bit worse than 360
ps3 was actually once in century kind of oppurtunity for ms, they just messed up even worse with xbox one.

 

[onQ123]

If this happens MS needs to fire Phil immediately. I'd fire him if he even suggested something this stupid in a meeting.

You have to realize that Microsoft knows they will not sell as many consoles as Sony but they are actually trying to disrupt the business model that PlayStation has found so much success in.

When you look around & see Nintendo , PlayStation & even 3rd parties selling 10 , 15 , 20 , 30 & even 50 million copies of traditional games while you haven't released a new game in years that sold close to 10 million you have to know that you messed up big time but they will cause as much disruption as they can until something change.

 

[Kerotan]

Please God no. Devs have enough trouble already making games for two different xboxy. Imagine a 3rd when it's by far the smallest market share.

 

[AngelMuffin]

XXl, XXl, now your console shouldn’t have so much trouble to sell.

 

[Gobjuduck]

Like the one x, it will come out later and just be objectively more powerful than what PlayStation is offering.

Don’t care for pro consoles, but the one x was leagues better than the one, so it was necessary.

Kinda just want this generation to get going, it feels like nothing special has come from it. Ps5 is just making uninspired sequels and Xbox hasn’t released anything big other than forza and halo.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Digital Foundry compare PS5 & Xbox Series X but in reality most people will be playing the game on Xbox Series S while there is less than 1/4 playing the games on Series X vs PS5 .

Fast forward PS5 Pro release & say it sells 10 million while Series X is around 15 million it should be fair to compare them as the premium consoles .

Series X and PS5 are the premium consoles being compared. You keep mentioning ownership levels as a point of comparison in technical specs on a YouTube channel that compares console performance in games across different devices. The sales of one or the other have nothing to do with anything. All they’re doing is comparing technical performance of the machines running the same game and seeing the minor differences.

This whole thing Series X being the “Pro” model and there not being a mid-gen refresh for X|S this console generation was *marketing* done by Xbox to talk up the capabilities of the Series X’s specs at launch. It wasn’t intended to literally mean there wouldn’t be a mid-gen refresh like a PS5 Pro or a Series X Pro.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Knowing that the other company is doing it doesn't mean that they will follow

PS4 Pro & Xbox One X didn't really sell too well

What? They absolutely did. What are you talking about.

 

[Zuzu]

If Microsoft doesn't release a Pro console I might have to start buying most of my multiplat games on my PS5 now so that I can get the 'Pro' upgrades when they come out for at least some of the games. Now I kinda wish I bought Jedi Survivor on the PS5 instead of the Series X

 

[Neo_game]

Please God no. Devs have enough trouble already making games for two different xboxy. Imagine a 3rd when it's by far the smallest market share.

Surely they will stop SS once SX Pro is released. They cannot be making 3 SKU.

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

Why would there be a refresh for either console?

Especially since we know that the developers fundamentally design around console limitations not strengths.

I don't need specs on a shelf.

 

[Edder1]

Xbox series L

Already have that, it's called Xbox Series S.

 

[onQ123]

Series X and PS5 are the premium consoles being compared. You keep mentioning ownership levels as a point of comparison in technical specs on a YouTube channel that compares console performance in games across different devices. The sales of one or the other have nothing to do with anything. All they’re doing is comparing technical performance of the machines running the same game and seeing the minor differences.

This whole thing Series X being the “Pro” model and there not being a mid-gen refresh for X|S this console generation was *marketing* done by Xbox to talk up the capabilities of the Series X’s specs at launch. It wasn’t intended to literally mean there wouldn’t be a mid-gen refresh like a PS5 Pro or a Series X Pro.

Yes the sales does have something to do with it

What? They absolutely did. What are you talking about.

LOL you really think Xbox One X sold well?

You're joking right?

 

[Fess]

oh and no they will not start “next gen” a year early, only to be obliterated again by a ps6 next year . lol

That’s not the problem for MS, the problem is that people are still waiting for Starfield, Forza, Hellblade 2, Fable, next DOOM, Gears 6, Indiana Jones, The Elder Scrolls 6, Avowed, Clockwork Revolution, State of Decay 3, etc.

