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[TheJollyCorner]

Toriyama is too busy building a real Lightning (ala robot Scarjo) to worry about silly things like games!

 

[.JayZii]

Who else's ready for XVI? I know Tabatha is.

The execution was who's ?

I ruined the game for me. If Nomura thought it was ok the way it was implemented in the final game,then he fucked up.

And the truth will set you free.

 

[DylanEno]

For all the people clamoring for Stella Nox Fleuret in some form, I'm not sure you really want Tabata and his team to have a go at her character

Is this for real? They actually said that?

Jfc

 

[Dark_castle]

I would like to straight up clarify a few things to those of you bashing Nomura for not being able to deliver FFvXIII because he was incompetent.
The truth is, no, he is not incompetent. He’s one of the most capable game developer/director in Japan aside Kojima. Japanese are not very creative enough to think outside of the box, I’ll give you that. But Nomura actually had the lore of Eos/crystal/versus concepts completed by early 2008 and he has been working on the plot points since 2002/2003. He even carries around with him a small book where he writes all his ideas in (these infos were from a personal source of mine, take it with a grain of salt if you want). I’m not sure if these were actually scripts but they are more like ‘story treatments that were ready to be transcripted into a screenplay in film making’. By then, he also had an idea on how the gameplay would look like (i.e KH style with character switching), the only problem was, he didn’t have a team to complete the rest. The Fabula Nova Crystallis borrowed elements derived from Nomura’s lore, because the other writers couldn’t come up with better concepts?.

So, no, Stella was not the character that were only concepts. She already had a story to begin with, a complete one in fact but it was never fully realized into a game. Because of the changing direction of SE management (they changed the President), a lot of things from the original concept of FFvXIII had to change; some of the reasons were (not a complete list);

1) Wider/more global target market: Things like worshipping reapers/yakuza family /dark mythos had to be cut out to make the game more acceptable. It wouldn’t pass China or Australia’s requisites for example. This global release was also the reason why FFXV gets a very slow/delayed release. Had they released for Japan only first, we’ll probably be getting it 6 months earlier. Apparently, localization for other countries and their ridiculous legal issues are hampering speedy progress. You can’t expect the world to work like Japan (his description). Same reason why they can’t make more of the UCE. He (my source) originally predicted that the game will only be ready for 2017, but Tabata was being too ambitious and gave that 2016 release date.

2) Luminous engine: The engine could not handle the game’s design. It was too complicated? (I’m not sure myself, because I didn’t understand what he meant about game and engine)

3) Development time cut short: I don’t understand the whole reason behind this, but apparently, they want the game cut short for financial reasons. The original concept was to have 3 games a least from FFvXIII but it was taking too long and costs too much, so they want to compress it by just one and save money.

So to those who bashed Nomura, I didn’t think it was fair. He didn’t ‘get off easy’ on this by handing the reigns for Tabata to complete. I feel Nomura’s pain more than any stress Tabata had to endure. Imagine having something you’ve been working on for 10 years taken away from you….. Plus, Nomura has stated that Noctis was his ‘new boy’. Now, he only has Sora……

The dark history of Versus XIII can't be solely assigned blame to Nomura, as we know at that time Square Enix had him do character design work for like a million other games, and not to mention there's a trainwreck of the original XIV, which in turn also results in two XIII sequels. The game just keep getting pushed down the priority ladder until it totally faded into background for quite a while, hidden from the public.

It's becoming apparent that Nomura really cares about Versus XIII and would have loved to create the game and see it to the release when he said he's harnessing his burning anger into KH3.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

 

[BlueTsunami]

Versus XIII was a bunch of promises and cool trailers that came out before Obama was even elected. It's easy to put it on a pedestal, when we came no where close to even seeing a playable version. XV is burdened with the fact that it's an actual game, and Versus XIII is the idea of one.

Awesome post. It became quite apparent when the actual mechanics were put into place the game could barely it hold together. Although it seems like its coming down to a creator who is a visionary and one who's an engineer. This game seems to have bounced wildly in either direction.

