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[direct_quote]

The problem is that it the following sequence of occurrences is unfortunately a real/likely possibility.

"Man, I'm winning only 40-50% of my matches. (against same-ranked players.) This is so hard. And I really like winning, I have so much more fun when I'm winning."
*switches to Vanilla Sagat/AE Yun*
"Oh, man, this is so much easier now. I'm da bes! Stop whining about my character and learn to play N00BS"
*3 months pass*
"I want to play some SF4, I just saw those awesome GFs with Hugo v Poison. Let's go play online. MAN why am I facing nothing but Yun, Cammy, Akuma, Sagat? F this stuff, I'm gonna go play me some LoL."

Ranked provides an organized/available play experience for players 24/7. It's not meaningless in terms of keeping players invested in the game and IP. In Hearthstone design they mentioned one of their big things was a minimization of the "buckets" that players would be sorted into, and how it was imperative it be kept low. Currently, there's only Ranked Constructed, Unranked Constructed, and Limited. The more buckets you add, the more you risk you risk a bucket going empty.

If anything this feature would add longevity and variability to SF4 online, because at the moment I can only play this game in strides because I randomly get bored of it. If I had an optional yolo mode in endless battles when I'm really bored of SF4 I'd just give it a whirl.

Plus a reason casuals usually quit games like SF4 because the grind is mostly the same online. You see games like LOL and Dota2 have endless updates and variability in their games, TF2 has several different multilayer modes that are diverse..., but SF4 has just ranked and endless plus useless tournament mode and team battles.

 

[Dahbomb]

is there something about this unblockable that makes it so much worse than all the other unblockables in the game? didn't flux get out of it with a 4f snapback?

or is it just the straw that broke the camel's back?

Firebrand unblockable is one of three "hard" unblockables in the game. All 3 are designed with a really charge time (Viper FA, Taskmaster Swordmaster and Firebrand). The difference between FB unblockable and those two unblockables is that his unblockable is more guaranteed in more situations. The Tenderizer assist of Skrull makes it air tight while Doom provides the top beam assist for both characters and gives FB more damage due to raw tag combos.

Now there is still some debate as to how air tight this set up is but under normal circumstances if FB hits you once you lose the game. This is most similar to that Iron Man team in MVC2 where he does an infinite into guard break into another infinite on incoming characters.

The difference between this and Zero is that Zero just has ambiguous mix ups on incoming, if you guess right you can get out. Think of it like how in SF4 you get hard knocked down and you have to guess between cross up or not. Zero does have a "soft" unblockable (simultaneous high/low hit) in Sogenmu mode if the opponent is pinned down with Jam Session but chicken block and advance guard can negate it if you know its coming. Other teams have soft unlockables too but they usually have responses where as FB's unblockable usually does not. Like say a snap back, a raw tag, a cross over counter or X factor reversal move/hyper. All these options are unavailable against his FB as his unblockable puts you in the air... can't do snapback, ground reversal hypers, raw tag, CCs etc.

It probably was the tipping point for him although PRRog himself uses a super cheap team so he can hardly complain. I would say FB combined with Zero, Vergil and Morrigan pushed him over the edge.

 

[Lost Fragment]

People actually want Edition Edition to be the tourney standard? What in the fucking fuck.

The danger is that ranked gets abandoned in favor of unranked, which would not be a good thing for the game. Race to the bottom/lowest common denominator in action.

Yeah I figure it's this. They could easily make a separate online mode for this but cannibalizing your other online modes too much is no bueno. SF4 online already has problems that would be alleviated by having a larger pool of players to draw from and this would go in the opposite direction if there was an online mode for it.

 

[proccor]

Yea. The first time he experienced Firebrand (it was against Zak Bennet actually) he went into a ridiculous salt rage and FChamp had to calm him down. Then when Apologyman started using his full unblockable team at WMW PRRog got even more salty and said he would quit the game after EVO. Now he just goes into full crowd monster mode when Apologyman is doing work with FB.

He also made a recent tweet about it at SCR.

The tweet referenced above:

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

So many Instant Kills.

It should be interesting to see how Kokonoe players adapt to the new changes at EVO since the patch will have been out for a while.

 

[kirblar]

If anything this feature would add longevity and variability to SF4 online, because at the moment I can only play this game in strides because I randomly get bored of it. If I had an optional yolo mode in endless battles when I'm really bored of SF4 I'd just give it a whirl.

Plus a reason casuals usually quit games like SF4 because the grind is mostly the same online. You see games like LOL and Dota2 have endless updates and variability in their games, TF2 has several different multilayer modes that are diverse..., but SF4 has just ranked and endless plus useless tournament mode and team battles.

