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[StudioTan]

Coming into a specs thread and saying I don't want to get into a spec debate is asinine to say the least.

Meanwhile you've have 4 posts in this thread, none of which discuss the article, whose sole purpose seems to be to insult or deride other posters.

The article was interesting and I like reading about that stuff but considering I don't have the technical knowledge to understand much of it my opinion is similar to his, I'll just wait to play the games. As it happens the XB1 has more launch games I'm interested in so I'm picking that up first and I'll grab a PS4 next year when it has some games I want to play.

 

[neohwa]

good to know that it's a balanced system, if that even matters.

 

[ethomaz]

Are you suggesting all PS4 games will be in native 1080p?

No. I'm suggesting the PS4 games will run above the Xbone ones if the devs didn't target the low spec system.

And now I will say no game targeted to low spec system will run below 1080p on PS4 due hardware limitation... we will see little games below that resolution too... how many are below 1080p for the launch?

 

[c0de]

and your Point of View on:



Also specifically mentioning the ESRAM?

Then there is a problem, I don't have access to the dev-tools. But really, this is just one point from the SDK. Given that 360 also had embedded ram and I never heard of any issues, I believe MS will deliver an excellent performance as they did before.

 

[Skeff]

Serious question, ALL other specs being what they are, and no MS DRM Drama, who would pick a 4gb PS4 against an 8gb XBO?

I'd grab both, It would likely be the case that PS4 would have better multi plats on small scale games but XB1 would likely have better multiplats with a large scale and open world style games.

 

[StudioTan]

No. I'm suggesting the PS4 games will run above the Xbone ones if the devs didn't target the low spec system.

Ryse is not a PS4 game. I assume that's what you were referring to when you said 900p?

 

[Valentus]

"Firstly though, we don't have any games out. You can't see the games. When you see the games you'll be saying, 'what is the performance difference between them'. The games are the benchmarks. We've had the opportunity with the Xbox One to go and check a lot of our balance. The balance is really key to making good performance on a games console. You don't want one of your bottlenecks being the main bottleneck that slows you down."

How convenient to say this and in the background moneyhatting devs so they dont make multiplat titles superior in the PS4 version.

When MS wants, they really are PR geniuses.

 

[ethomaz]

Ryse is not a PS4 game. I assume that's what you were referring to when you said 900p?

Overall... I didn't say nothing about Ryse but it is a good example.

 

[Bossofman]

I'd grab both, It would likely be the case that PS4 would have better multi plats on small scale games but XB1 would likely have better multiplats with a large scale and open world style games.

I agree, and I think it was very possible for that to have happened, nothing wrong with a little Sony luck though, they bet big, rolled the dice and came out a winner.

 

[KKRT00]

How convenient to say this and in the background moneyhatting devs so they dont make multiplat titles superior in the PS4 version.

When MS wants, they really are PR geniuses.

Why are people even considering something like this? Engineers are not fanboys, if they have power to spare, they will use it. Development teams are not teens fighting on internet boards.

 

[RayMaker]

Only a couple of months left people.

 

[Chobel]

How convenient to say this and in the background moneyhatting devs so they dont make multiplat titles superior in the PS4 version.

When MS wants, they really are PR geniuses.

Jeez People, MS isn't stupid to do that. The games in Xbox One will be OK.

 

[miDnIghtEr20C]

Fucking context, how does it work?

.

Lol... you're so angry about the X1 not being as or more powerful than the PS4. It's wild.

Message I got was there was going to be some cool TV integration stuff with the new Kinect and new and improved Next Gen video games.

I've seen some cool TV features with the Kinect and I've seen some great looking next gen games. I guess I'm hearing the message differently. Then again, I'm not mad at this huge company. I just want to play some video game on my new xbox with my buddies. I think it still does that.

 

[StudioTan]

Overall... I didn't say nothing about Ryse but it is a good example.

So I'm not sure what you were referring to when you said XB1 games will be 900p and PS4 games will be 1080p. Forza 5 is 1080p 60fps. Both consoles will have games running at various resolutions and framerates. We don't yet have any direct comparisons with multiplatform games to know how they differ on each system.

 

[Ravage]

It's cute how desperately they are trying to push the 'PS4 is unbalanced therefore Xbone = PS4 !!!' angle.