 

[Setsu00]

The dark history of Versus XIII can't be solely assigned blame to Nomura, as we know at that time Square Enix had him do character design work for like a million other games, and not to mention there's a trainwreck of the original XIV, which in turn also results in two XIII sequels. The game just keep getting pushed down the priority ladder until it totally faded into background for quite a while, hidden from the public.

It's becoming apparent that Nomura really cares about Versus XIII and would have loved to create the game and see it to the release when he said he's harnessing his burning anger into KH3.

I'm not sure if Nomura's "burning anger" was the result of him getting fired from XV, but I fully believe that Nomura wanted to deliver this project. The way he talked about Versus XIII and the early XV always felt like it would be the game he always wanted to make.

I can't wait to hear what Tabata will say about XV's development once all is said and done. They can't really admit more than they already did that XV is creatively compromised and it's neither the game that Nomura nor Tabata would have made if they had free reign.

 

[HerroRygar]

They've been hiring for something non-14 for a while now.

And we know that it's not the XII remaster?

 

[Ran rp]

 

[Dark_castle]

I'm not sure if Nomura's "burning anger" was the result of him getting fired from XV, but I fully believe that Nomura wanted to deliver this project. The way he talked about Versus XIII and the early XV always felt like it would be the game he always wanted to make.

I can't wait to hear what Tabata will say about XV's development once all is said and done. They can't really admit more than they already did that XV is creatively compromised and it's neither the game that Nomura nor Tabata would have made if they had free reign.

Indeed. Some people called the current FFXV a "frakengame", and as harsh as it sounds, I think that's a right word to describe the game. It's really the frankenstein of video games, when one look at its deep history and the development cycle for it, all the changes in not just the game itself but the staff members, including the game director and scenario writer, and the game having various technical issues with its supposedly master version that were due for release but getting rightfully delayed to fix them.

In the end, it's certainly possible FFXV could overcome all odds and turn out to be a decent game, or even more than that, but it's a slippery slope for the game until its release, and the culmination of this entire, surreal journey will occur in the glorious review thread.

 

[Garlador]

I want to play FF7 but I kinda want FF7R to be my first experience. Hopefully the first episode releases within a year or two.

I would probably suggest FF7 just to get some great perspective on the remake, and also because the remake is going to be going in a different direction for certain characters and storylines, so it'll give you a nice reference point.

 

[Ran rp]

I would probably suggest FF7 just to get some great perspective on the remake, and also because the remake is going to be going in a different direction for certain characters and storylines, so it'll give you a nice reference point.

You're right. FF7 it is.

 

[qualitydisc]

Now, Luna pretty much has the same facial structure as New Stella:

So you could say Nomura's waifu ran away with Tabata, changed her hair and took on a new name. Maybe that's the reason for Nomura's departure and why there's zero communication between the FFXV team and Nomura anymore

There's a scene early in Kingsglaive where

Spoiler

Luna wears star-shaped earrings.

Which I thought was a complete troll.

Besides, we got Versus (this is just one of the apparently many nods to the old trailers):

Kingsglaive has enough Versus references to make a super-intoxicating drinking game.

 

[Kagari]

And we know that it's not the XII remaster?

Based on what they were hiring for, probably not.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Save us FFversusVIIRemake!

 

[Inuhanyou]

Save us FFversusVIIRemake!

You joke, but that's really what FF7R seems like to me. A reinvention of a lot of Versus 13 concepts Nomura always wanted to do, repurposed for this remake, like the individual character control ect

 

[Lime]

Based on what they were hiring for, probably not.

Multiplayer or singleplayer or both?

 

[caffeware]

Don't worry people, by the year 2036 some hacker will have the original ffvxiii source material and will remake it for the ps3.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

You joke, but that's really what FF7R seems like to me. A reinvention of a lot of Versus 13 concepts Nomura always wanted to do, repurposed for this remake, like the individual character control ect

I think that the particular element of individual character switching would have been a staple of the remake regardless of recent history.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

I hope Nomura does a BloodBorne from VersusXIII once he's done with FF7r. A new IP that's practically versus without the characters. Unless FF7r turns out to be a huge success a SE just says "fuck it remake Versus"

 

[Ydelnae]

I hope Nomura does a BloodBorne from VersusXIII once he's done with FF7r. A new IP that's practically versus without the characters. Unless FF7r turns out to be a huge success a SE just says "fuck it remake Versus"

So you want Final Fantasy XV with another name...?