When would these devs have something ready for Series 2 if that gen starts early?
It would just be another generation of waiting for 1st party content to arrive.

It’s like MS software and hardware is completely off sync. To be fair Sony have that issue too with Naughty Dog and Suckerpunch, they had a big game too late in previous gen and their big current gen games are missing. But it’s like MS have that issue with all their devs. Except Playground, well, the Forza Horizon team at least.

 

[Vox Machina]

No we won't.

Sure, doesn't change the situation. Rage against the wind bro!

 

[Heisenberg007]

Sure, doesn't change the situation. Rage against the wind bro!

Lol. Just hoping shorter generation into existence. Sure jan.

 

[draliko]

As someone suggested consoles are no more that pc tv centric hardware, and we will have shorter gens for sure, this is the future steam machines envisioned but didn't deliver. Choose your party and update every couple of years, or play on pcs and upgrade when you feel like. Backward compatibility is a resolved issue... Now forward compatibility on the other end...

 

[DenchDeckard]

I actually like the idea as well and get a new toy every couple of years

Exactly, I'm well into buying the new shiny once every couple of years. Looking forward to PS5 Pro and hope MS does something a bit wild and leftfield. If they can actually line up some decent first party releases and strong hardware in 2026 ish that would be awesome.

 

[Tommi84]

Surely they will stop SS once SX Pro is released. They cannot be making 3 SKU.

MakinG is one thing. They can stop this anytime. SUPPORTING Series S, is something MS would have to do due to their promise. If they stop releasing games on their more successful console mid gen, the backlash on the internet would be big, BIG.

 

[SHA]

I guess there's a niche market who refuses to work on series s.

 

[Neo_game]

MakinG is one thing. They can stop this anytime. SUPPORTING Series S, is something MS would have to do due to their promise. If they stop releasing games on their more successful console mid gen, the backlash on the internet would be big, BIG.

SS specs are not good enough to last till the end of this gen. Microsoft will be hoping SS guys to upgrade to SX and SX to SX Pro. Anyways right now it is all specualtion and nobody knows but I think SX Pro should release at the worse by 2025. Otherwise just release SX2 in 2027 or even 2026 if possible.

 

[Daneel Elijah]

SS specs are not good enough to last till the end of this gen. Microsoft will be hoping SS guys to upgrade to SX and SX to SX Pro. Anyways right now it is all specualtion and nobody knows but I think SX Pro should release at the worse by 2025. Otherwise just release SX2 in 2027 or even 2026 if possible.

Making a pro in 2025 would mean being late to the party like the One X was. If we get a monster in exchange like last time it could be worth it for us, but I doubt it because the SX is already really good so it will be hard to go that much further. A Xbox Next in 2027 or 2026 would either mean that Xbox is too early like the Dreamcast was( in my opinion of course) or just way too late versus the huge lead that the PS5 will have. Great consoles often have long legs. We are seeing another proof of this with the Switch. Not that I disagree with you on this matter. I also think that Xbox should try to go early next gen to try to do what they did with the 360. But they do not seem to be as good as Sony is in making consoles in the last few generations so I do not trust them to future proof this against a PS6 that should have all the advantages that a market leader can hope for. And by going latter can use better tech.

There is also a little of a personal bias/ pessimism about Microsoft in my analysis of the situation. They can do a great console. I don't think that they want that. Or at least not like they did with the 360. I hope that they prove me wrong.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Surely they will stop SS once SX Pro is released. They cannot be making 3 SKU.

Nope, they'll stop the SX. They had too many fire sales with the SS being the lead platform.

 

[T_T]

PS5 Pro 2024 , Xbox Next 2026 , PS6 2028 ?

Smart move because they can't go head to head with Playstation

They'll get absolutely killed if they do this. PS5 Pro would get all the "high-end" console mindshare for 2 whole years making the Series for an even harder sell. Then when Xbox-Next is to be released, it would release by itself and because: 1. there is no PS6 by its side and 2. Xbox has screwed the pooch with their console namings, many would not consider it a new generation. "Is this the equivalent of PS5 Pro but for Microsoft?". Then you get a Playstation two years later with a whole node and architectural advantage and the big 6 beside it.