It's kind of funny observing Microsoft's constant re-juggling of their PR message hoping something sticks. If at first you don't succeed, try, try again...

"Cloud is going to give you more computational power!" - No, it's not.
"We never targeted the best specifications on our machine." - Fair enough, but...
"We up-clocked the CPU, this makes us better!" - Well, it is a good start but...
"Everything is going to be even, 50% is not going to happen!" - Yeah, 50% is probably not what we'll see but...
"... this shit is balanced. It's been designed to work together. Basically, it's secret sauce." - Okay but... the whole initial push of the PS4 was how there is no bottlenecks and how it's perfectly balanced.


And yet every single step of the way they pick up some stragglers who have been waiting to be wrapped in the warm bosom of Microsoft once again.

Sums it up perfectly.

 

[Finalizer]

How convenient to say this and in the background moneyhatting devs so they dont make multiplat titles superior in the PS4 version.

Doubtful that MS would really bother doing this. It would simply make more sense to put that kind of money toward either funding studios to make exclusive software or to simply buy [timed] exclusivity. Makes way more sense to spend money on bullet points unique and advantageous to your system than to simply be able to say "our shit looks the same as theirs."

 

[ethomaz]

So I'm not sure what you were referring to when you said XB1 games will be 900p and PS4 games will be 1080p. Forza 5 is 1080p 60fps. Both consoles will have games running at various resolutions and framerates. We don't yet have any direct comparisons with multiplatform games to know how they differ on each system.

I can use others resolutions... PS4 720p... Xbone 640p... the difference in power exists... about multiplataform we only have PS4 footage.

BTW what is impressive in technical terms that makes Forza 5 1080p@60fps impressive?

 

[Skeff]

So I'm not sure what you were referring to when you said XB1 games will be 900p and PS4 games will be 1080p. Forza 5 is 1080p 60fps. Both consoles will have games running at various resolutions and framerates. We don't yet have any direct comparisons with multiplatform games to know how they differ on each system.

He means come november it's likely that Watchdogs, assassins creed etc etc will be 1600x900 on xb1 and 1920x1080 on PS4, Which to be honest is likely.

 

[miDnIghtEr20C]

Check out my post somewhere in this thread if you honestly don't think Microsoft's message has changed.

If any change it's been for the better. They got rid of always on Kinect... got rid of always online. Got rid of DRM....

Seems to me if any message has been changed it's been for the better. Some people wanted all of that gone... they got it.

 

[Finalizer]

If any change it's been for the better. They got rid of always on Kinect... got rid of always online. Got rid of DRM....

Seems to me if any message has been changed it's been for the better. Some people wanted all of that gone... they got it.

Policy reversals have nothing to do with their pitches on the hardware power of their console. You're deliberately missing the point.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

No. I'm suggesting the PS4 games will run above the Xbone ones if the devs didn't target the low spec system.

And now I will say no game targeted to low spec system will run below 1080p on PS4 due hardware limitation... we will see little games below that resolution too... how many are below 1080p for the launch?

So any game such as Battlefield 4 if running below 1080p native resolution on the PS4 is now the fault of the XBox One? Interesting.

I can use others resolutions... PS4 720p... Xbone 640p... the difference in power exists... about multiplataform we only have PS4 footage.

BTW what is impressive in technical terms that makes Forza 5 1080p@60fps impressive?

I'm glad the console warz are in full swing.

 

[Skeff]

So any game such as Battlefield 4 if running below 1080p native resolution on the PS4 is now the fault of the XBox One? Interesting.

I like your lack of reading comprehension there. He/She said nothing of the sort.

 

[StuBurns]

Isn't is pretty easy to use additional GPU performance to draw a larger frame? There's nothing framebuffer crippling about having to do both systems. I don't see why a PS4 game will be compromised by the XBO, especially stuff like BF4 which is also on PS3.

 

[Biker19]

How convenient to say this and in the background moneyhatting devs so they dont make multiplat titles superior in the PS4 version.

When MS wants, they really are PR geniuses.

I really doubt that will happen, because they would have to pay every single 3rd party publisher to do that, & that'll be next to impossible. Not to mention that it'll make Microsoft's investors furious & will force Microsoft to close down their Xbox division.

