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[chilichote]

By the double amount of SSD bandwith, the PS5 SSD could load assets ultra fast and could be used as RAM for OS or other backgroundtasks.

Some of the bandwith is reserverd on both systems for downloads, saving gameplayvids, etc. From the 2,4/4,8GB on XSeX and the 5,5/8-9GB on PS5 a Developer could use only a fixed amount. And this amount is much smaller on the XSeX.

Sony is more flexible with this and i'm curious how these things are going.

Or in other words: the PS5 can do exactly the same like XBox with the SSDs bandwith and then still have the same amount of bandwith available for other things.

 

[Zoro7]

I think it’s great that we have 3 console manufacturers all taking a different approach. Choice is only ever good for consumers.

 

[TBiddy]

does anyone knows about decompression chip when cerny talked saying it's equal to 9 zen 2 cores but that's just decompression hw inside ps5 apu not like full fledge 9 core zen 2 cpu that would not make sense because it would fit in apu and it would be bigger then main ps5 cpu.

Wasn't he talking about Jag-cores, not Zen-cores there?

 

[Shio]

You sound/read like a different person now .

This sounds like that some actual insiders might have been aligned with a particular company to begin with.. so they had an agenda to begin with which they made us all follow. Like they wanted to set us up for disappointment. This is why the insiders made it look like they had accurate info from both sides when in fact they only had info for the side they were supporting.

 

[Lacix]

By the double amount of SSD bandwith, the PS5 SSD could load assets ultra fast and could be used as RAM for OS or other backgroundtasks.

Some of the bandwith is reserverd on both systems for downloads, saving gameplayvids, etc. From the 2,4/4,8GB on XSeX and the 5,5/8-9GB on PS5 a Developer could use only a fixed amount. And this amount is much smaller on the XSeX.

Sony is more flexible with this and i'm curious how these things are going.

I don't think the SSD would be used as ram.
SSD would die fast if they would write big data all the time.
But as a ROM it would be very good.
btw I think the SSD would be QLC based because game files don't change that often. with a smaller part as SLC.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

So, putting next-gen battle aside, i saw in "bans" section a lot of Xbox fans being banned. WTF is happening? They got a TF war. What they exaclty want???

 

[chilichote]

I don't think the SSD would be used as ram.
SSD would die fast if they would write big data all the time.
But as a ROM it would be very good.
btw I think the SSD would be QLC based because game files don't change that often. with a smaller part as SLC.

I don't know, maybe the new SSD don't die because of this, but i don't have a clue^^

But Microsoft said they could use it that way, if i am not misunderstand.

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

The potential is all there.
The best base console of this gen, PS4, wasn't as exciting as PS5 or SeX in the slighest. Don't know SeX price, but if you want to rougly emulate what will offer in terms of performance (giving is a console with custom solutions, OS and focused development) you will need a 1000/1500 dollars PC. It wasn't the case AT ALL with PS4, let alone One.
Sony is at its best in terms of teams and IPs, much more than at the start of this gen.
MS finally moved in that direction too.
Both consoles has now far better services and function compared to D1 and it will only get better.
Virtual reality, a wet dream for ages, it's here and it's real.
We have at least A FORM of BC after two fucking generations.
Indie games are exploding and you get all sort of genres and styles on every platform.
Let's just hope AAA drop a bit aggressive forms of pay to win and focus on games with less problems at D1.
But this will likely be one of the best generations ever.

 

[Darius87]

Wasn't he talking about Jag-cores, not Zen-cores there?

8 jag cores equalent is audio chip in ps5.

 

[Shmunter]

So, putting next-gen battle aside, i saw in "bans" section a lot of Xbox fans being banned. WTF is happening? They got a TF war. What they exaclty want???

Must’ve been a swell bunch

 

[KAL2006]

Honestly the power difference seem marginal obviously Series X is stronger, but will the difference be like crappy PS3 ports in comparison to 360, or Xbox One sub 1080p due to ESRAM and focus on Kinect, is PS2 in comparison to Xbox.

The difference is smaller than PS4 Pro to Series X.

I honestly don't care anymore, however the big difference is ray tracing, I have been reading Ray Tracing is linked to number of CU which is much higher on Series X. And the fact that Microsoft mentioned Ray tracing alot and Sony hasn't is a worry. So maybe power difference won't be noticeable but ray tracing will? Anyone wanna clarify this to me.

As for SSD Speed it's not a question that Sony's SSD is way better but as I have said earlier 3rd party games need to run on Series X so we don't see SSD Speed utilisation in game design so the only benefit would be minor load speeds.