 

[T_T]

I saw this tweet, I honestly have no idea wtf this all means. Apparently it's gonna be a "beast" if this is all true?



Assuming it is all true, you'd think MS can't afford to sit it out until 2028 with only the XSX and S. I sure as fuck hope not.

No cut CUs for yields makes the poster an instant bullshitter.

 

[mckmas8808]

You have to realize that Microsoft knows they will not sell as many consoles as Sony but they are actually trying to disrupt the business model that PlayStation has found so much success in.

When you look around & see Nintendo , PlayStation & even 3rd parties selling 10 , 15 , 20 , 30 & even 50 million copies of traditional games while you haven't released a new game in years that sold close to 10 million you have to know that you messed up big time but they will cause as much disruption as they can until something change.

Or..................................I know this is crazy. But what if.........................................they focused more on creating great content and stopped with the BS "disrupting the video game market" stuff?

 

[mckmas8808]

That’s not the problem for MS, the problem is that people are still waiting for Starfield, Forza, Hellblade 2, Fable, next DOOM, Gears 6, Indiana Jones, The Elder Scrolls 6, Avowed, Clockwork Revolution, State of Decay 3, etc.

When would these devs have something ready for Series 2 if that gen starts early?
It would just be another generation of waiting for 1st party content to arrive.

It’s like MS software and hardware is completely off sync. To be fair Sony have that issue too with Naughty Dog and Suckerpunch, they had a big game too late in previous gen and their big current gen games are missing. But it’s like MS have that issue with all their devs. Except Playground, well, the Forza Horizon team at least.

This was a great thing for Playstation because they fully supported their PS4 console till the end. Which was still selling well, by the way.

As someone suggested consoles are no more that pc tv centric hardware, and we will have shorter gens for sure, this is the future steam machines envisioned but didn't deliver. Choose your party and update every couple of years, or play on pcs and upgrade when you feel like. Backward compatibility is a resolved issue... Now forward compatibility on the other end...

Nope lol!!! These are optional upgrades for people to buy. They aren't generation-shifting.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Or..................................I know this is crazy. But what if.........................................they focused more on creating great content and stopped with the BS "disrupting the video game market" stuff?

 

[DenchDeckard]

They'll get absolutely killed if they do this. PS5 Pro would get all the "high-end" console mindshare for 2 whole years making the Series for an even harder sell. Then when Xbox-Next is to be released, it would release by itself and because: 1. there is no PS6 by its side and 2. Xbox has screwed the pooch with their console namings, many would not consider it a new generation. "Is this the equivalent of PS5 Pro but for Microsoft?". Then you get a Playstation two years later with a whole node and architectural advantage and the big 6 beside it.

Or..................................I know this is crazy. But what if.........................................they focused more on creating great content and stopped with the BS "disrupting the video game market" stuff?

Maybe they launch 2 years after Sony ps5 Pro with a significant upgrade and have some actual day one exclusives ready for the launch of the console.

Microsoft will potentially own some of the most beloved mascots in history soon and this could work for them.

Does it matter when Sony launches a console and what power it is? No

Does it matter when nintendo launches a console and what power it is? No

Imagine if Microsoft launched a console in 2026 that is a true next gen console for the time. Not a pro step up.

Now imagine it launches with a new crash team racing and other excvlusives in year one they have solid games, maybe 4 to 5 absolute banger exclusives.

I can invision it working, but I agree...all that matters is content. They can't compete launching same year as them so its worth trying something quite dramatically different. Imo

 

[Del_X]

I've been giving the idea some more thought. I think a 2025 next-gen release would be feasible if they continue the S|X strategy (two tier, same core feature set, cut-down GPU, maybe don't be as aggressive on the RAM cutbacks on the S model). If Microsoft publicly states "yeah, we'll deliver a new console generation every five years and support each generation for 7.5 years" then I don't think that's untenable. They could choose to release just 1-2 next-gen/PC exclusives early on but the bulk of the library is cross-gen for that 18 month crossover period. This also means they'll have to sell at-cost or breakeven for it to really be worthwhile.

The S|X strategy gets weird when they start to introduce ML cores for AI and need a certain minimum to achieve parity outside of upscaling.

 

[onQ123]

Nope, they'll stop the SX. They had too many fire sales with the XS being the lead platform.