The reason shorter patch cycles work for LOL/DoTA (and in a sense, MTG, with the +3 months card influx) is because the time investment required in order to pick up the new characters/cards and use them is fairly minimal. SF4 and other FGs require learning/muscle memory/reactions to be trained and because of that you have to go with a longer patch cycle, only stepping in with a hotfix if its a singular gigantic issue that threatens the game. Those games do just fine with the shorter turnaround time.

 

[Anne]

So many Instant Kills.

It should be interesting to see how Kokonoe players adapt to the new changes at EVO since the patch will have been out for a while.

This is anime, the majority of Koko players will cry and switch or just drop the game.

 

[kirblar]

This is anime, the majority of Koko players will cry and switch or just drop the game.

The rest of the world will feast on their salty tears.

 

[Rice-Eater]

I want TO's to at least test the waters with Editions Select and see how people feel about it. Maybe everybody uses Ultra at first, but slowly everybody switches to Edition Select because it's what most people prefer. Not saying it will happen, but at least give it a shot first. It should at the very least be a popular side game at tournaments. I'd enter with V-Seth, V-Ryu(love the way that sounds lol) or AE-Yun.

Hopefully it gets patched in the future to at least allow it in Endless.

 

[Venfayth]

edition select is a party mode

it has no place in serious play

 

[direct_quote]

The reason shorter patch cycles work for LOL/DoTA (and in a sense, MTG, with the +3 months card influx) is because the time investment required in order to pick up the new characters/cards and use them is fairly minimal. SF4 and other FGs require learning/muscle memory/reactions to be trained and because of that you have to go with a longer patch cycle, only stepping in with a hotfix if its a singular gigantic issue that threatens the game.

I don't think that's why SF isn't updated as frequently but more of a development team issue. There's probably still large dedicated teams on task for Dota and LOL (and probably even TF2), while it seems Capcom needs to convince the higher ups first and then scrape together a team. And I don't see how updates to characters in Dota or LOL or the addition of new characters wouldn't require as much adjustment / adaption compared to fighting games.

 

[alstein]

This is anime, the majority of Koko players will cry and switch or just drop the game.

Not just anime games.

 

[kirblar]

I don't think that's why SF isn't updated as frequently but more of a development team issue. There's probably still large dedicated teams on task for Dota and LOL (and probably even TF2), while it seems Capcom needs to convince the higher ups first and then scrape together a team. And I don't see how updates to characters in Dota or LOL or the addition of new characters wouldn't require as much adjustment / adaption compared to fighting games.

Look at what happened with NRS and MK9/Injustice- those super frequent patch cycles were pretty obnoxious since people had to constantly unlearn stuff. It's good to patch, but you can definitely patch too much in this genre.

 

[Dahbomb]

New characters (or adjusting to reworked old characters) in DOTA/LoL take way less time to get a grip of than in fighting games.

I don't think I have ever "practiced" in DOTA 2 like I do in fighting games. Most I ever did was when I first started the game I practiced stop animation canceling and last hitting timing with a few heroes... after that I never practiced again (as in solo). If there's a new hero I would play it in a live match and learn as I go, takes 3-4 games to get the hang of things.

 

[Anne]

Not just anime games.

True, I guess I just notice more cause anitwitter is pretty silly about things.

 

[.la1n]

Yeah I can't see edition select being viable for any competition outside of niche side tournaments but still a great feature to have. Surprised Capcom made the effort to be honest.

 

[Slamtastic]

after that I never practiced again (as in solo). If there's a new hero I would play it in a live match and learn as I go, takes 3-4 games to get the hang of things.

And there once was a time where you never practiced solo in fighting games, you just played matches for a quarter a piece and learned on the fly!

 

[kirblar]

Yeah I can't see edition select being viable for any competition outside of niche side tournaments but still a great feature to have. Surprised Capcom made the effort to be honest.

I was hoping for SF2 (Supers only, no Focus/EX) and SF3 (No Focus/Ultras, + Parries) modes as well, but this is just as good.

 

[Dahbomb]

I was hoping for SF2 (Supers only, no Focus/EX) and SF3 (No Focus/Ultras, + Parries) modes as well, but this is just as good.

That would be pretty cool.

 

[GooeyHeat]

The problem is that it the following sequence of occurrences is unfortunately a real/likely possibility.

"Man, I'm winning only 40-50% of my matches. (against same-ranked players.) This is so hard. And I really like winning, I have so much more fun when I'm winning."
*switches to Vanilla Sagat/AE Yun*
"Oh, man, this is so much easier now. I'm da bes! Stop whining about my character and learn to play N00BS"
*3 months pass*
"I want to play some SF4, I just saw those awesome GFs with Hugo v Poison. Let's go play online. MAN why am I facing nothing but Yun, Cammy, Akuma, Sagat? F this stuff, I'm gonna go play me some LoL."