 

[Shio]

8 jag cores equalent is audio chip in ps5.

I just thought of something interesting, please don't this seriously but i found it funny how each custom part of the PS5 was compared to PS4, PS3. One of the chips was compared to the PS4 jaguar cores, one to the PS3 SPUs etc, so for PS5 games these chips could help for PS5 functionality but when doing BC, could these chips be dual purpose, for BC could they help along with functionality specific to that BC console?, would be interesting.

 

[xacto]

This sounds like that some actual insiders might have been aligned with a particular company to begin with.. so they had an agenda to begin with which they made us all follow. Like they wanted to set us up for disappointment. This is why the insiders made it look like they had accurate info from both sides when in fact they only had info for the side they were supporting.

I think it's high time (at least for the people wise enough) we stopped blindingly believing in people who claim they have "inside" info. It's better we just waited for the real information to come out. Nothing bad in making educated guesses, but REALLY thinking someone would tell us anything that could endanger their jobs or their sources' jobs... and for what? So some Joe Q. Public in a forum would know some specs beforehand? Let's be serious.

We must allow ourselves not to behave like sheep.

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

8 jag cores equalent is audio chip in ps5.

A second Zen 2 CPU just for audio would have been insane and put the console stright up 599 at least lol

I think it's high time (at least for the people wise enough) we stopped blindingly believing in people who claim they have "inside" info. It's better we just waited for the real information to come out. Nothing bad in making educated guesses, but REALLY thinking someone would tell us anything that could endanger their jobs or their sources' jobs... and for what? So some Joe Q. Public in a forum would know some specs beforehand? Let's be serious.

We must allow ourselves not to behave like sheep.

Agreed, insiders popping up like crazy is the first sign that most are fake. We are here discussing about some theoretical numbers and shit, they are not gonna take part of this with the risk to sacrifice their career, is stupid only to think about it.

 

[Smoke6]

i love how in the last 24h narratives changed and the tflop power is no longer important, now the ssd speed is the most important factor, not cpu, not gpu, not rt, not input lag but the ssd. Ffs, this is sad.

I never have mentioned in my life anything about input lag or rt! All I care about is who has the best games for me to play and everyone has third party games but the in house games are what moves mountains!

this threads were for shits a giggles as the sane knows that MS has a ton of catching up to do! Y’all mad over a developers presentation being boring and we have at least a month or so to see all this put to work

 

[Spreewaldgurke]

Why is it so hard to accept, that BOTH consoles will have awesome games? We the customers are the winner here! A Competition eye on eye is the best case scenario. Both have to fight for the customers to buy their console and games. It`s never good to have one company ahead too much.

MS+Sony will battle over price --> good for us
They will convice the wide audience to buy their console through their 1st PArty games --> so qualitiy will be awesome on both systems

The real winner of the next generation are we the customers!

 

[xacto]

A second Zen 2 CPU just for audio would have been insane and put the console stright up 599 at least lol


Agreed, insiders popping up like crazy is the first sign that most are fake. We are here discussing about some theoretical numbers and shit, they are not gonna take part of this with the risk to sacrifice their career, is stupid only to think about it.

Indeed, and this "I am here, start throwing your rotten tomatoes at me" also needs to stop. It's childish, makes no sense, it doesn't help with the "next inside scoop" they "might have." Just... enough.

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

Why is it so hard to accept, that BOTH consoles will have awesome games? We the customers are the winner here! A Competition eye on eye is the best case scenario. Both have to fight for the customers to buy there console and games. It`s never good to have one company ahead too much.

MS+Sony will battle over price --> good for us
They will convice the wide audience to buy there console through their 1st PArty games --> so qualitiy will be awesome on both systems

The real winner of the next generation are we the customers!

Aside from all the theory about SSDs, custom things and such, if devs are smart they are gonna cap everything to 30 or 60 fps and sometimes it could go a bit lower in a console than in the other one, but at this point stressing a system that will achieve extreme visual fidelity just to get less aliasing on that shadow or more particles in that explosion is completely insane. Turn down graphic a bit and let the game run as it should run, if gamers will not be impressed they will not be either way, such is diminishing returns. Graphics will great improve anyway, don't get me wrong, but things like dynamic resolution or 10-20% pixels variation on 4K are not noticeable from the average eye during gameplay, anyone who says the contrary has a very keen eye and is an hardcore gamer as some guys on this forum are, but they need to understand they are the 1%, literally. This shit will not decide anything about the generation.

