Even if it was on an official channel, I would call BS on the claim that it was recently decided to go cross platform. If they claimed some sort of mistake in originally suggesting it was exclusive then I would give that claim some consideration but would still be suspect. The length of time it takes for games to get ported from PS4 to PS5 just seek WAY too long to make me believe they can easily and quickly go backwards.
The Series S GPU sits firmly in the last generation... People can argue all they want that all the other aspects of the console are "next-gen", its lacking memory and much slower GPU holds it back. As we have seen before some games need to have their resolution cut down to sub HD resolutions to work on the S, some games have more frame rate drops too, even an old 1080p set will show not
Yes, but the resolution will be so low that you will not see the details, the frame rate will drop so hard it will make the game less enjoyable.
Wow, that's a lot of buzz words!
It's not a worthwhile upgrade if you prefer.
No two games/engines use hardware resources equally. Just because 4A Games got ray tracing to run in Metro Exodus on Series S doesn't mean every other developer will. Id Tech 7 engine could be using the hardware in different ways, it could be using more bandwidth, more memory, far more than what's available on the S than Metro Exodus's 4A engine did to do the same RT calculations even with optimizations in place, it's a known fact that RT is very mem intensive. There are differences in texture, model quality. DOOM Eternal's asset quality definitely looks a lot better in comparison which is evident when looking at the memory utilization on PC even without turning RT on. So it is likely they had to give up RT in favor of higher-quality assets because having both could be putting more burden on the Series S's tiny memory & bandwidth. I don't know why you people are in denial despite well-reputed devs like Remedy and Id Software speaking up about its shortcomings.
Its getting to the point now where I think you need to familiarise yourself with the sticky thread.
This is too speculative.
Yes, however.... the games still run at lower resolution.
Thats exactly what the S is for!
Yes, how?
Yes, how?
This is what MS claims to be the console's performance target:
Performance "target", MS is setting an expectation.... if it really did run most games at or around 1440p 60fps it would be amazing (one would even wonder why there would be a need for a better console at all)... but it struggles to keep 60fps at 1080p.
Not a true next generation game especially when you're bandwidth restricted. The XSS put a limit on 3rd party titles the moment devs were briefed on its random access memory
So every Series S owner will be a GamePass Ultimate subscriber? Bit of a reach, especially with the lag some people find on it, and if you're on a right budget I guess you're more likely to have crappy broadband....
It was actually initially marketed as a 1440p machineIt was marketed at a lower resolution.
Don't worry I don't intend to force you to do anything
. That's since been downgraded to 1080p. Already some games are dipping below 720p....
199$ is the magic number. That's a fact.
And ps5 and xsx marketed as 4k but see under 1080p especially ps5.It was actually initially marketed as a 1440p machine
I have no problem with MS selling the series X or the One X as 4K capable, there is a technical truth to the information... 1440p is a completely random number, the Series S outputs to 4K as well, so even calling it a 4K console would be grounded in reality, maybe even saying that it targets 1080p for gaming would make more sense, it's closer to the ground truth and what people experience with it.
You are right, but it seems like a fair assessment of what people can expect, or at least it's close enough in most cases, but if we want to be consistent they should probably talk about the 8k output and be done with giving numbers for things they don't control.
We haven't even started with next-gen just yet when last-gen games are still being considered when making a game. That is the issue here. We haven't even seen the full motion of what these machines can do due to that reason
Do you believe that over actual dev's statements?
I think mathematically xss is as close to 1440p as xsx is 4k
Right now there are NO games that are using SFS so to declare it won't be useful is way premature. Optimization never meant that the XSS would use every graphical feature. The ratio of fast to slower memory on the XSS is different because its an 80:20 split over the 60:40 split on the XSX. It has more of the faster memory so again for the resolution the system is targeting it won't be a problem for it to run games with less graphical detail.I do. Watch his recent DOOM interview from two months ago with Digital Foundry where John brings up Series S asking why ray tracing is missing from that console, Billy replies that they tried RT out on Series S, even with optimization, they couldn't so they chose to drop RT altogether. Then he adds, there are differences in the hardware, y'know" in other words, even with optimization the S wasn't capable of RT in DOOM due to "differences in the HW" i.e. hardware limitation. He initially brought up two major issues with the console: one was split memory banks with drastically slower speeds (bandwidth) which he said will be a major issue, the second big issue was the amount of memory itself, and how much lower it was.