I don't know if that sequence of play is as likely as you make it sound, simply because getting into a ranked game is basically always quicker and easier than getting into a lobby. When the tournament standard is three button presses away, and the silly stuff is off to the side and takes more time to set up, there will be a majority of players that will play the "real game" instead of the goofy modes.
Really, I think that that is a reason why well-thought-out default settings are important even if there are lots of other options, because the default always gets thought of as "actually playing".
Which reminds me, if stock matches in Super Smash Bros. For aren't the default online, that's going to be annoying...

 

[sixteen-bit]

lmao I saw on twitter someone asking for SF4 3D edition Guile

 

[kirblar]

I don't know if that sequence of play is as likely as you make it sound, simply because getting into a ranked game is basically always quicker and easier than getting into a lobby. When the tournament standard is three button presses away, and the silly stuff is off to the side and takes more time to set up, there will be a majority of players that will play the "real game" instead of the goofy modes.
Really, I think that that is a reason why well-thought-out default settings are important even if there are lots of other options, because the default always gets thought of as "actually playing".
Which reminds me, if stock matches in Super Smash Bros. For aren't the default online, that's going to be annoying...

Timed is much better for the FFA mode though.

 

[Huw_Dawson]

The PC version will be modded to allow you to play the old versions online...

 

[casperOne]

Does anyone have a video link to Snake Eyez decimation? The twitch archives are just these huge 10 hour video chunks that are impossible to scrub for me since it has to load for a minute or so every time I jump ahead.

http://www.twitch.tv/leveluplive/b/507123623?t=7h46m56s

 

[ThatCrazyGuy]

I want TO's to at least test the waters with Editions Select and see how people feel about it. Maybe everybody uses Ultra at first, but slowly everybody switches to Edition Select because it's what most people prefer. Not saying it will happen, but at least give it a shot first. It should at the very least be a popular side game at tournaments. I'd enter with V-Seth, V-Ryu(love the way that sounds lol) or AE-Yun.

Hopefully it gets patched in the future to at least allow it in Endless.

Maybe I am in the minority, but I really hope they don't. Do it for team tournies or something.

Nobody wanted hyper SF 2, alpha anthology, darkstalkers version select tournies. They were just side things (to me). Fun little side things. This version of it in ultra is the same.

This. Isn't the same as an Ism selection.
hope they keep it of ranked

 

[SloaneRisette]

I've officially been given permission to use FGW in my final paper in a class. Especially when I was getting ragged on for my match with Justin.

 

[.la1n]

I was hoping for SF2 (Supers only, no Focus/EX) and SF3 (No Focus/Ultras, + Parries) modes as well, but this is just as good.

I had not thought of it but yes these modes would have been amazing.

 

[sixteen-bit]

hope they keep it of ranked

It's not available in any online mode

 

[enzo_gt]

Eventhubs putting SRK on blast for not crediting content.

Two points:

• I wish they (and other people) would get it through their heads that crediting an author for their work doesn't constitute proper licensing of the work (and that's the real issue here).
• The irony that it's EH making this claim is overwhelming.

why can't i

hold all of this irony

irony, I am drowning in it

 

[Marz]

Glad Edition Select is kept offline only.

I really don't want to have to filter a bunch of random lobbies when I'm trying to actually practice the game.

 

[casperOne]

irony, I am drowning in it

You and me both, brother.

 

[vocab]

Glad edition select isn't standard.

 

[MiniBossBattle]

I've officially been given permission to use FGW in my final paper in a class. Especially when I was getting ragged on for my match with Justin.

You can quote me;

Stay in school kids.

 

[biosnake20]

Eventhubs putting SRK on blast for not crediting content.

Two points:

• I wish they (and other people) would get it through their heads that crediting an author for their work doesn't constitute proper licensing of the work (and that's the real issue here).
• The irony that it's EH making this claim is overwhelming.

 

[Omega]

Maybe I am in the minority, but I really hope they don't. Do it for team tournies or something.

Nobody wanted hyper SF 2, alpha anthology, darkstalkers version select tournies. They were just side things (to me). Fun little side things. This version of it in ultra is the same.

This. Isn't the same as an Ism selection.
hope they keep it of ranked

funny because most tournament players were excited for this on twitter.

 

[sixteen-bit]

LOLOLOL
I've never seen this, it's amazing

Here's the video

I saw this live as it happened and I was bawling for 5+ minutes.

 

[Tik-Tok]

Hey casperOne I had an idea a while back that I thought might be up your alley. I call it "Fuck Subjective Tier Lists"

The idea is you take match results from every Top 32/16/8 of every major that has occurred since the beginning a particular version of a game, and you create tier lists based on the win percentages of each character vs the characters they fought against in that top 32.

You could get as granular as rounds won if you could find the results data and really see how it breaks down.