 

[xxdoshiyarovexx]

Everything we sort of knew about Versus XIII

- Main character: Noctis Lucis Caelum (Still in XV)
- Main female character: Stella Nox Fleuret (Sort of not in XV, sort of)
- 3 party members that were best friends with the main (Still in XV)
- King Regis (Still in XV, but now he doesn't wear a suit and has a derpy face)
- Game starts in Insomnia with a full blown invasion. Similar to the opening of FFVII. (Not in XV, but this was reworked into Kingsglaive)
- A fantasy based on Reality (Still in XV)
- Noctis's royal family was based off the Yakuza (not in XV)
- Insomnia worship death (not in XV)
- A Venice style city (Still in XV)
- Niflhiem are the main baddies (Still in XV)
- KH combat (not in XV, but still not turn based)
- Controllable party members (not In XV)
- Noctis can see someone's death or their soul expire or some shit like that (Still in XV)
- Noctis eyes turn red (Still in XV)
- Noctis and crew wearing Roen clothing (Still in XV)
- Engine blade (Still in XV)
- Warping (Still in XV)
- Dark tone (Not in XV as far as we know)
- Road trip theme (Still in XV)
- Awesome trailers (Not in XV)

-Cor (Still in XV)
-Ravus (Still in XV)
-Ideolas (Still in XV)
-Aranea (Still in XV)
-Etro (Still in XV)
-All 5 main cities (Still in XV)
-Niflheim ship designs (Still in XV)
-Niflheim solider designs (Still in XV)
-Weapon summoning ability (Still in XV)
-Empty world map and desserts from old gameplay trailers (Still in XV)
-Gas stations (Still in XV)
-Noctis sleeping (Still in XV)
-Everyone wearing black (Still in XV)
-The Ring (Still in XV)

(From E3 2013 Re-branding trailer)
-Black haired waifu- Gentiana (Still in)
-Ardyn (Still in)
-Iron Giant/Behemoth/other monsters (Still in)
-Leviathan (Still in)
-Child Stella's spirit (Still in, child Luna wears the same dress)

Scientifically from an artist's perspective why FFXV's dark tone seems 'gone': FFXV has 90% the same assets, themes, characters and world of what we knew of VERSUS. 98% of Versus trailers were insomnia shown at nighttime/dusk (Lots of dark blues and blacks). It 'seems' gone, because these exact same themes, characters, cities (insomnia), and assets are also now presented during the daytime in all the current trailers (and Omnis Lacrima is not playing all the time)

If FFXV follows it's plot of the night getting longer and the world becomes completely enveloped in darkness. The dark tone will be full force in combination with the already dark themed plot points that have been presented and held intact. It's color theory doing it's intended work on the psyche. That's all it is.

<3

 

[Kagari]

Multiplayer or singleplayer or both?

I don't recall any of it mentioning multiplayer.

You joke, but that's really what FF7R seems like to me. A reinvention of a lot of Versus 13 concepts Nomura always wanted to do, repurposed for this remake, like the individual character control ect

Yeah FF7R seems to have inherited the "soul" of Versus in a lot of ways.

 

[Setsu00]

-Cor (Still in XV)
-Ravus (Still in XV)
-Ideolas (Still in XV)
-Aranea (Still in XV)
-Etro (Still in XV)
-All 5 main cities (Still in XV)
-Niflheim ship designs (Still in XV)
-Niflheim solider designs (Still in XV)
-Weapon summoning ability (Still in XV)
-Empty world map and desserts from old gameplay trailers (Still in XV)
-Gas stations (Still in XV)
-Noctis sleeping (Still in XV)
-Everyone wearing black (Still in XV)
-The Ring (Still in XV)