And now we see the results of those issues, no RT from his game on the console and he was right from the get-go. We know the game already makes use of VRS tier 2 on Xbox (even the PC version doesn't), who knows maybe they're even using SFS here which would come under the "optimizations" he spoke of.We won't know until they do something like a SIGGRAPH or GDC talk. Still, features like SFS are only going to get you so far, it's a memory-saving feature, not an infinite memory feature. At the end of the day, you are going to hit a wall one way or another. IMO MS should have added a bit more memory and slightly more BW to avoid situations like this, and to tackle the issues that Billy brought up. After all, this is the talented id Software we're talking about... MS 1P studio, not some no-name dev company from the industry.
Nope. Your whole comparison is flawed because the PS4 and PS5 are NOT from the same generation AT ALL. The PS4 lacks features the PS5 has entirely and it has nothing to do with it's hard drive or loading a game. People here keep comparing the XSS to the Switch and PS4 and it's clear they have no idea what the XSS is capable of or even what generation it belongs to. People also call MS liars when not every game on the XSS has raytracing which was never claimed. Raytracing isn't a core gameplay feature it is a graphical feature. The same features that would be compromised on a device with lower graphical capabilities.
PS5 was marketed as a 4K console. Returnal renders internally at 1080p.It was actually initially marketed as a 1440p machine
The 1440p did not imply ALL games would run at that resolution and you know it. More disingenuous nonsense.If the concern is sincere about the XSS and it's longevity then the same issues could be applied to the PS5 or even the Switch. In a world where the Switch and even the poorly designed X1 can get support an entire generation the idea of the XSS not making it is laughable. No matter how you slice it the underpowered XSS can do things the PS5 cannot. It has MORE 120 fps titles and features. The XSS remains a superior value and your feelings won't change that. I remain grateful that MS doesn't base it's decisions on what smaller markets do.Erm...look at the original post. He literally says he thinks Series S in its current form isnt likely to last very far into the generation. Is this decline likely to happen sooner or later if sales continue to be poor?
Of course I also mentioned the lack of storage space, RAM, aswell as the limited GPU power of the console and you were 'Nah it'll be right'. Then you got triggered, started console warring and talking about 1440p support, cloud saves, GamePass and having to pay for PS5 upgrades. And you've got the balls to talk about obfuscation and histrionics.
And of course the logical conclusion - PS5 is lacking some minor features some of which can easily be added, meanwhile Series S is simply underpowered as OP and others suggest, and the hardware specs for this original revision can't be changed (outside of the Seagate expansion), and will be really chugging along once proper next-gen games get more demanding with less resolution and worse frame rates as a result.
At least you've stopped talking nonsense about the Xbox brand in the European market and that being the main reason for Series S potentially being a flop here
Of course there are devs that say the XSS isn't a problem at all. Do you believe THOSE devs? Seems like some cherry picking is going on.
There isn't a game out that runs better on the X1X over the XSS. Most games on the X1X are locked at 30fps. The XSS even has FPS boost which takes games X1X never ran at 60 and improves the framerate. Look at a game like Cyberpunk 2077 which ran considerably better on the XSS than the X1X. If you think there isn't enough games to play that's your opinion but the power of the XSS isn't the issue. As I've told other people the storage space isn't a concern for casual gamers who only play a few games. Hard core gamers wouldn't usually go for the XSS in the first place and if they did they have options to save their games for an affordable cost.
Dammit Riky you have been dropping nothing but knowledge over and over again! I want people to complain that Psychonauts 2 isn't running at 1440p like MS said! They lied again!
Of that's a fact is it. Yet the PS2, PS4 and Switch managed to do quite a big of magic before hitting $200. Two of those consoles never even hit $200
.
Why does all your posts have to be so antagonising all the time.Right now there are NO games that are using SFS so to declare it won't be useful is way premature. Optimization never meant that the XSS would use every graphical feature. The ratio of fast to slower memory on the XSS is different because its an 80:20 split over the 60:40 split on the XSX. It has more of the faster memory so again for the resolution the system is targeting it won't be a problem for it to run games with less graphical detail.
You'd also be shocked to hear that Far Cry 6 won't have raytracing on the PS5 or any current gen console. I suppose that proves that developers will ultimately decide what features they will incorporate in their games on the hardware they have available. Just because the XSS is capable of using raytracing doesn't mean that ALL games on the XSS will have it just like ALL PS5 and XSX games won't have it either. In addition when did raytracing become a core feature that all games need? Returnal, a PS5 only game that isn't being 'held back' by the XSS, doesn't have raytracing and renders internally at 1080p. Does this mean the PS5 won't make it to the end of the generation? I'd suspect you'd disagree.