 

[DryEyeRelief]

Hey casperOne I had an idea a while back that I thought might be up your alley. I call it "Fuck Subjective Tier Lists"

The idea is you take match results from every Top 32/16/8 of every major that has occurred since the beginning a particular version of a game, and you create tier lists based on the win percentages of each character vs the characters they fought against in that top 32.

You could get as granular as rounds won if you could find the results data and really see how it breaks down.

rufus has no bad matchups

 

[Dahbomb]

Hey casperOne I had an idea a while back that I thought might be up your alley. I call it "Fuck Subjective Tier Lists"

The idea is you take match results from every Top 32/16/8 of every major that has occurred since the beginning a particular version of a game, and you create tier lists based on the win percentages of each character vs the characters they fought against in that top 32.

You could get as granular as rounds won if you could find the results data and really see how it breaks down.

Damn... Iron Fist to be High tier finally!

 

[casperOne]

Hey casperOne I had an idea a while back that I thought might be up your alley. I call it "Fuck Subjective Tier Lists"

I haven't read the rest of this post as I type this. Based on this sentence alone, I'd probably do anything at this point.

The idea is you take match results from every Top 32/16/8 of every major that has occurred since the beginning a particular version of a game, and you create tier lists based on the win percentages of each character vs the characters they fought against in that top 32.

You could get as granular as rounds won if you could find the results data and really see how it breaks down.

That would be pretty easy. SRK said that the data from their system was going to be open source, EH is in a tizzy over it.

Other than that, where would we get the Japanese tournament results? I'd think they'd be just as important for some games. The data for those isn't as abundant as the American tournaments.

 

[Tik-Tok]

I haven't read the rest of this post as I type this. Based on this sentence alone, I'd probably do anything at this point.



That would be pretty easy. SRK said that the data from their system was going to be open source, EH is in a tizzy over it.

Other than that, where would we get the Japanese tournament results? I'd think they'd be just as important for some games. The data for those isn't as abundant as the American tournaments.

If you build it they will come?
Maybe once people see something like this in place they'd be happy to submit tournament results. Those results would of course have to be verified somehow to make sure assholes don't troll, but I don't think that's too difficult of a problem.

 

[JDdelphin]

People will not be able to use it ONLINE! Guys it's just a fun feature to have fun with old dudes like us, not something to be taken seriouly, what would be the point to balance the shit out of Ultra if you'll let people fight with AE Yun, Vanilla Sagat and AE2012 Cammy?!

Side tournaments will never be so fun

Exactly.

This makes it officially the 'ten more years to infinity and beyond' version

It's an option for the elderly to gather around the front porch cracker barrel and have a good old time while those young whippersnappers play super street fighter 5 and animu fister.
Back in my day we knew risk vs. reward....

 

[Tik-Tok]

Exactly.

This makes it officially the 'ten more years to infinity and beyond' version

It's an option for the elderly to gather around the front porch cracker barrel and have a good old time while those young whippersnappers play super street fighter 5 and animu fister.
Back in my day we knew risk vs. reward....

Man whatever.... you just don't GET Animu Fister old maaaaaaaan.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

lmao I saw on twitter someone asking for SF4 3D edition Guile

setting up the capcom-unity thread requesting SF4 Volt Edition

 

[biosnake20]

SSF4AE2012: Kuroda(ryu) Vs. MOV(ryu) in a long set

 

[NEO0MJ]

lmao I saw on twitter someone asking for SF4 3D edition Guile

Oh god, how broken would that character be?

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

This is anime, the majority of Koko players will cry and switch or just drop the game.

I can understand having a negative reaction if your focus is entirely on having the best chance to win. I think everyone who chose Kokonoe knew that at some point she would be seeing some changes in the next patch so I expect some players to stay with her.

Personally I'd prefer to win with a character that I like versus one chosen from a tier list.

If it's a character that happens to rank low then it would be even more hype if I ended up winning.

 

[sixteen-bit]

SSF4AE2012: Kuroda(ryu) Vs. MOV(ryu) in a long set

Does Kuroda play a lot of SF4? I know he's renown for the 3S play, but I don't see his name often with SF4 games.

 

[Karsticles]

Hey casperOne I had an idea a while back that I thought might be up your alley. I call it "Fuck Subjective Tier Lists"

The idea is you take match results from every Top 32/16/8 of every major that has occurred since the beginning a particular version of a game, and you create tier lists based on the win percentages of each character vs the characters they fought against in that top 32.

You could get as granular as rounds won if you could find the results data and really see how it breaks down.

The problem with this is it would be a "What Top Players Pick" listing instead of a tier listing. It only works in a theoretical world where everyone is of roughly the same skill level.

 

[QisTopTier]

reload eddie vs slash ky = the best