(From E3 2013 Re-branding trailer)
-Black haired waifu- Gentiana (Still in)
-Ardyn (Still in)
-Iron Giant/Behemoth/other monsters (Still in)
-Leviathan (Still in)
-Child Stella's spirit (Still in, child Luna wears the same dress)

Scientifically from an artist's perspective why FFXV's dark tone seems 'gone': FFXV has 90% the same assets, themes, characters and world of what we knew of VERSUS. 98% of Versus trailers were insomnia shown at nighttime/dusk (Lots of dark blues and blacks). It 'seems' gone, because these exact same themes, characters, cities (insomnia), and assets are also now presented during the daytime in all the current trailers (and Omnis Lacrima is not playing all the time)

If FFXV follows it's plot of the night getting longer and the world becomes completely enveloped in darkness. The dark tone will be full force in combination with the already dark themed plot points that have been presented and held intact. It's color theory doing it's intended work on the psyche. That's all it is.

<3

Cor's role was apparently decreased. He doesn't even appear in the game's promotional art anymore even though he was presented as a part of the main cast durin the E3 2013 re-reveal. The designs for Ravus and Aranea are still in, but at the very least we know that Arenea was originally a normal enemy without a bigger role as confirmed by Nomura in 2011. Iedolas had a name change since E3 2013 and was originally called Idola according to the banners in Insomnia. Etro was cut as XV is no longer a part of the Fabula Nova Crystallis and the painting that depicted Etro was moved into a fish tank. We have no idea if all five main cities are in. Solheim for example wasn't even mentioned anymore since its reveal in 2013. Insomnia's art direction was also heavily modified to look less like Tokyo.

Also, it's not just color psychology. We did see some footage of Versus XIII during daytime and even then it had a decidedly different tone. Just watch the scene with Noctis and Prompto as they look at the ruined street. There's also the scene of Noctis driving to the party during sunset. Versus XIII was dark, but it was also melancholic and this melancholy is completely gone from what we've seen of XV. The change from Versus XIII to XV is massive and most of the stuff they kept is of cosmetic nature.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

So you want Final Fantasy XV with another name...?

A bloodborne approach

 

[NateDog]

Nomura doesn't write, he's sort of this spiritual guru who has everything in his head and then Nojima writes it all down on paper. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

The way the guy in charge of the Osaka team (I forgot his name lol) explains it he just sort of appears to them once a week via skype or something, says his piece (everything cryptic and weird of course), and it's up to the team to figure out what the fuck was all that lololol

I need to see this. Link?

 

[DKHF]

I need to see this. Link?

Assuming he's not just trolling most of what he said is false and/or conflating various things. IIRC Yasue's never talked about him "appearing to them once a week via Skype". Nomura regularly visits the Osaka team and has huge input into the gameplay of the KH games and the only thing he sometimes doesn't tell the KH dev team is certain tidbits about the KH story because he has heaps of ideas in his head for the series.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I need to see this. Link?

Tai yasue is in Osaka, Nomura is in Tokyo. Nomura only generally oversees KH3 and gives directorial instructions to Tai Yasue on what to implement, what to keep, what to cut ect, Tai Yasue is the day to day guy who directly coordinates the development staff on the project.

So generally speaking, Nomura shows up periodically to check on progress and make sure development is continuing on track, and making designs and different implementations of the game design, Tai Yasue said.

 

[badcrumble]

Yeah FF7R seems to have inherited the "soul" of Versus in a lot of ways.

I'm extremely alright with that as it absolutely does not include actually having to aim your guns, lol. Easily the worst idea from the original Versus concept.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I'm extremely alright with that as it absolutely does not include actually having to aim your guns, lol. Easily the worst idea from the original Versus concept.

Why? Since it was real time, it would play just like any other shooter

 

[Death Penalty]

So you want Final Fantasy XV with another name...?

Versus XIII and XV are not the same thing.

 

[HeelPower]

Yeah FF7R seems to have inherited the "soul" of Versus in a lot of ways.

That's what I am holding out hope for.

FF7R is the kind of property that can bring out these ideas really well(though I always hoped it would be something completely new)

And the truth will set you free.

But..it sucked!