People don't seem to get that Series S is the console Xbox is depending on for a bigger userbase & Series X is pretty much the show piece

No cut CUs for yields makes the poster an instant bullshitter.

Not really because this is a pro console & not ment for mass market so the yelds don't have to be as high as a base model.

Or..................................I know this is crazy. But what if.........................................they focused more on creating great content and stopped with the BS "disrupting the video game market" stuff?

They could but for their games as a service model to work they need for people to stop buying 10 , 15 , 20 & 30 million copies of games from the competition

 

[T_T]

Not really because this is a pro console & not ment for mass market so the yelds don't have to be as high as a base model.

The PS4 Pro and X1X both had disabled CUs. No reason to treat this one differently and PS5 Pro will probably sell more than its predecessor did so not having them disabled will cost Sony that much more. If they wanted higher compute they'd just make a bigger chip.

 

[Del_X]

Not really because this is a pro console & not ment for mass market so the yelds don't have to be as high as a base model.

This goes from being a possible $499-599 device to $699+ if they're expecting yields to be perfect.

 

[Bigbelly]

feels like MS are just waiting for confirmation of specs so they can one up Sony.

Doubt it will matter tho.

 

[onQ123]

The PS4 Pro and X1X both had disabled CUs. No reason to treat this one differently and PS5 Pro will probably sell more than its predecessor did so not having them disabled will cost Sony that much more. If they wanted higher compute they'd just make a bigger chip.

PS4 Pro & Xbox One X were the 1st of their kind & no one knew how good or bad they would sell . Now they have a sample size ( PS4 Pro was selling 1:10 )

 

[T_T]

PS4 Pro & Xbox One X were the 1st of their kind & no one knew how good or bad they would sell . Now they have a sample size ( PS4 Pro was selling 1:10 )

That's not an argument. You are taking the precedent and just say "That doesn't count for reasons". Even the 4090, the top of the line in GPUs that sells for $2000, has disabled compute.

 

[onQ123]

That's not an argument. You are taking the precedent and just say "That doesn't count for reasons". Even the 4090, the top of the line in GPUs that sells for $2000, has disabled compute.

"The RX 7800 XT is rumored to feature the fully-enabled Navi 32 RDNA 3 GPU. Reportedly equipped with 60 Compute Units"

RX 7800 XT vs RTX 4070 battle possibly on the cards as price, performance, and release window of the Radeon GPU leak

The RX 7800 XT is rumored to feature the fully-enabled Navi 32 RDNA 3 GPU. Reportedly equipped with 60 Compute Units, 16 GB of GDDR6 memory, and 64 MB of Infinity Cache, the card could be a direct competitor to the RTX 4070 if the latest report from RedGamingTech about the price and performance...

www.notebookcheck.net

That means it will use all the compute units

 

[Fess]

This was a great thing for Playstation because they fully supported their PS4 console till the end. Which was still selling well, by the way.

Yeah but as said the downside is that the devs that is there at the end of a generation will have nothing big ready for early next gen.

It worked for Sony since they had other big devs doing Ratchet, Ragnarök and Forbidden West.

But for MS it has not worked. And it would be terrible to repeat that again by starting a new Series 2 gen right after they’ve poured out a wave of 1st party titles for Series X.

MS need to have a couple years now with maybe 2 titles per year, with the devs going first having a couple years to ramp up for next gen. That’s the only way.

With a 2026 Series 2 launch they would need to move titles people expect to get on Series X to Series 2; like Gears 6, Perfect Dark, next DOOM, The Elder Scrolls VI, Indiana Jones, Mara, The Outer Worlds 2, Forza Horizon 6, etc.

Idk, maybe it would be okay if there was 100% backwards and forward compatibility so Series X owners can play all those games too but at lower res and fps.
But wouldn’t that make Series 2 like a Pro console?
Wouldn’t feel like a real generational shift.

 

[Dice]

Funny someone bumped the other thread a few minutes ago & I seen the comment I made saying that MS might jump to a new generation in 2025 /26

Xbox FY23 Q4 gaming revenue increased 1% year-over-year (HW down 13%)

Revenue being stable with their only release being Redfall seems fine? Hardware's not doing great, but i mean they haven't released a big game in almost 2 years?

www.neogaf.com

I will be surprised if there is a new Xbox at all. MS wants out.