 

[M-V2]

A second Zen 2 CPU just for audio would have been insane and put the console stright up 599 at least lol


Agreed, insiders popping up like crazy is the first sign that most are fake. We are here discussing about some theoretical numbers and shit, they are not gonna take part of this with the risk to sacrifice their career, is stupid only to think about it.

One of the insiders I don't wanna say his name he showed his true color on Twitter by clapping to whatever Timdog says lol embarrassing..

 

[TBiddy]

One of the insiders I don't wanna say his name he showed his true color on Twitter by clapping to whatever Timdog says lol embarrassing..

Why wouldn't you name him?

 

[PaintTinJr]

I just thought of something interesting, please don't this seriously but i found it funny how each custom part of the PS5 was compared to PS4, PS3. One of the chips was compared to the PS4 jaguar cores, one to the PS3 SPUs etc, so for PS5 games these chips could help for PS5 functionality but when doing BC, could these chips be dual purpose, for BC could they help along with functionality specific to that BC console?, would be interesting.

They could very well be multi-purpose, as I suspect the Tempest 3D audio chip can either be used for PS3 backwards compatibiity, 3D audio in games like CoD, or used for both 3D audio and custom RT functionality to help the GPU RT CUs in single player games where the visuals matter more.

 

[BlackBuzzard]

One of the insiders I don't wanna say his name he showed his true color on Twitter by clapping to whatever Timdog says lol embarrassing..

Nah name him were not REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE era.

 

[DonkeyKong]

PS5 will still sell more at the same price IMO.

PS5 will sell more no matter what

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

They could very well be multi-purpose, as I suspect the Tempest 3D audio chip can either be used for PS3 backwards compatibiity, 3D audio in games like CoD, or used for both 3D audio and custom RT functionality to help the GPU RT CUs in single player games where the visuals matter more.

Honestly asking: a jaguar equivalent chip helping with RT? Could be significant in any way, if even true?

 

[Shio]

It may have been made clear but i couldn't find it but 3d Audio is a part of RDNA2 which Xbox Series X has, the PS5 is also RDNA2 but are they choosing not to include the 3d Audio from AMD and instead are using their Tempest 3d Audio solution? or is it the same thing?

 

[sinnergy]

PS5 will sell more no matter what

What sells the most must be the best? Right? RIGHT?

I rather buy the most powerful hardware , Series X, won’t care if they sell less, which they probably will.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Did anyone else think it was very telling how beyond the norm the Cell is viewed by Sony because Cerny was still talking about it in contemporary tech reveal? 13year (or more) old silicon from a gen previous and still getting that amount of stage time, and talked about with the Tempest 3D audio feels like they've carried over some of the technology to PS5.

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

What sells the most must be the best? Right? RIGHT?

I rather buy the most powerful hardware , Series X, won’t care if they sell less, which they probably will.

I'll rather buy the platform with the best games. And if SeX will have great exclusives, go for it.

 

[sinnergy]

It may have been made clear but i couldn't find it but 3d Audio is a part of RDNA2 which Xbox Series X has, the PS5 is also RDNA2 but are they choosing not to include the 3d Audio from AMD and instead are using their Tempest 3d Audio solution? or is it the same thing?

I bet it’s the same thing with a different name. Like they renamed mesh shaders to geometry engine or something in those lines .

 

[gamerforever]

It looks to me like Sony won't bother with ray tracing as it will be too much of a resource hog and MS will implement it in some form. I doubt either console will do proper ray tracing this generation, a bit like how we didn't get proper 4K last generation (for the vast majority of games).

What I really want is 4K as standard with richer textures and a stable framerate with no framepacing.

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

I bet it’s the same thing with a different name. Like they renamed mesh shaders to geometry engine or something in those lines .

You don't have to bet on anything. Inform yourself or don't, technology isn't Las Vegas.

 

[KAL2006]

I think we can conclude the following instead of the continues shit talk, damage controlling, and etc.

- Series X is more powerful in most of the key components, GPU CU and TF, CPU, RAM speed, the power difference is lower than PS4 Pro to One X, don't expect a huge difference like crap PS3 ports to 360, or PS2 to Xbox. This power won't be noticeable to the average consumer and just appeal to fanboys who look at Digitalfoundry zoom ins on pixels.

- PS5 has a much faster SSD bigger than the power difference of GPU and CPU, however how would this affect game design of 3rd party games when they need to run on Series X. At most you would get fee seconds load time difference on 3rd party games. This is mainly gonna benefit first party.

- PS5 messaging for backwards compatibility is terrible but I can bet most of your games will work, in fact almost all of your games will work. Sony need to fix up the messaging here.