 

[Frumix]

Yeah FF7R seems to have inherited the "soul" of Versus in a lot of ways.

Being an ambitious multi-parter and never getting done? Oh gee I hope not.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

Being an ambitious multi-parter and never getting done? Oh gee I hope not.

We'll see about that.

 

[Nags]

Hey I liked the way Versus looked too, but this is the weirdest thing to get hung up on.

 

[The Emperor]

Scientifically from an artist's perspective why FFXV's dark tone seems 'gone': FFXV has 90% the same assets, themes, characters and world of what we knew of VERSUS. 98% of Versus trailers were insomnia shown at nighttime/dusk (Lots of dark blues and blacks). It 'seems' gone, because these exact same themes, characters, cities (insomnia), and assets are also now presented during the daytime in all the current trailers (and Omnis Lacrima is not playing all the time)

If FFXV follows it's plot of the night getting longer and the world becomes completely enveloped in darkness. The dark tone will be full force in combination with the already dark themed plot points that have been presented and held intact. It's color theory doing it's intended work on the psyche. That's all it is.

<3

*CLAPS*

Have felt this for years.

Whilst there has been a slight change in the way post 2013 XV is presented, I still feel the 'darkness' most people claimed versus had was purely due to not enough footage from the game. It was all just a dream...

And I never ever bought the whole 'this will be the darkest FF' crap Nomura kept spewing. KH shows me he is anything but subtle at storytelling or capable of producing a 'dark mature tale'.

If it was Matsuno saying this I'd be really excited. But Nomura? lol I mean I'd wish him the best but would just not be expecting any delivery on it.

 

[xxdoshiyarovexx]

Cor's role was apparently decreased. He doesn't even appear in the game's promotional art anymore even though he was presented as a part of the main cast durin the E3 2013 re-reveal. The designs for Ravus and Aranea are still in, but at the very least we know that Arenea was originally a normal enemy without a bigger role as confirmed by Nomura in 2011. Iedolas had a name change since E3 2013 and was originally called Idola according to the banners in Insomnia. Etro was cut as XV is no longer a part of the Fabula Nova Crystallis and the painting that depicted Etro was moved into a fish tank. We have no idea if all five main cities are in. Solheim for example wasn't even mentioned anymore since its reveal in 2013. Insomnia's art direction was also heavily modified to look less like Tokyo.

Also, it's not just color psychology. We did see some footage of Versus XIII during daytime and even then it had a decidedly different tone. Just watch the scene with Noctis and Prompto as they look at the ruined street. There's also the scene of Noctis driving to the party during sunset. Versus XIII was dark, but it was also melancholic and this melancholy is completely gone from what we've seen of XV. The change from Versus XIII to XV is massive and most of the stuff they kept is of cosmetic nature.

Yes things are different, because they are different games. We know this. The point is the amount that's still intact outweighs what not, based on the VERSUS 13 trailers. Yeah and all of this is cosmetic because a lot of things we saw in Versus 13 trailers never had actual facts or context, and were mostly things people made up to fill in that gap. Or some vague information from Nomura. So does it really matter that Cor's original role we will never know is played back a little????

Cor is still a badass and a guest party member like he was in Versus. Solheim was mentioned in a gamescom phamplet from like a week ago. The Etro painting still exists even if it's not Etro, whatever. Whatever on Ideolas's VERSUS name but his outfit and model hasn't changed and he's still Niflheims top dog. Aranea was a mini boss in Versus 13, and she seems to be the exact same thing in FFXV. I've seen the scene of them a million times, pre-rendered versus cutscenes are irrelevant to me in terms of information at this point.

I felt Insomnia in Kingsglaive looked similar enough where it didn't bother me, Versus, once again was shown 98% at nighttime and had more reaper worship motifs probably (Things like the throne are definitely different and some details on inner buildings)

The colors are slightly different, but like, main themes cosmetically and story wise are like still some what intact.

After seeing Kingsglaive I don't question the level of loyalty FFXV holds to Versus. This is similar to how people were saying this game wasn't a final fantasy when everything in this game is re-envisioned versions of things from the older ones. Just gotta look closer.