Your concern about the XSS doesn't strike me as genuine. Let me know when an XSS version of a game is missing characters, levels, or has worse enemy AI. These are the core tenants of a game not graphical features MS ALWAYS said the XSS would have less of. This is just another case of you holding the XSS to a standard you don't hold more expensive consoles to. It's pretty odd.
Nope. Your whole comparison is flawed because the PS4 and PS5 are NOT from the same generation AT ALL. The PS4 lacks features the PS5 has entirely and it has nothing to do with it's hard drive or loading a game. People here keep comparing the XSS to the Switch and PS4 and it's clear they have no idea what the XSS is capable of or even what generation it belongs to. People also call MS liars when not every game on the XSS has raytracing which was never claimed. Raytracing isn't a core gameplay feature it is a graphical feature. The same features that would be compromised on a device with lower graphical capabilities.
Quick resume, FPS boost, SFS are core features of the current generation Xbox. My point about features is that if someone is going to accuse MS of being misleading it should be very easy to show the missing features the XSS has when compared to the XSX. Just like I can show the missing features the PS4 has compared to the PS5. No one has been able to point out ONE missing feature outside of the optical drive which I'm certain MS clearly stated was NOT there. Again people are more interested in inventing issues with the XSS that do not exist.
PS5 was marketed as a 4K console. Returnal renders internally at 1080p.
If the concern is sincere about the XSS and it's longevity then the same issues could be applied to the PS5 or even the Switch. In a world where the Switch and even the poorly designed X1 can get support an entire generation the idea of the XSS not making it is laughable. No matter how you slice it the underpowered XSS can do things the PS5 cannot. It has MORE 120 fps titles and features. The XSS remains a superior value and your feelings won't change that. I remain grateful that MS doesn't base it's decisions on what smaller markets do.
The PS is a bigger brand globally and people in Europe are not going to rush out to buy a casual console from the company that just came off of the X1. Your nonsense about the 360 is just that. That was TWO generations ago and in business you are only as good as your last product. Well MS last product was the X1 and it didn't set the world on fire so there is no wonder the Series consoles aren't selling as well. Enthusiasts are going to grab the XSX when it is available because they are enthusiasts. Casuals won't grab the XSS in Europe because they aren't going to care about the company who last delivered the X1. Again your commentary doesn't apply to the N. America, the biggest market, so again your reasoning that the power of the XSS is the why it doesn't sell as in Europe is completely flawed. It is a pure popularity contest. You do seem quite proud to point out that PS is more popular globally and if that makes you sleep better at night I'm happy for you. It still has no baring on the topic on whether or not the XSS will make it to the end of the generation. It will but your concern is noted.
Of course there are devs that say the XSS isn't a problem at all. Do you believe THOSE devs? Seems like some cherry picking is going on.
There isn't a game out that runs better on the X1X over the XSS. Most games on the X1X are locked at 30fps. The XSS even has FPS boost which takes games X1X never ran at 60 and improves the framerate. Look at a game like Cyberpunk 2077 which ran considerably better on the XSS than the X1X. If you think there isn't enough games to play that's your opinion but the power of the XSS isn't the issue. As I've told other people the storage space isn't a concern for casual gamers who only play a few games. Hard core gamers wouldn't usually go for the XSS in the first place and if they did they have options to save their games for an affordable cost.
Dammit Riky you have been dropping nothing but knowledge over and over again! I want people to complain that Psychonauts 2 isn't running at 1440p like MS said! They lied again!
Yes it's a fact, imagine the sales if they were 199$. Your argument is trash. What about the other quote? No reply?Of that's a fact is it. Yet the PS2, PS4 and Switch managed to do quite a big of magic before hitting $200. Two of those consoles never even hit $200
There is no concern over the Series S, that's just something you've thrown around as you've become more and more triggered by the logical analyses of the Series S's limitations and what bearing this might have on its future in this thread, and it's lack of sales in comparison to the other next-gen consoles.
. After spending what seems like an age going on about GamePass and how the PS5 is bad value comparatively. After Microsoft has been so consumer friendly with its backwards compatibility program. After Microsoft bought Bethesda. Logic? Nah, why bother with that!.
Imagine, imagine imagine. How about I just look at the current reality instead?
Yet it still isn't a 4k games machine. Maybe they should change it.