The only differenciator that Sony fans should worry about is RT. They don't talk about RT much in their presentation and Microsoft showed plenty of RT. If RT power is linked to CUs then Series X has a massive advantage in this. The other differenciator is 3D Audio and it seems Sony's solution is better but does anyone really care about this unless you into VR and will devs make use of this?

That's honestly my honest opinion from both reveals.

 

[PaintTinJr]

It may have been made clear but i couldn't find it but 3d Audio is a part of RDNA2 which Xbox Series X has, the PS5 is also RDNA2 but are they choosing not to include the 3d Audio from AMD and instead are using their Tempest 3d Audio solution? or is it the same thing?

Possible, but given Cerny kept mentioning about it being a continued area of research that presummably would change through the generation, an off the peg 3D audio chip wouldn't likely be so programmable when justifying its feature cost to someone incorporating in a RDNA2 chip (IMHO). AFAIK Sony were also the first to actually develop and use 3D audio in a game - not for output to the gamer beyond multi-channel audio, but engine/cab noise simulation in GT5 to create unique audio profiles for each car to match the real world before downmixed IIRC. So they pressumably went with update custom chip technology to match the SPUs so they could take that software technology with them.

 

[ZywyPL]

The amount of PS5's SSD-related threads in the past two days is outstanding, butthurt and denial have reach a whole new level LMFAO. It's hilarious to read how the fanboys are supposedly more excited about SSD or 3D audio (that even at release will still be a work in progress) than anything else, without seeing any actual results/practical applications, hell they didn't even saw the console itself yet...

 

[-kb-]

The only differenciator that Sony fans should worry about is RT. They don't talk about RT much in their presentation and Microsoft showed plenty of RT. If RT power is linked to CUs then Series X has a massive advantage in this. The other differenciator is 3D Audio and it seems Sony's solution is better but does anyone really care about this unless you into VR and will devs make use of this?

I dont know where this started but i am seeing it everywhere, theres zero evidence that RT scales with anything aside from clock speed and CUs. The difference should be the same as the difference in TF's.

 

[Shmunter]

The amount of PS5's SSD-related threads in the past two days is outstanding, butthurt and denial have reach a whole new level LMFAO. It's hilarious to read how the fanboys are supposedly more excited about SSD or 3D audio (that even at release will still be a work in progress) than anything else, without seeing any actual results/practical applications, hell they didn't even saw the console itself yet...

You forgot to include developers and tech analysts next to the fanboys bit, otherwise nice work.

 

[Shmunter]

I dont know where this started but i am seeing it everywhere, theres zero evidence that RT scales with anything aside from clock speed and CUs. The difference should be the same as the difference in TF's.

I’d like to know some more on this topic also, paging nxgamer!

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

You forgot to include developers and tech analysts next to the fanboys bit, otherwise nice work.

Every dev who says PS5 could have something more than SeX aside from loading speeds is cleary a sold evil idiot according to the masterful "gafgineers" with years of experience in building hardware for massive corporations.
When "I don't know fuck I just look higher numbers" it's too difficult to admit. And this is what I do too, anyway.

 

[KAL2006]

I dont know where this started but i am seeing it everywhere, theres zero evidence that RT scales with anything aside from clock speed and CUs. The difference should be the same as the difference in TF's.

I stand corrected then.

So the reality is the difference between the 2 systems will be smaller than PS4 Pro and Series X.

 

[Aceofspades]

This sounds like that some actual insiders might have been aligned with a particular company to begin with.. so they had an agenda to begin with which they made us all follow. Like they wanted to set us up for disappointment. This is why the insiders made it look like they had accurate info from both sides when in fact they only had info for the side they were supporting.

Only one that has been consistent throughout the years was Matt . And since day one he was both machines were closer than ever powerwise w/ GPU lead for Xbox.

 

[Aceofspades]

Wasn't he talking about Jag-cores, not Zen-cores there?

No , I/O hardware equating 10 Zen processors with two more processors.

The Tempest Audio engine SIMD power output rivals 8 Jaguar cores - notice that sound was usually an after thought on previous consoles (except PS3) so this is huge advancement and can exciting opportunity.

 

[TBiddy]

No , I/O hardware equating 10 Zen processors with two more processors.

The Tempest Audio engine SIMD power output rivals 8 Jaguar cores - notice that sound was usually an after thought on previous consoles (except PS3) so this is huge advancement and can exciting opportunity.

Ahh ok - I must've remembered wrong. Gotta admit, I've yet been able to watch the entire presentation.