 

[onQ123]

I will be surprised if there is a new Xbox at all. MS wants out.

Even though I'm sure they would love it if they didn't have to manufacture consoles anymore & get someone else to do it the only problem is that they will still need a base spec to make their games to.

I think they will make devices at a lower volume but keep upgrading them every few years to go along with the server specs or get ASUS , Lenovo & others to make devices that can play the Xbox games offline.

 

[onQ123]

I said it from the beginning that Microsoft don't really want to sell Xbox Series X in mass amounts.

It's a facade they created a console that was mostly there for show while confused customers would be buying the Series S & even now they are putting out a black Series S at a higher price because it's easier to tell people to get the " Black One that's more expensive it's the more powerful one"

 

[T_T]

"The RX 7800 XT is rumored to feature the fully-enabled Navi 32 RDNA 3 GPU. Reportedly equipped with 60 Compute Units"

RX 7800 XT vs RTX 4070 battle possibly on the cards as price, performance, and release window of the Radeon GPU leak

The RX 7800 XT is rumored to feature the fully-enabled Navi 32 RDNA 3 GPU. Reportedly equipped with 60 Compute Units, 16 GB of GDDR6 memory, and 64 MB of Infinity Cache, the card could be a direct competitor to the RTX 4070 if the latest report from RedGamingTech about the price and performance...

www.notebookcheck.net

That means it will use all the compute units

Because from a Navi 32 wafer some happen to come out perfect and AMD can charge more for them. And remember that RDNA3 started production a year ago but just now they have accumulated enough perfect Navi 32 chips to sell a product out of them in a reasonable quantity. Most of them have some problem and get downgraded to a lower class GPU. For PS5 PRO to use the full die would mean that a single faulty CU leads to the whole SoC being thrown in the trash. They don't have segmentation where they will use the lesser chips at a PS5 Pro Micro.

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah but as said the downside is that the devs that is there at the end of a generation will have nothing big ready for early next gen.

It worked for Sony since they had other big devs doing Ratchet, Ragnarök and Forbidden West.

But for MS it has not worked. And it would be terrible to repeat that again by starting a new Series 2 gen right after they’ve poured out a wave of 1st party titles for Series X.

MS need to have a couple years now with maybe 2 titles per year, with the devs going first having a couple years to ramp up for next gen. That’s the only way.

With a 2026 Series 2 launch they would need to move titles people expect to get on Series X to Series 2; like Gears 6, Perfect Dark, next DOOM, The Elder Scrolls VI, Indiana Jones, Mara, The Outer Worlds 2, Forza Horizon 6, etc.

Idk, maybe it would be okay if there was 100% backwards and forward compatibility so Series X owners can play all those games too but at lower res and fps.
But wouldn’t that make Series 2 like a Pro console?
Wouldn’t feel like a real generational shift.

Yeah, MS will not be able to do it because they are still having trouble with their developer workflow at the moment.

 

[onQ123]

They are idiots to think that a pro console will hold back the base consoles from being used lol

Think about it the PS4 Pro came out 6 years ago but PS4 is still being pushed today

 

[Crispy Gamer]

They are idiots to think that a pro console will hold back the base consoles from being used lol

Think about it the PS4 Pro came out 6 years ago but PS4 is still being pushed today

It's old footage for their new channel they've "evolved" since then

 

[Vox Machina]

Idk, maybe it would be okay if there was 100% backwards and forward compatibility so Series X owners can play all those games too but at lower res and fps.
But wouldn’t that make Series 2 like a Pro console?
Wouldn’t feel like a real generational shift.

You just described the first 3 years of this console generation

 

[DeepEnigma]

It's old footage for their new channel they've "evolved" since then

Like terafloppies.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Like terafloppies.

I think Rich just wanted people to hear how stupid Alex sounded again

 

[ChiefDada]

Yeah, there will be no Series X2. Like I said before, I'd be pissed as a Series X owner when Microsoft is actively neglecting their responsibility of optimizing to the metal for their premium console. I wonder if they even remember the Series X existence.