 

[Koozek]

*CLAPS*

Have felt this for years.

Whilst there has been a slight change in the way post 2013 XV is presented, I still feel the 'darkness' most people claimed versus had was purely due to not enough footage from the game. It was all just a dream...

And I never ever bought the whole 'this will be the darkest FF' crap Nomura kept spewing. KH shows me he is anything but subtle at storytelling or capable of producing a 'dark mature tale'.

If it was Matsuno saying this I'd be really excited. But Nomura? lol I mean I'd wish him the best but would just not be expecting any delivery on it.

Dito.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

Hey I liked the way Versus looked too, but this is the weirdest thing to get hung up on.

It's two different games entirely, so after waiting all those years people are getting Tabata's interpretation of Versus.

People wouldn't have a beef if he just followed the original guidelines or at least had the decency to consult with Nomura on what to do. Either way I'm there day-0 but deep down everyone knows what the deal is.

 

[HeelPower]

If FFXV follows it's plot of the night getting longer and the world becomes completely enveloped in darkness. The dark tone will be full force in combination with the already dark themed plot points that have been presented and held intact. It's color theory doing it's intended work on the psyche. That's all it is.

<3

I really wouldn't count on it at all.

The tone's different because the story direction changed and the art direction changed.Their similarities are surface level at best.

Even the scenes shown in Night time have a very different feel to them in the current game.

Its just very different.

 

[.JayZii]

*CLAPS*

Have felt this for years.

Whilst there has been a slight change in the way post 2013 XV is presented, I still feel the 'darkness' most people claimed versus had was purely due to not enough footage from the game. It was all just a dream...

And I never ever bought the whole 'this will be the darkest FF' crap Nomura kept spewing. KH shows me he is anything but subtle at storytelling or capable of producing a 'dark mature tale'.

If it was Matsuno saying this I'd be really excited. But Nomura? lol I mean I'd wish him the best but would just not be expecting any delivery on it.

You say that, but what if everyone's names were anagrams? Pretty cerebral.

 

[Ran rp]

The colors are slightly different, but like, main themes cosmetically and story wise are like still some what intact.

you think the colors in these examples are "slightly" different?

ok lol

why are people still so obsessed with Lightning she's never coming baSTELLA, GODDESS MY LOVE

 

[timshundo]

why are people still so obsessed with Lightning she's never coming baSTELLA, GODDESS MY LOVE

 

[Inuhanyou]

They have used assets of Versus 13 for FF15, that was the entire point of using Versus as a numbered title, so they would not have wasted all those assets the Versus team created and would keep some semblance of Versus 13 not having been canceled.

But Versus is NOT 15, let us be clear about that.

The creative direction is different, the team is different the people helming it are different, and as Tabata himself said, the circumstances are entirely different in regards to how he approached things.

Let's stop shitting on Versus 13 while at the same time trying to pretend like they are the same game.

FF15 is its own project at this point and should be looked at in that context.

why are people still so obsessed with Lightning she's never coming baSTELLA, GODDESS MY LOVE

Lightning had 3 games and still has less personality and character than Stella did with the few assets we had of her. That's sad. But it also illustrates a certain point: first impressions are hard to erase

 

[Ran rp]

all of the versus nods i've seen so far have been lame tbh

 

[Inuhanyou]

.

 

[HeelPower]

The most unique thing about Stella was her seeming opposition and independence from Noctis(while sharing a past together)

It seemed like a totally new idea for FF and the way it was shown to us was ridiculously cool,charismatic and flat out badass.

Luna is the "strong summoner" archtype.Already been done in FF9 and ,imo,perfected in FF10.

 

[Zoe]

The most unique thing about Stella was her seeming opposition and independence from Noctis(while sharing a past together)

It seemed like a totally new idea for FF and the way it was shown to us was ridiculously cool,charismatic and flat out badass.

Except when she opened her mouth she was completely submissive to Noctis.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

Let's keep the dream alive I mean FF7r happened

 

[HeelPower]

Except when she opened her mouth she was completely submissive to Noctis.

lol what ?

when ? XD