Best bet for Microsoft is to just suck it up for the next 6-7 years & wait for the next generation of consoles to come around (if there's gonna be a 4th Xbox console, that is).

 

[Chobel]

Lol... you're so angry about the X1 not being as or more powerful than the PS4. It's wild.

Message I got was there was going to be some cool TV integration stuff with the new Kinect and new and improved Next Gen video games.

I've seen some cool TV features with the Kinect and I've seen some great looking next gen games. I guess I'm hearing the message differently. Then again, I'm not mad at this huge company. I just want to play some video game on my new xbox with my buddies. I think it still does that.

Did you really read my comment? When did I say I'm angry?

In case you didn't understand it, Y2kev said MS are changing their message again this time is about balance, Senjutsusage said what's wrong with balance, I said to SenjutsuSage that Y2kev comment was about changing message not balance.

 

[c0de]

BTW what is impressive in technical terms that makes Forza 5 1080p@60fps impressive?

I know where you want to lead this, it's too obvious. Please bake your argument in the oven and eat it, so it may never ever come up again. Thank you.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

I like your lack of reading comprehension there. He/She said nothing of the sort.

No. I'm suggesting the PS4 games will run above the Xbone ones if the devs didn't target the low spec system.

And now I will say no game targeted to low spec system will run below 1080p on PS4 due hardware limitation... we will see little games below that resolution too... how many are below 1080p for the launch?

I guess I must be slower than DDR3 ram then.

 

[szaromir]

Isn't is pretty easy to use additional GPU performance to draw a larger frame? There's nothing framebuffer crippling about having to do both systems. I don't see why a PS4 game will be compromised by the XBO, especially stuff like BF4 which is also on PS3.

They won't be, especially given the scalable nature of modern engines.

 

[Cidd]

This thread really made me lose hope in humanity...

I've seen my fair share of spin/denial but this is by far one of the worse I've read...

I guess "BALANCE" will be the new catchphrase in the coming months now?

 

[Valentus]

Why are people even considering something like this? Engineers are not fanboys, if they have power to spare, they will use it. Development teams are not teens fighting on internet boards.

Jeez People, MS isn't stupid to do that. The games in Xbox One will be OK.

Doubtful that MS would really bother doing this. It would simply make more sense to put that kind of money toward either funding studios to make exclusive software or to simply buy [timed] exclusivity. Makes way more sense to spend money on bullet points unique and advantageous to your system than to simply be able to say "our shit looks the same as theirs."

Edge Article from a while says that some devs would have to "castrate" PS4 version so one version wasnt look that bad in front of the other:

One source even suggested that enforcing parity across consoles could become a political issue between platform holders, developers and publishers. They said that it could damage perceptions of a cross platform title, not to mention Xbox One, if the PS4 version shipped with an obviously superior resolution and framerate; better to “castrate” the PS4 version and release near-identical games to avoid ruffling any feathers.

It could be publisher's thing so they can sell the most in both versions, or could be MS thing. I believe is a mix of both but more in the second one, more now that we hear and read this "let the games speak" nonsense of most of MS PRs

 

[Finalizer]

Isn't is pretty easy to use additional GPU performance to draw a larger frame? There's nothing framebuffer crippling about having to do both systems. I don't see why a PS4 game will be compromised by the XBO, especially stuff like BF4 which is also on PS3.

I think it's more about the whole least common denominator angle, where developers will supposedly intentionally target their games for the weakest hardware as a baseline and either not bother optimizing for stronger systems or at least not put as much effort into it. Dunno how much to buy into that line of thinking, though I wouldn't be surprised if some games were designed along something like this principle.

And it's a fair point to remember that a lot of 3rd party multiplats are still being designed with current-gen constraints in mind anyway, heh.

Edge Article from a while says that some devs would have to "castrate" PS4 version so one version wasnt look that bad in front of the other:

I personally take that to mean more like what GopherD was suggesting, that you wont see huge differences in graphical fidelity in itself between the two systems; rather, most of the time it'll come down to "simpler" things like resolution, anti-aliasing, etc. I doubt there's any sort of foul play at work in this regard.

 

[Bundy]

I know where you want to lead this, it's too obvious. Please bake your argument in the oven and eat it, so it may never ever come up again. Thank you.

As I can see, your post was pre-baked, too
But he is right! Driveclub does a lot more than Forza.