 

[Aceofspades]

It may have been made clear but i couldn't find it but 3d Audio is a part of RDNA2 which Xbox Series X has, the PS5 is also RDNA2 but are they choosing not to include the 3d Audio from AMD and instead are using their Tempest 3d Audio solution? or is it the same thing?

Sony fully customized their own solution by taking AMD CUs and turn them into SPUs like PS3 creating one powerful silicon for audio

 

[pasterpl]

Xbox Series X to harness the power of Direct X 12 Ultimate ray tracing

Along with the latest AMD and Nvidia graphics cards

www.techradar.com

 

[SportsFan581]

One thing the XbX doesn’t have is a next gen memory subsystem like the PS5. The discrepancy here unlike the GPU TF is significant. Especially once pc’s get their next gen ssd solutions, XbX will potentially be left behind over the course of time as these games get more and more dependent on this architecture. Obvious sacrifices may need to be made on XbX to accomodate the much slower streaming capability.

This made me chuckle. We'll be lucky if 25% of PCs have a drive installed that can match XSX specifications by the end of the upcoming generation. The percentage of users that are utilizing even older SATA SSDS is still small. As mobile GPUs get stronger and more laptop users can enter the gaming space, it's unlikely that low-mid level systems (even those with SSD) opt for $200 - $300 per TB options. I think the XSX is safe in the SSD department. With the added bonus of having affordable expansion storage available.

 

[JLB]

Any video I can watch? I tried Xbox's YouTube channel but didn't find it.

Its kind of a boring talk anyways. Not Cerny level, but boring.

 

[pawel86ck]

Gears 5 Xbox Series X Digital Foundry Analysis Shows Leap Over XB1X, RTX 2080 Ti Performance

A Gears 5 demo thrown together in only two weeks already shows impressive high-end PC level performance. Check it out for yourself.

wccftech.com

I thought Digital Foundry compared XSX performance to standard RTX 2080, but wccftech article mention 2080ti, so I have rewatched entire video and indeed DF shows screenshot from 2080ti benchmark saying XSX offered similar performance.

XSX will be faster than I thought.

 

[Shmunter]

This made me chuckle. We'll be lucky if 25% of PCs have a drive installed that can match XSX specifications by the end of the upcoming generation. The percentage of users that are utilizing even older SATA SSDS is still small. As mobile GPUs get stronger and more laptop users can enter the gaming space, it's unlikely that low-mid level systems (even those with SSD) opt for $200 - $300 per TB options. I think the XSX is safe in the SSD department. With the added bonus of having affordable expansion storage available.

You could be right, or wrong. That’s the amazing power of the PS5 & XSX Speculation/Analysis/Leaks Thread!

 

[Gamernyc78]

The amount of PS5's SSD-related threads in the past two days is outstanding, butthurt and denial have reach a whole new level LMFAO. It's hilarious to read how the fanboys are supposedly more excited about SSD or 3D audio (that even at release will still be a work in progress) than anything else, without seeing any actual results/practical applications, hell they didn't even saw the console itself yet...

"Alexa get this cry baby some tissue"

(Alexa) "Tissue from Amazon is on its Way and should be arriving soon."

 

[Desodeset]

In my view PS5 will be a little more efficient, but still less powerful. Many insiders already were saying that targets were higher. Many were pointing 11-11.6 tflops of performance. May be PS5 will have performance efficiancy that will be comparable to 11 tflops GPU running on lower clocks.

Thats why i think that in some modes, PS5 will perform similarly. In other modes will perform worse. But there are still so many unknowns. We know nothing about RT solution, VRS support, Geometry Engine impact, PS5 API which seems to be a big deal for developers.

Let's make a guess.

We have a visual mode for a third party game that supports Native 4k + Ray Tracing and 30 fps.

XsX will use 12.18 tflops (lower clocks) and 3.66 ghz CPU
PS5 will use 10.28 tflops (higher clocks) and 3.2 ghz CPU (dev will prioritize GPU).

There are many factors:
- CPU don't play crucial roles in higher resolution and lower frame rates;
- PS5 will have around 400 mhz higher clocks;
- We don't have a clue about PS5 RT performance;
- We don't know which console will be base platform. If developers make a game for PS5 as a base platform, the port for XsX may suffer;
- It seems that devs are praising PS5 API. Imagine Vulkan vs DX12 situation.

If PS5 perform like e 11.2 tflops GPU because of those factors, we are within 10% of performance delta. Devs will cap frames at 30, no matter that PS5 is running around 31/32 and XsX around 34-35.