 

[iceatcs]

If MS felt their system compare to the competitor system. They should shut up and let 'Lens of Truth' do this job.

One day sales don't matter, won't change their mind to whatever results. But there are people still on the fence waiting for real comparison.

 

[Skeff]

I know where you want to lead this, it's too obvious. Please bake your argument in the oven and eat it, so it may never ever come up again. Thank you.

I see what you did there, Sadly I can't be bothered to come up with something fancy pointing out the reflected HUD on the Hood of the car, I suppose I could have gone with an Xzibit post about hoods/HUDS?

EDIT: ok let's try, Yo Dawg I heard you like HUD's so I put a HUD on your hood so you can see your HUD whilst your looking at your Hood.

 

[miDnIghtEr20C]

Policy reversals have nothing to do with their pitches on the hardware power of their console. You're deliberately missing the point.

Oh... you're just talking about they're take on console power. Well, I'd say improving things like clock speeds are fine and dandy if it works. I really don't care at all about their talk with the cloud and the rest. I'll let the games do the talking. Just like I did this gen when I took a chance with a launch day 360.

 

[beast786]

This thread really made me lose hope in humanity...

I've seen my fair share of spin/denial but this is by far one of the worse I've read...

I guess "BALANCE" will be the new catchphrase in the coming months now?

You thoughts are nicely balanced.

 

[c0de]

As I can see, your post was pre-baked, too
But he is right! Driveclub does a lot more than Forza.

Sure, on a system with 50% more performance, with a better graphics driver I had to learn today and with double the time to render an image.

 

[Theecliff]

Oh boy, these sorts of threads are always a good read.

 

[H_Prestige]

So the Xbone is more balanced, yet it's also more difficult to code for and produces inferior results. How does that work?

Even if it is more "balanced", what is the value of balance in that case? If I'm a dev, I'll take the ps4 any day of the week and twice on sunday.

 

[Salvor.Hardin]

So the MGS 5 video on the X1 looks no different than what was shown on the PS4.

 

[Averon]

This thread really made me lose hope in humanity...

I've seen my fair share of spin/denial but this is by far one of the worse I've read...

I guess "BALANCE" will be the new catchphrase in the coming months now?

I doubt it'll last months. MS is changing their tune every few weeks it seems. I can totally see them peddling a completely different line by early October.

 

[Bundy]

Sure, on a system with 50% more performance, with a better graphics driver I had to learn today and with double the time to render an image.

You should bail out here, as it seems.
Not good for your health

So the MGS 5 video on the X1 looks no different than what was shown on the PS4.

?
btw. Both "builds" were running on the same hardware as it seems (PC)
Just with different controllers/pads

 

[beast786]

So the MGS 5 video on the X1 looks no different than what was shown on the PS4.

time to wrap up all the discussions. lets all go home.

 

[c0de]

You should bail out here, as it seems.
Not good for your health

What? I am totally fine

 

[Louis Cyphre]

time to wrap up all the discussions. lets all go home.

They have an uphill battle and the battle isn't the specs, it's the price.

 

[c0de]

btw. Both "builds" were running on the same hardware as it seems (PC)
Just with different controllers/pads

And still we probably won't see a driver from Sony and MS will give us a driver somewhen 2014.

 

[Bundy]

And still we probably won't see a driver from Sony and MS will give us a driver somewhen 2014.

Poor c0de ;(
Meltdown incoming

Spoiler

 

[AgentChris]

So the MGS 5 video on the X1 looks no different than what was shown on the PS4.

 

[Vizzeh]

So the Xbone is more balanced, yet it's also more difficult to code for and produces inferior results. How does that work?

Even if it is more "balanced", what is the value of balance in that case? If I'm a dev, I'll take the ps4 any day of the week and twice on sunday.

This....

Why didnt Leadbetter hit these technical fellows with proper technical retorts instead of allowing the info to flow 1 direction.

It also shows their design aswell.. Where sony took a step back and re-designed their flaws, Microsoft seemed to copy the 360 Arhitecture, edram to EsRAM and arrived at DDR3, this seemingly is why MS are so confused about their architecture criticisms. When infact its not that X1 is an improvement over 360 but that when compared to PS4 they seemed to advance further + improve

 

[Chobel]

Perfect.